<p>From reading threads on CC Jym, it sounds like many applicants don’t even know that they didn’t go to the next stage of hiring except by default when they don’t hear anything, let alone given a reason why they aren’t under consideration anymore. </p>
<p>[“Rude!</a>” - YouTube](<a href=“30 Rock: "Rude!" - YouTube”>30 Rock: "Rude!" - YouTube)</p>
<p>True that, EK. Sometimes applicants are asked in the preliminary HR screening interview if they have a certain skill that was not listed in the job posting. A candidate may be taken through a sort of “test run” to solve a problem as part of the interview process. Engineers are often given problems to solve, given math formulas to work or do some sample programming as part of the application/interview process. Or an applicant may have to give a series of presentations and may get feedback. But yes, the large number of applications go into an on line black hole, rarely even acknowledged.</p>
<p>Thanks for the bolding lessons!</p>
<p>I wasn’t typing anything especially interesting, but it was related to the OOS issue.</p>
<p>The OOS issue is a transparency issue in many cases so not sure why that discussion became off limits. Many of the most competitive public universities are fairly transparent in their desire to attract OOS students.</p>
<p>@jym,</p>
<p>If some public univ are ALREADY using scatterplots/matrixes to rank their candidates, then why not publish the prev year’s scatterplotd/matrixes on their website and simply telling applicant what their PAI and AAI scores were? </p>
<p>See post #267.</p>
<p>Does sound like naviance Nothing wrong with posting some general data like that, especially for schools using GPA/SAT cutoffs. But that is very different from disclosing to any ONE applicant why their individual application was denied.</p>
<p>And Common Data Set already provides lots of general info. The most competitive public schools tend to use some form of holistic review. For a small percentage of rejected or waitlisted applicants, no explanation would probably be good enough.</p>
<p>@jym, would u support reporting to the applicant what PAI and AAI score was given to them, so the applicant can see where in the PAI v AAI scatterplot they are? This is for the univ ALREADY using this method.</p>
<p>why?
How would it be of any benefit to a declined applicant?</p>
<p>I think it’s fascinating and what has kept me fascinated by this thread is that it feels like people do not distinguish between private education and public education. By the fact that one is “public” I think people probably deserve much more transparency than they get. With the exception of publics that have auto-admit by virtue of GPA and test scores, or Texas that fills by virtue of class rank the others seem to operate much like privates, excepting who they want and rejecting whomever they want for whatever reason they decide. Feels not right on some level.</p>
<p>jym, I do not think it is absolutely about the individual other than lack of transparency creates a situation where an individual could potentially not be accepted or rejected in an equitable manner. There could be any number of criteria that could be used subjectively to admit or deny a student much like is done with private schools. But in most cases there may be no compelling ‘need’ to include people by subjective criteria since the universities are so large they will naturally include most of the criteria that may be “subjectively” evaluated. Texas saw this with the top 10% as it naturally included the very people they were seeking…in Texas’ case -diversity.</p>
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<p>It wouldn’t.</p>
<p>But I think the idea here is that doing so would force colleges not…not be holistic? Disclose exactly what they want in candidates? Help the next group of applicants tailor themselves to those criteria? Just guessing.</p>
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<p>I guess that’s true. But unless we want to do away with the idea of students who are desirable for some reason other than test scores and GPA, I’m not sure that will change.</p>
<p>And how would they “tailor” themselves? It would help GCs, students and parents make better decisions about where to apply. Kids are applying too many places as it is mostly because they don’t know how they will fare.</p>
<p>But how can they tailor themselves if they know that the previous year a lot of philosophy majors graduated and the football team’s offense was all set, but this year it’s different?</p>
<p>Or, that the essay readers didn’t care for certain essay topics or writing styles?</p>
<p>Out of curiosity I looked at my state flagship. Is this an appropriate level of transparency?</p>
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<p>[Freshman</a> admission](<a href=“First-year applicants – Columbus campus - The Ohio State University”>First-year applicants – Columbus campus - The Ohio State University)</p>
<p>The CDS shows how that translated for the class of 2016, in terms of test scores and grades, at least. Is this where you’d want more transparency, like some graph of scoring based on writing, ECs, racial/geographic diversity, etc.? <a href=“http://oaa.osu.edu/irp/publisher_surveys/IRP_2013_Survey_Main.pdf[/url]”>http://oaa.osu.edu/irp/publisher_surveys/IRP_2013_Survey_Main.pdf</a></p>
<p>From what I’ve seen in Virginia, going through this with 2 kids 4 years apart-kids and guidance counselors have a good sense of how they will fare. Seemed pretty predictable where kids applied . The top kids applied to UVa, Wm & Mary if they wanted smaller, Virginia Tech for engineering,etc. Then other schools (both instate and out of state)if they were not as competitive.Or some very top kids applying to very competitive privates as well as the top instate schools.Can’t think of any major surprises as far as instate acceptances. For UVa, you need very good SAT’s, GPA ,EC’s, and recommendations. Most kids know where they stand and if they have a shot or not. Virginia has many good schools so all is not lost if a kid does not get into their first choice.</p>
<p>I applied to two schools:
One that is lesser selective (one reason I’m made fun of for choosing this one over others, yet it literally is my only choice now too) that I definitely would attend regardless of the other school, and another just to see if I was good enough.</p>
<p>And I was rejected to the harder school.
I don’t know whether it’s because I picked their most popular major, or low CR/W SAT scores, my B’s in English, and bad essays deem me unworthy of attending–oddly my English significantly improved during my Senior year… (Of course, they say they have plenty of qualified applicants, but still rejecting them still basically says they’re unworthy)
Yet other people, got in.</p>
<p>I want a reason. It doesn’t hurt. I’ll know some of my weaknesses and what to improve on. Not only that, but I get a lot of social pressure and mockery by people that hear I didn’t get in. I want a reason. Leaving out reasons plainly underrates smart individuals, say they just wanted to discriminate towards a certain type of student so they rejected me. I actually then wouldn’t care then, because I know why and I wouldn’t have attended the school anyways.</p>
<p>I understand your pain. I felt that way too when I was rejected from my top choice. </p>
<p>Since there is no “next time”, but it’s better not to tell people you applied to selective schools until after if you’re accepted. Because people are cruel and won’t care that your feelings are hurt. </p>
<p>Since you didn’t even want to go to the school anyway, you shouldn’t be hurt. You applied “just to see” if you were good enough, and you were rejected. You wouldn’t have went there anyway.</p>
<p>Why do students look at Naviance data?</p>
<p>Strange to me that the most highly ranked and renowned state flagships, the so-called “public ivies” would be criticized for using the holistic approach to admission decisions used by top private universities.</p>