<p>I am currently looking at WPI, University of Rochester, Tufts, and Swarthmore to study mechanical or computer/electrical engineering (or just engineering at Swarthmore.) I am a senior this year and trying to make a decision between the 4 schools. I just wanted some outside opinions of these colleges, and how their engineering programs compare to each other. I have visited all of the colleges and done overnight recruitment trips for swimming, staying with the team. I could potentially see myself at any of the 4 colleges, I feel as if I could socially and academically fit into all of them. Which of these colleges would give me the best engineering education,and the best opportunities for after college, whether I decide to go straight into my career or to graduate school?</p>
<p>“I have visited all of the colleges and done overnight recruitment trips for swimming, staying with the team.”</p>
<p>If you are a recruited athlete, definitely do to Swarthmore. Rochester is a grim place with lousy weather. It’s not great in engineering either. Tufts is overall a better place than Rochester. but it’s not big in engineering. WPI is an okay engineering school but nothing fancy.</p>
<p>If you don’t think you can handle the work at Swat, then go to Tufts.</p>
<p>From what I’ve seen, WPI seems to be a school very invested in its engineering program, where almost all of your classes revolve around engineering. There are a lot of projects, and it seems a little more hands on than Swarthmore. Both of my parents attended Tufts, but didn’t study engineering and said they really liked it. I am torn between WPI and Swarthmore right now, with Tufts close behind. I would like to be able to make the decision before the winter early decision deadline, so I know if I should apply to Swarthmore Early Decision or not, because it would probably increase my chances.</p>
<p>I can’t speak at all for the swimming part, but purely based upon the Engineering part I’d go with WPI or URoc. My other half is an engineer…</p>
<p>Is there any reason you aren’t trying a top Computer or Mechanical Engineering school - like, say, MIT, Carnegie Mellon or Cornell? If you have the stats for Swarth or Tufts, those seem like better Engineering possibilities.</p>
<p>^^^ The ROC isn’t always grim. My sources tell me the snow hasn’t begun to fall yet…</p>
<p>From the engineering perspective, Swarthmore is quite different than the other 3. From their web page, you will take 3/8 of your courses in liberal arts, roughly twice as much as the other three. The department is very small, doesn’t offer graduate degrees, and doesn’t offer specializations (e.g. electrical, mechanical, civil) except by electives. If you want to work in engineering right away, the other 3 are probably better choices. </p>
<p>If you are sure of wanting to do something else right away (e.g. law school, medical school, engineering grad school) then Swarthmore would have some advantages. If you are good enough to get into Swarthmore, then you are good enough to be successful anywhere. For that reason, I don’t think choosing one of the other 3 would be limiting in your career. For talented and motivated undergraduates, there are research opportunities at the 3 bigger schools that you probably would not find at Swarthmore.</p>
<p>Between WPI, Rochester and Tufts, it’s pretty much a toss-up.</p>
<p>Swarthmore engineering is a totally different animal than the other three. We visited and evaluated the schools on your list and here is our combined summary:
Swarthmore - fabulous place for super intellectual kids to study liberal arts. Engineering program/facilities are “lame”, though computer science looked much better. If my son had been interested in anything other than engineering it would have been at or near the top of the list. Did not apply.
U.Rochester - excellent engineering and sciences. Almost applied. Nice campus but the location is “meh”, winters are very snowy and cold. Not terrible neighborhood, but there isn’t much right off campus you can walk to or would want to walk to.
Tufts and WPI ended up being his top two choices and he spent a lot of time analyzing and deciding between them. At Tufts, engineering is a small percentage of the student body (10 or 15%???) so the campus “vibe” is less nerdy/geeky than WPI. Lots of kids majoring in liberal arts, very politically active campus etc. Great location, can walk to restaurants/shops and you can get to Boston/Cambridge easily via the “T” (public transportation). WPI is “nerd heaven” - almost entirely focused on engineering and sciences (has a business school too but that is most grad students). Great project-based programs that can include study abroad options. Terrible male/female ratio 
My son ultimately chose WPI over Tufts, mostly for the project-based programs and the geekier environment.
