Tufts student journal publishes satirical song ridiculuing blacks

Parent Cafe
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<p>mini:</p>

<p>As a true libertertain and beeliver in individual right over verusu community right, I feel that Tuft univeristy has right to close that financaing loop hole. But this is not so simple. Look what is happening in Iran that there is no "holocast." It is a known fact that six million jewish people lost their lives. To my surprise one Rabbi is even participating. what do you do. It is major news even though it is wrong cause ann Iran is trying to undermine the history and change to its wrongful intenstions. </p>

<p>Freedom of speech is guranteed in "Bill of rights" no matter how wrong or how bad it is. The best way is try to minimize the financaila resources. What happens if student spend their own money on this act alone. Then what? </p>

<p>I still do not know what is the right answer as this is very poor choice shown by few students.</p>

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<p>Let folks spend money as they choose. They can buy the paper, or buy some pornograph, or "The Protocols of the Elders of Zion," a copy of "A Christmas Carol" for that matter. </p>

<p>But they shouldn't be forced to subsidize racist claptrap.</p>

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<p>Step 1 surely has to be the Tufts administration condemning this racist poem in terms far stronger than just calling it "irresponsible." It's not only deeply offensive, it threatens any sense of community unless there's condemnation from virtually all quarters of both the poem and the lame "apology."</p>

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<p>
[quote]
Tarhunt: I am sorry, but I will ask the MODS to remove your post with Tuft lyrics.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Why? You can find all the most offensive parts quoted all over the Net.</p>

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<p>I'm not advocating censorship, but common human decency would be nice.</p>

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<p>marthonman:</p>

<p>I agree with your approach for this ireepheresensible act Tuft need to condemn it in strongest language. Tufts need to find the club members who may not even agree with this offensive lyrics and quote them that even there are club member who find this lyric offensive.</p>

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<p>If “The Primary Source” or any group of students at Tufts strongly disagrees with the administration’s AA policy they should write a position paper clearly stating their opposition and sign their names. “The Primary Source’s” degradation of a Christmas carol was immature and offensive. </p>

<p>Also, if the university is funding “The Primary Source” the members of the organization should be listed.</p>

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<p>Colleges have two responsibilities. One is to allow free thought and free speech. The other is to provide a safe environment in which to learn. Sometimes, those two things come into conflict.</p>

<p>A schoolroom bully who threatens another child is exercising free speech, I suppose, but I believe the school has both the right and the responsibility to stop the bullying. Things aren't quite as clear cut in college, since overt bullying is less common (but not unheard of by any means). But the school still has a responsibility to attempt to nurture an environment in which people can feel intellectually, emotionally, and physically safe.</p>

<p>Would I feel that way if I were an African American at Tufts right now? I don't think I would.</p>

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<p>Well put Tarhunt</p>

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<p>It's a failed attempt at satire; not racism. Because it FAILED to be GOOD SATIRE, it reads as racism. The end.</p>

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<p>
[quote]
It's a failed attempt at satire; not racism. Because it FAILED to be GOOD SATIRE, it reads as racism. The end.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>There are two implications here. The first is that any attempt at satire cannot be, prima facie, racist. In fact, any satire that comes across as racist MUST be "failed," since it cannot be racist.</p>

<p>The second implication is in the sentence fragment: "The end." Here we have a simple statement that there is nothing more to say on the subject and that lolabelle is the sole arbiter of what is and isn't true. It implies special insight into the thoughts and motives of the author and the editors. It also implies intellectual superiority to others posting on the board.</p>

<p>lolabelle, would you mind shooting me the e-mail address for the Tufts professor who taught you that this is the way to conduct rational discourse? I'd like to discuss his/her rationale with him/her.</p>

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<p>I meant the end to my opinion -- /not/ that we shouldn't stop discussing this. Trust me, I am totally open to dialogue and in fact think it's necessary. Your sarcasm (especially that last paragraph) is unnecessary.</p>

<p>Something that might help is thef ollowing e-mail my black senior friend here at Tufts wrote when I asked her how she felt the climate for black students at Tufts is:</p>

<p>
[quote]
I feel that the climate for black students at Tufts is similar to the climate for black students at any prestigious university where blacks are a minority. What I've observed at Tufts I have either observed or been told about by other black friends who study at Harvard, Penn, Cornell, Amherst, Middlebury, etc. The only place where the climate could be considerably better is at a school like Spelman, Howard -- the historically black colleges. I feel safe here. The black community at Tufts is close-knit but not so much that we fulfill that sociology clich</p>

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<p>lolabelle:</p>

<p>Why is this quote relevant? To the best of my recollection, I have made no representations about Tufts in general. I have simply said that the reworked words to the Christmas carol "O Come All Ye Faithful," published by a campus group, are racist. In the Tufts thread, I outlined, point by point, why it is racist. You chose not to address those points. You merely expressed an opinion, then revised that opinion, based (as far as I can tell) on no criteria whatsoever.</p>

<p>As for the quote itself, I'm much more interested in the opinions of actual posters and quotes for which there are references on can check.</p>

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<p>Right, because you can totally check that the posters on this forum are who they say they are. That quote is just as relevant as whatever anyone posts on CC. That quote is just an example of a black student at Tufts who agrees wtih my opinion.</p>

