Transferring late in the game, tell me what you think

Transfer Students
1

<p>Hi everyone. This is going to be a bit lengthy (so if you want to tune out and jump to the bottom where I just list my stats, feel free).</p>

<p>Currently, I'm a student in my -second year- of studies at a public liberal arts university in the pacific northwest. I have slowly come to the somewhat unpleasant realization that my school is pretty much bottom of the barrel abysmal: everyone here is nice, the professors are all nice - but the level of academic challenge is ZERO. Every class I've taken has either been extraordinarily easy, or "challenging" only in the banal sense of requiring a lot of study. (Voluminous subjects are voluminous no matter you go to school, and I'm a bit dismayed to think that the only challenging courses I've faced in college are challenging simply because I had to do a lot of reading and note-taking).</p>

<p>Alongside this is the fact that many of my fellow students have come to class with little desire to really learn or think about anything. Whenever I try taking an interesting class (like Philosophy of Science and Religion) I find that 98% of my classmates are taking it because it "seemed easy" and was "part of graduation requirements," not because they had any genuine interest. (Indeed, the philosophy professor - we only have one full time - admitted to me that pretty much nobody would take philosophy courses at my school if they couldn't be used to fulfill degree requirements.)</p>

<p>I can list other things, but in short, I have slowly developed a very bad taste in my mouth. An honest exposition of my desires: I want more than anything to go to a school where (ignoring the clich</p>

2

<p>You may already have too many credits for a transfer to the type of LAC's you are considering. I'd suggest you check into that first.</p>

<p>I can certainly understand your desire for intellectual challenge. But you may need to find it elsewhere than in a college classroom.</p>

<p>If the schools of interest to you do take transfers after your number of semesters, you certainly have valid reasons for wanting to do so.</p>

3

<p>Your best bet for making a successful transfer at this point may come by changing your major field. Another option would be to choose an LAC or two and write to them and ask about the possibility of spending a "guest semester" or "guest year" on their campus.</p>

<p>Good luck!</p>

4

<p>I know, I'm bloated on credits, most of which were in classes that didn't really do much for me but show me what humans currently know and give me an A. It feels kind of like eating a cork sandwich.</p>

<p>What instigated my desire to transfer was the fact that I couldn't major in any of the fields that had really begun to interest me since transferring to my university: philosophy, neuroscience/cognitive science and biophysics. There is hardly a drop of any of that at my school - absolutely zero research in any of it, and very little interest (there isn't even a philosophy minor). So if I transferred, it would be in to a new major, one that I want but I can't get at all at my present school.</p>

<p>I would be hand waving at whatever schools I try to get into, saying "Look, I promise, all these credits aren't weighing me down. I'm as fresh as ever." It seems I am trying to balance looking like I'm too knowledgeable and still looking like a sharp student.</p>

<p>I don't know what LACs what be empathetic. I've looked at a lot of transfer pages on a lot of schools, and ditched all the ones that bothered me (IE, Northwestern obviously won't take me, even though a prof. of mine said she'd write me a rec for Northwestern, her alma mater).</p>

<p>The world, of course, is filled with intellectual experiences and challenges beyond college, and even then there is far more to life than the life of the mind. If everywhere I look at looks back at me scowling, my life will still have meaning. But it's hard to express how much going to a good school would mean to me.</p>

<p>I know I could spend a guest semester on a few campuses. That might be best. But I already sat in on a few courses with a friend of mine, who goes to Reed (a wonderful coming-of-age friendship story: he went to Reed, I went to CC). It was absolutely exhilarating. Completely different than anything I had experienced in college. I am not sure which would be more torture for the end of my life - not knowing at all what a powerful liberal arts undergrad experience looks like, or having tasted it briefly for a semester and then returned to the tedium of a mediocre education at a factory of our nation's work force training system.</p>

<p>Is it better to have loved and lost...?</p>

5

<p>Do you have unlimited funds? </p>

<p>I'm confused about why you don't think grad school would provide the challenge you're looking for?</p>

6

<p>That's a complex question with a complex answer, but the short and awkward explanation is that graduate schools emphasize a particular discipline, and further emphasize very specific research in that particular discipline. To go to grad school I think I'll need to know more than what I'm interested in, but rather what I'm passionately interested in, enough to dedicate the time and energy that dedication takes. I don't think I'm ready for grad school.</p>

<p>I feel - and of course this is a gamble - that what I want and need is uniquely offered by the undergraduate experience. Yes, grad school is intellectually challenging and stimulating, but not in the way I want right now. If this sounds childish, then what I'm about to say will sound even more so... but I don't really think I could get into any grad school I'd be interested in anyway, coming from my school.</p>