So it depends on what you are looking for and where you think you can get in!</p>
<p>Swarthmore is a liberal arts college and engineering is studied for it’s intellectual value, not necessarily to become an engineer. Swarthmore is a brutally hard school to get into, and is, along with UChicago, and Reed, known as an exceptionally intellectual school. </p>
<p>Tufts and Rochester are very similar with regard to engineering. Rochester is world famous for it’s optics because of the legacy of Eastman Kodak. Tufts is near Boston. Both of these schools are probably excellent preparation for graduate school. From my experience, finding a Tufts or Rochester graduate who is “ready for work” is rare. I recently found one but that person went on to graduate school, which was probably a good move. Tufts students tend to be really smart. Their approach to engineering is broader than most, and often less focused on actually becoming an engineer. </p>
<p>WPI is at the other end of the spectrum. They are much more hands on, practical and geeky. Most of their graduates go get a job after graduation. It’s primarily a teaching college and their professors get evaluated on their teaching more than their research. It’s an ideal environment for some. </p>
<p>These three schools, Tufts, Rochester and WPI all seem to be or have engineering schools that don’t view it as their goal to break you and then make you strong. They all seem less competitive and have a kinder, gentler approach. They seem great places to get a decent engineering education without getting weeded out. I view that as having great value for many people who would otherwise be emotionally destroyed by traditional engineering programs.</p>
<p>“Swarthmore is a liberal arts college and engineering is studied for it’s intellectual value, not necessarily to become an engineer.”</p>
<p>This is silly. Per Swarthmore:</p>
<p>“… the degree students receive at Swarthmore is a Bachelor of Science in Engineering, not one in ME, or EE, or CivE, or CompE, etc. Instead of trying to produce finished engineers who will never need to take another course again, our program produces students who are the excellent raw material for graduate programs, or enlightened companies, to mold into specialists. Something over 80% of our graduates go to graduate school eventually.” [Swarthmore</a> College - Department of Engineering Why Swarthmore Engineering?](<a href=“http://engin.swarthmore.edu/whyswat.php#courses]Swarthmore”>http://engin.swarthmore.edu/whyswat.php#courses)</p>
<p>At Swarthmore there is more of an opportunity to focus on math, physics and chemistry as well as liberal arts in a manner similar to that available in 3-2 engineering programs. The difference between 3-2 engineering and a 4 year Swarthmore undergrad engineering degree is that one doesn’t need to spend five years as an undergrad. One can enter virtually any graduate engineering program, possibly on a funded basis, after 4 years. OP should also keep in mind that Swarthmore is very strong in sciences.</p>
<p>WPI has a curriculum with an unusual 4 term per year calendar that is designed to benefit “B” students, who would be overwhelmed in a conventional engineering program as at Cornell or Georgia Tech. OP should consider WPI’s lower graduation rate compared to his other candidates. WPI students are not nearly as academically capable as those at Swat or Tufts. See Common Data Sets. It is unlikely that Whoopee is any more “hands on” in teaching engineering than any other school. Most engineering curricula have capstone projects during the senior year. OP can always transfer to WPI if unhappy elsewhere.</p>
<p>If OP doesn’t like Swat, then Tufts is the clear choice. It offers engineering taught in a manner similar to many private universities like Penn. However, Tufts engineering is relative small and accordingly has the benefit of smaller classes.</p>
<p>If OP isn’t completely sold on Swat, then he should not apply EDII at Swat.</p>