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<p>lolabelle:</p>

<p>Your opinion, as I understand it, is that a specific parody published in a specific place by a specific group is not racist. The quote you published is overwhelmingly about the overall atmosphere at Tufts, presumably for African Americans. It has absolutely nothing to do with the specific piece in question, other than this quote, "I can see why some of my black friends read it as racist."</p>

<p>That's fairly thin, intellectual gruel. It does not even state whether or not the quoted source thinks it is racist or not.</p>

<p>Not only is the quote tangential to the issue at hand, but even publishing the quote is of questionable value/logic. Bringing in outside sources to a discussion is very useful when it surfaces important data. Had I said something like, "African Americans at Tufts must feel unsafe," then this quote would be very relevant because it would prove that all African Americans do not feel unsafe. Had I said that "Many African Americans at Tufts feel unsafe," the quote would add little because it is simply one opinion and cannot refute the adjective "many."</p>

<p>But I did not say those things that I can recall. Can you point out where I did say those things?</p>

<p>What would be helpful is if you take my points about the piece in question and refute them based on a defintion of racism. I will repost those points, below.</p>

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<p>Here is the repost:</p>

<p>I disagree. It's racist. Here's why.</p>

<p>First, it's aimed at every, single African American in the entering class. This means that every single verse applies to every single AA. That's what the words say. It's exactly what they say.</p>

<p>Now, let's take a look at the words, shall we?</p>

<p>
[quote]
O Come All Ye Black Folk</p>

<p>O Come All Ye Black Folk
Boisterous yet desirable

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Boisterous YET desirable? So, all black folks are boisterous? And boisterous is not a good thing, right, because it's not "boisterous AND desirable" but "boisterous YET desirable." So, all that boisterousness must be a negative quality, right? Boy, those boisterous black folks. Man, they sure can shuck and jive, can't they?</p>

<p>I'm going to give them a pass on the desirable thing, which could be interpreted as that old oversexed crap African Americans have lived with since the days of slavery. I'm going to assume they didn't mean that. But I'm not at all sure.</p>

<p>
[quote]
Come and we will admit you
Born into oppression
O come let us accept them
O come let us accept them
O come let us accept them
Fifty-two black freshmen

[/quote]
</p>

<p>So, all the African American freshmen are born into oppression, and all they have to do to be admitted is just to come. Right?</p>

<p>
[quote]
O sing gospel choirs

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Oh, yes. Those gospel choirs. Yep. All African Americans just Loooooovvvee to sing that gospel music! Man, I can feel my toe tapping right now.</p>

<p>
[quote]
We will accept your children
No matter what your grades are F's, D's, or G's
Give them privileged status
We will welcome all

[/quote]
</p>

<p>So, all those gospel-singing and shuckin' and jivin' African American parents can get ALL their children into Tufts just by applying, right? Even with Fs, Ds, and Gs? In fact, because we're talking about all 52 (ALL 52) students, the all got Fs, Ds, and Gs, right? That's the logic. There isn't a single African American who would have been admitted had he/she been white. Right? All 52, remember?</p>

<p>
[quote]
All come! Blacks we need you
Born into the ghetto

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Yep, all African Americans, or at least these 52, are from the ghetto. That's where all African Americans are from, right?</p>

<p>You are wrong lolabelle. This doesn't sound racist. It IS racist. Virulently and disgustingly racist. I've seen Nazi propaganda against the Jews that wasn't this offensive.</p>

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<p>It was trying to be clever satire by exaggerating derogatory stereotypes of black Americans. It failed to be clever satire beacuse, well, it was neither clever nor funny. If you believe that because it failed to be good satire it simply is threadbare racism, then okay, yes, I will agree to disagree with you. I just feel that they failed at producing effective satire, and that unfortunately, because of their failure to do so, it came out as racist. I just don't believe they intended for it to be threadbare racism, despite the fact that I don't like nor agree with most anything published in the Primary Source.</p>

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<p>lolabelle:</p>

<p>That is not useful. Opinions based on nothing but feelings are not useful. The rules of logical discourse were worked out millenia ago. Surely, Tufts teaches these rules, doesn't it?</p>

<p>Let me ask you some questions.</p>

<p>What is racism? How is it defined? How can you even begin to decide what is and isn't racist until you have defined the term?</p>

<p>Is it your opinion that no satire/parody can be racist? If so, why? Is it because satire and parody are supposed to be funny, and nothing that is "supposed" to be funny can possibly be racist?</p>

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<p>I believe intent is important, and they intended to write satire that satirized the stereotypes, not satire that propagated them. Yes, they failed.</p>

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<p>lolabelle:</p>

<p>You didn't answer my questions. I still don't know how you can decide whether something is racist or not until you define the term. Socrates said HE couldn't do it.</p>

<p>As for "intent," is it your position that if someone says, "I think all n____s are lazy, but I'm not a racist," then that person is, in fact, not a racist because he did not intend for what he said to be racist? Is racism only in intent, or is racism what matches a definition of racism? What if he's trying to be funny? Does that mean he's not a racist?</p>

<p>As for intent, how do you know the intent? Do you have some special insights into the writer? </p>

<p>lolabelle, here's what I think is really going on. You love Tufts and you don't want anything to reflect badly on Tufts ... even the maunderings of a subgroup of Tufts students. So, I'm guessing that the real dynamic here is "I don't want it to be true, therefore it cannot be true." I don't see any logic going on here, and the quote you brought to the table was tangential, at best, and irrelevant at worst.</p>

<p>I think you have more on the ball than this. Won't you show it?</p>