<p>As for the funds: yes, that's the biggest thing in my way. I have zero debt so far, so I'm not really worried about adding to existing debt. But I recognize the size of the cost of going to another school, especially a private LAC. The fact that good education in the U.S. costs so much and is often so out of reach for students is one of supremely sad facts of our nation. In face of it and the economic crisis, I honestly wish that (like most of my classmates) I didn't give a damn about how great an education I get, just that I get one and can then enter the job market as "college educated."</p>

<p>When I graduated high school, I lived in Mexico for a few months and returned quite certain in my feeling that you can be sharp and happy and intellectual and driven in any educational setting; that the whole deal is mainly a matter of personal perseverance. I entered CC and a public school with that philosophy in mind. And it may be true... but I've learned that eager minds grow even more when they're in proximity, when they're nurtured and encouraged to grow, not merely praised for being more academically nimble than what an English professor of mine once called the "sea of baseball caps."</p>

<p>Sorry if I'm being too wordy. I think I'm still trying to explain this all to myself.</p>

7

<p>I think you're on the right path in terms of fully explaining this to yourself. In all honesty, I think you are perhaps unrealistic about what you would get at another school and what grad school is about.Mostly because Harvard was so built up in their heads that the reality would have to be a let down. </p>

<p>While some find wonderful, broad learning environments at all sorts of schools most never do. The ideal you have in mind is unlikely to happen if you drop down into a LAC for a year.</p>

<p>Undergrad is just about done for you and it's time to figure out what you want to do in the real world and seek the next chapter in terms of education/internships/jobs that will get you to where you want to be.</p>

8

<p>Ok, I saw your last post where you somewhat acknowledged this, but I still have to put in my 2 cents:</p>

<p>I think it's going to be hard for a lot of us to fully relate to your situation. There are many students out there who are as passionate about learning as you are, but they also have to worry about things like limited funds, debt, and graduating ASAP so that they can attempt to get a job and support themselves and their families in this dismal economy. When you have all those things to worry about, it's not that you "don't give a damn" about how great an education you get, it's that suddenly it feels like a blessing that you are able to further your education at all. On the contrary to not giving a damn, it further motivates you to learn all you can about the field you've chosen, working your ass off with as many resources as you can find despite the fact that you might not have the best professors in the world at your disposal.</p>

<p>It doesn't seem you're in that type of situation though, at least not right now, so maybe you should go ahead and transfer if it will make you happy.</p>

9

<p>Through the last year of high school and the first few weeks of community college, I was homeless and lived in my car. In between high school and CC, I lived in Mexico for six months with families who saw university either as a useless frivolity or, more frequently and sadly, as a distant impossibility - for economic reasons. And I returned feeling that although I wanted to go to college and learn, it didn't matter where I went. All schools were the same, so long as I saved money. (I reacted to the fact that many of the people I became friends with in Mexico could not ever spare the time or money to go to college at all. And I was disgusted with what I saw as US education's expensive elitism).</p>

<p>I'm now struggling with the same questions that pushed me toward my current school and my entire educational experience. I chose CC and a cheap public school to save money. Now I'm contemplating spending an extraordinary amount of money, indebting myself potentially forever, just for the pleasure of learning where learning is taken seriously. My desire to transfer, to some degree, represents an overthrowing of all my previous beliefs and biases. I'm now going to spend money (so much money that if I spent it in other ways, I could probably explicitly save human lives with it) just for the "selfish" hunger for a meaningful education.</p>

<p>I suppose the question I'm ultimately asking is: What is the worth of a US college education? Are the tier schools of our country, besides research, doing any good creating citizenry that will help the world? Are all the schools the same? How can we measure the value of an education?</p>

10

<p>Yes, transferring to a different school will definitely make you realize what you want to do with your life. Like, definitely.</p>

11

<p>I get it, and I hardly think life's great mysteries are going to unravel or the perfect career for me will suddenly appear. </p>

<p>Does college have anything at all with helping people decide what they want to do with their life? With what they want to do after college? Does this discovery have anything to do with the college you've gone to, the opportunities you've found there?</p>

<p>(Or do you just know what you want to do, no matter where you go or what you do?)</p>

12

<p>Very few people are blessed with knowledge of what they want to do and what they are good at. Those people achieve great things in life. Mere mortals, in contrast, should simply strive to excel in whatever they happen to do in and past college. Some people, at some point in their lives, do realize that what they are doing is not for them. But then the tricky part is making a dignified transition that underlines your accomplishments instead of jumping ship which looks bad and makes things even worse.</p>

13

<p>I think you need help finding answers but that you may be looking in the wrong place. It is very normal to go through college, graduate and not be sure what to do. But it's most probably time to look forward, not backwards trying to redo what's been done.</p>

<p>How about really working with career services at your school to see if you can find a job you will enjoy/ You can take great classes at many night schools/extension programs to continue your education. All of this should help you see many life paths which may or may not include further education.</p>