<p>Given that these are smaller schools, a check of the course catalogs and schedules to see what the selection of courses in the desired majors are like, and how often they are offered, would be something to do before deciding. If a school offers some interesting courses only once every two years, the student needs to plan the schedule carefully in order to be able to take a desired course when it is offered.</p>
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<p>Um, this rather supports what you say is “silly.” Many engineers want a job when they graduate as it’s one of the fields where one doesn’t need an advanced degree since you can specialize in college - except at places like Swarth.</p>
<p>If the OP truly wants to “be” an engineer, I’d never recommend Swarth. If they just want to “study” engineering (and not in depth for any one particular field), then Swarth would be an ideal place, but have something else planned after graduation. In this economy, how many “enlightened” companies are out there vs those who want specialized engineers? If you are looking for a computer engineer and have applications from elsewhere, why pick someone who doesn’t have training in the field? IMO, that’s not “enlightenment.”</p>
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“Capstone projects” were required even decades ago for engineering. That most engineering curricula have them doesn’t mean most of them are “hands on”. If you have to wait until senior year just to have a design project, your curriculum is NOT hands on. Most schools are stuck with same curricula of the last generation, with minor changes here and there while a minority have made more major changes to their engineering programs. My alma mater, Northwestern, was one of those that made some major changes. While the core courses are similar to others in order to satisfy ABET standard, the first two years are very different. All freshmen are required to design real products for real industry clients and there are design courses/facilities available to those who continue to be involved in designs throughout their undergrad years. They also have their own integrated curriculum that replace the traditional basic physics, math, computer sci courses. WPI may very well be one of the similar schools with a more 21-st-century approach for their engineering program.</p>
<p>I guess I meant that WPI was more hands-on than theoretical. Hands-on is more valuable for your first job, and theoretical is better for a 40+ year technical career, and for gaining the insight to break the mold and make innovations in some areas. </p>
<p>While many of the top programs are plenty hands-on, they are also heavy in the theoretical. WPI is not that heavy in the theory. People who learn better by doing than by studying do very well at WPI. </p>
<p>It’s really just a difference in emphasis.</p>
<p>Hi there!</p>
<p>I have applied to WPI EA and here’s what I think…</p>
<p>I really can’t say much about the rest of the schools coz I wanted to go somewhere SAT optional. Hence I choose WPI…BUT that doesn’t make me a “B” student…</p>
<p>I have completed the A levels, which in most places are considered harder than the AP…
Basically, from my research I found out that WPI is not only more hands on, but it does also pay stronger emphasis on liberal arts, which is another reason why I applied there using the flex path(I submitted a literary portfolio)…</p>
<p>Anyhoo, the 4 terms per year suggested above by someone also aren’t there for the benefit of “B” students who would be overwhelmed in a conventional engineering program as at Cornell or Georgia Tech".</p>
<p>Firstly, I think that unconventional is good. But what it actually is, and I’m sure you already know it if u have researched the place, is that each year has 2 semesters, each semester has 2 terms, each term is 7 weeks long, and in each term you only have 3 classes, u can overload to 4, but the point is to intensely study the 3 courses in-depth rather than having 6 to 7 all together. I think it’s very clever as some people really do fee scattered doing all the 6 courses together…</p>
<p>Plus with the term system, you can complete your studies faster, and this benefits a majority of students who are then able to peruse a double major or another minor.
And since each term is 7 weeks long, you have mid terms every 3 weeks, and so you really don’t have time to fall behind in your studies as it will be difficult to catch up. Maybe it’s not as conventional as Cornell, but it’s not for a slacker and definitely not EASIER!</p>
<p>also, WPI doesn’t only focus on the senior year project, it has a project for all the 4 years, which I personally LOVE…in the freshmen year you have the great problems seminar which I’m really looking forward to (if I get accepted that is)
All in all, I personally don’t think that WPI is inferior in any way, it obviously isn’t for everyone, but I like how unconventional it is!</p>
<p>WPI might not be ivy league, but it has a league of its own, you actually SOLVE real world problems rather than just study about them, id suggest you to look at some of the IQP in the past years to see what the projects r like, last year a team went to Africa and constructed a system to provide electricity to a rural village. And they have over 40+ international sites where u can do the IQP!</p>
<p>Oh and WPI is also quite small, which is another plus according to me. The average class size is told to be 25.</p>
<p>and FYI, I know someone who had exactly the same stats as me and just got accepted into Williams College!, so I don’t think that the student body at WPI will be “not nearly as academically capable as those at Swat or Tufts”…</p>
<p>[WPI</a> Consistently Makes the Grade - WPI](<a href=“http://www.wpi.edu/news/perspectives/rnkgs.html]WPI”>http://www.wpi.edu/news/perspectives/rnkgs.html) it was ranked as one of the smartest 20 colleges if that’s worth anything :)</p>
<p>" I can’t speak at all for the swimming part, but purely based upon the Engineering part I’d go with WPI or URoc. My other half is an engineer…</p>
<p>Is there any reason you aren’t trying a top Computer or Mechanical Engineering school - like, say, MIT, Carnegie Mellon or Cornell? If you have the stats for Swarth or Tufts, those seem like better Engineering possibilities."</p>
<p>I am trying not to base my decision really off of swimming, but being recruited at all of the colleges/universities really helps with the admissions process. As far as top Engineering schools, I looked at Carnegie Mellon for CS or Engineering, and for multiple reasons, it simply wasn’t the school for me. </p>
<p>The 4 different projects at WPI really appeal to me. I have not seen such projects at the other schools, with the exception of the major/senior project for engineering which seems to be a fairly standard trait of all schools. </p>
<p>I’m not positive as to whether or not I want to go straight to grad school out of college, but I know at some point I would like to get a graduate degree in either mechanical or computer engineering. </p>
<p>The Vibe I got from Swarthmore and most of the students that tried to explain the engineering program to me was that it was much more research and academia based, rather than hands on, learning how to be an engineer. It came off as someplace one would go who was sure they wanted to go straight to grad school, and start researching engineering, or become and engineering professor. Where as research is something I might like to do down the line, I want to be able to start my career out of college, and be able to get a good job before grad school.</p>
<p>^^^ Given this latest info, I’d be down to WPI or URoc as schools I’d perhaps revisit and spend time with current students seeing which place appealed more.</p>
<p>OR choose between which swim coach you like better at that point as either of those two would be decent academic schools (albeit a little different).</p>
<p>I still don’t equate Tufts with engineering, so I don’t know how they’d fit in. This statement is neither pro nor con, unless, perhaps con in that they aren’t known for it around here. The other two are (and Swarth is with its limitations).</p>
<p>OP should consider the relative sizes of engineering at the four schools. Per College Navigator and CDS, WPI has about 450 engineering grads per year, Tufts 165, U of R 135 with a large number in bioengineering, and Swarthmore College about 15 per year from their department of engineering. Tufts trumps U of R for OP’s needs.</p>
<p>It is just not possible for Swat to offer anything other than a general engineering or an engineering science program due to its size. However, if OP decides after a few years at Swat that he’s a definite ME, EE or other type of engineer, Swat offers the possibility of taking advanced speciality courses at Penn. Still, Swat offers virtually all of the standard EE and ME curricula. It does not offer specialty electives that might be found at Penn.</p>
<p>Besides engineering and swimming, what else does OP want out of college?</p>
<p>My son (a senior) was very interested in applying to Swarthmore for Engineering. There were so many things he liked about the school - its liberal arts background, intellectualism and commitment to academics. He ended his junior year expecting that he would apply ED to Swarthmore, but in the end he didn’t apply at all. He visited the campus multiple times, finding in the end that the Engineering Department didn’t seem committed to Engineering. It was small, had little activity in research, was poorly equipped and seemed to be a step-sibling to the liberal arts programs. This was unfortunate, because there are few small schools that focus on Engineering, especially of that caliber. I hope Swarthmore works to further develop this program because it could provide an outstanding technology balance/option in an otherwise superb school. In the end, he applied (and has been accepted) to some of the schools mentioned in this thread. In addition to MIT, Carnegie Mellon, Rochester and WPI (all very good to excellent in quality), I want to put in a plug for some mid-western schools like Case Western, Rose-Hulman Institute of Technology and WUSL - very often overlooked, especially on the east/west coasts.</p>