14

<p>are you in your 4th year of college? how many credits do you have? if you have the number of credits that we're all assuming you do, transferring is out of the question</p>

<p>i'll be honest, because i think its what you want</p>

<p>if you are in fact close to having the number of crdits needed for graduation, you really need to get over the fact that you are not in an enviornment as intellectually challenging as you want...you are not going to be able to rewind time and do it over again, you are where you are and you are going to have to live with the fact your undergrad experience was not what you wanted...it seems that you are really being blinded by this fact, saying that you want to graduate "2-3 years down the line." how do you anticipate this happenining if your almost at graduation? even if you were accepted, you would be done within a semester</p>

<p>grad school certainly looks like the most attractive option if i were you...i would certainly reconsider your take on this...with your grades there is no reason you cant get into a great grad program...challenging classes, passionate students...if these are really the main reasons you want to transfer, im still unsure of what your disdain for grad school is at this point in your life</p>

<p>remember</p>

<p>your lifelong quest for knowledge need not start nor end at the university...some of the smartest people that i know never took a class past high school...there are plenty of ways to challenge and enrich yourself outside of school</p>

<p>gl</p>

15

<p>Hi again - </p>

<p>I know I'd be nearly done with my degree (physics) but I honestly want to change majors, so at least in that regard I wouldn't be nearly done.</p>

<p>I'm don't think I'm "not sure what to do." I'm not worried about finding a job.</p>

<p>I am worried about graduate school. High GPA at a school that doesn't challenge and is not well regarded... what good is that? My school hasn't gotten anyone into any grad schools they've WANTED to go to for some time.</p>

<p>I'll admit that is a secondary consideration to what I'm worried about. It sounds like most people here are suggesting that grad school etc. is more important than a quality undergrad experience - so in that mindset, I should look onward to grad school. But I'm deeply concerned about my standing here. I may be the near the top of my class, but (at least GPA-wise, to not complicate things) I'm that clich</p>

16

<p>parisha -</p>

<p>Back when I was doing my second batch of undergraduate work (I enrolled at my home-state public to pick up the credits in a new field before going to grad school in that field), there was a descriptive term which may just apply to you: Senior Clutch. This expression was used in reference to students who looked for ways to extend their undergraduate time by changing majors, students who panicked that they hadn't found a life-partner yet, or any number of other malaises that fell under the broad category of "but I didn't get X done in college, and I'm afraid I won't if I head out into the world right now".</p>

<p>Please examine your thoughts, and figure out how much of your quandary is a state of Clutch that could be powered through if you could just muster the will to face the world outside of academe.</p>

<p>Yes, you can transfer somewhere if you can convince the college/university to which you are applying that you truly, truly want to change majors and that your goals are best filled at that institution. But, in order to do that, you need to have a very clear understanding of just exactly what that new major is going to be, AND you need to have a very clear understanding of just exactly what you, as an applicant, can bring to the new college/university. In other words, your goals need to be much more narrowly defined than we've seen here.</p>

17

<p>I think you should do whatever you want. If you want to transfer and switch majors, all you can do is apply. Some schools may be fine with your academic background, others less so. So since you are going to do whatever you want to do... then is your essential question more what people think about it?</p>

<p>I think you're romanticizing some undergrad experience that's different from the one you've had. Maybe because you're not ready to move on to the next set of choices in life. Lots of people postpone those choices, and that's fine. One thing I've learned is that the smartest people didn't learn the best of what they know in school, any school. They learned it from the inside out.</p>

<p>But if you want to do more undergrad in some other place for awhile, and you don't mind spending the money... then why not? I don't know what the problem is exactly, other than it perhaps being a little difficult to find the right college to transfer to?</p>

18

<p>First of all, let me thank everyone who's responded. I really don't want to give the appearance of someone who's not going to take any criticism of his plans and has already, essentially, made up his mind. I have considered all of the arguments presented here and I am thinking critically about what I will do with my life.</p>

<p>Senior Clutch: I'm aware of this phenomenon. On the one hand, though I am deeply disappointed with a lot of my college experience, I still have happily gotten a lot of things done in college. I have run several marathons. I have volunteered and grown through my volunteer experiences. I have learned a lot, at least via the mostly uneventful method of working hard, studying very thick textbooks. I have even fallen in love and become engaged. And I'll be married within a year.</p>

<p>I guess what's left over is the things I've seen my friends do that I have never had the chance to, the exposure to the highest standards of the world and the world of the mind. I do not know what value these standards and experiences will have for me forty years from now - I think (know) that in the long run, I will care little about where I went to college or what I did while I was there. But right now, these things seem very important.</p>

<p>I am beginning to reconsider transferring and considering other ways I could make my undergrad experience, in this last year or so, count for as much as possible. I am seriously considering becoming a Visiting Student at another school - I wonder how much better my chances would be for visiting a better school for a semester or year, above actually transferring there?</p>