Tulane or USC?

<p>Oh, and I forgot one important thing in the comparison, specific to USC vs. Tulane. South Central LA (muggings, rapes, killings, at that is just what they talk about on the USC thread on CC, it is much worse when you dig into police reports and the like) vs. Audubon district (huge mansions, lovely area. Not immune from crime of course, but far less than what goes on around the USC campus).</p>

<p>What is less than a no brainer?</p>

<p>Chemist, that post about ignoring me was classic. That was a pretty long response considering you chose to ignore me. And while you were ignoring me you happened to read my previous posts. LOL</p>

<p>Oh, me recommending wake because of it’s name was a joke. As was the one about Case Western Reserve sounding like a boxed wine. Lighten up.</p>

<p>Well, I was so shocked at agreeing with you that I had to respond. Besides, that was ages ago. I totally forgot, since I tend to forget trivial things.</p>

<p>Just out of curiosity, you seem to have an opinion on every school out there, but why are you even commenting on these schools? Not just Tulane, but any of them? You apparently have no connection (unless you were kicked out of all of them and just have not told us). As I say, just curious. I am sure I will regret asking.</p>

<p>I’ve done my fair share of bashing 'SC, but it’s 'hood is relatively safe, for an urban area. Yes, SouthCentral has a bunch of problems, but they are not in or around campus per se. The USC administration employs a lot of local folks, has a large tutoring outreach program, provides scholarships to local kids. As a result, the neighborhood considers it their college. As an example, the area around USC was completely untouched during the Rodney King riots in which the rest of the town was burning.</p>

<p>bluebayou - I agree that compared to the rest of South Central it is relatively safe, although I think you will have to agree that isn’t saying much! But I looked at the police reports from the last year as it regards students being involved in crimes (as victims mostly of course, although a few as perps, even besides drug related, but mostly that). It was still extremely disturbing, much higher than Tulane, U Chicago, Duke, and a few other schools I have looked at previously. It’s an issue, although I agree that if one takes reasonable precautions you improve your own safety a lot. So I am not saying it is dangerous in an absolute sense, obviously most students get through 4 years with no problems at all. It just is unfortunate that it is in one of the worst parts of LA.</p>

<p>Fallenchemist Can’t help myself. Comparing USC’s SATs to Tulane’s, although USC’s are higher you state that they are very similar. Comparing Tulane’s higher SAT’s to Miami’s in another post you state that it is an indication that Tulane’s student body is of a higher quality than Miami’s. In the traditional areas of critical reading and math it appears that the difference in scores between Tulane’s SATs and Miami’s and Tulane’s SATs and USC are somewhat similar. I don’t know which observation is correct, but it seems that if Tulane’s higher scores are meaningful vis a vis Miami their lower score vis a vis USC would also be meaningful.</p>

<p>Actually I give unbiased (mostly) opinions. If people only want to hear Tulane grads’ opinions they are foolish. My opinions are based mostly off of what I know about the schools from my own college search and from people I know who have gone to the schools.</p>

<p>Rollins - you seem overly obsessed with my posts! Nonetheless, I will quote myself here, in comparing Tulane and USC:</p>

<p>

</p>

<p>So I clearly said that math was not similar in recent years, but based on the reports from the admissions office this year it should go up about 20-30 points at Tulane for the incoming class. I have no idea what USC’s will do this year.</p>

<p>Now let’s compare the actual stats as reported by Princeton Review:</p>

<p>Middle 50% Tulane USC Miami (FL)</p>

<p>SAT Reading 630-720 620-720 580-680
SAT Math 620-700 650-750 610-710
SAT Writing 640-720 640-730 580-670
ACT Composite 29-32 28-33 27-31</p>

<p>(Sorry that CC doesn’t retain the formatting that would make that easier to read)</p>

<p>Now maybe you can look at those ranges and say Tulane’s are lower than USC in Reading and Writing and on the ACT ( which I say is virtually identical since it is one point higher on the low end and one point lower on the high end) but I sure don’t see it. Miami on the other hand is clearly lower in those areas. So OK, if they were going for engineering you might have a point that math might have to be weighted higher. But they said they were going for Asian studies and/or biology, neither of which is exactly math heavy. Even so, I cannot look at those stats and come to the same conclusion you do. Tulane is clearly a lot closer to USC (stats wise) than Miami is to Tulane.</p>

<p>Fallinchemist: I was comparing the quote you cited above concerning USC to your following comment concerning Miami.</p>

<p>“While that certainly isn’t the be all and end all of academics, it is at least a measure that is the same across schools. Tulane is well ahead of Miami there overall, and the gap is likely to widen this year.”</p>

<p>I just don’t see that the numbers show consistency in how you are interpreting them.</p>

<p>Rollins - Honestly, I have no idea what you are saying. People can read my posts and either they think they help or they don’t. I am not saying in any case that higher or lower SAT/ACT scores makes any school better or worse than another (and of course there is no such thing as better or worse since it is how a school fits a student), but only that these are one measure of the overall academic ability of a class of students. My quote about Tulane vs. USC was that IMO they are fairly similar academically, and by putting the comment in parentheses I was indicating this was one piece of evidence to support what was my overall opinion about the schools academic quality, not absolute proof. Geezuz.</p>

<p>Anyway, give it a rest. You are free to post your opinions about schools, I can post mine. I don’t think you dogging me about my opinions is particularly productive, since mine are clearly well intentioned, generally positive about many schools, and researched and backed up by facts when applicable. I will occassionly comment on people’s posts that are clearly vitriolic or factually incorrect. I was stating a fact that there is vitually no gap in the scores between USC and Tulane, and a more significant gap in the scores between Miami and Tulane. If you cannot see that in those scores, then I don’t know what to tell you.</p>

<p>Dogging you? Please. As you claim we are all entitled to an opinion I don’t think you should be offended by my opinion providing context to your post. I provided evidence for readers to consider. USC’s SATs in math are higher than Tulane’s. (real not projected) They are comparable in reading. Tulane’s SATs are higher than Miami’s in reading, but are comparable in math. (For specifics go to the Tulane vs. Miami thread as well as the Tulane vs USC stats found in this thread above.) When discussing Tulane vs. USC you were of the opinion that the schools were academically comparable. When discussing Tulane vs. Miami you found the strength of student body as measured by SATs to be a point in Tulane’s favor.
Frankly, based on the friendly nature of your other posts, I am surprised at your reaction. I am sure you want readers to form their opinions on the best information possible. This really isn’t about you so there is no need for me to “give it a rest.” Why is it not helpful to readers to point out some underlying facts to consider in judging how much credence to give your opinion in this particular instance. I am not saying anything negative about USC, Tulane, Miami or you. You have candidly admitted that you are a booster of Tulane. I however have no connection to any of these schools. I enjoyed some of your other posts, but when I compared your comments in the two threads in question, I thought it was only fair to someone reading one but not the other to make the observation that I did. There was no animosity meant in my post so you shouldn’t take it personally.</p>

<p>You are entitled to an opinion, but you seem to be making a mini-industry of critiquing my posts. OK fine, I can support what I say. People can easily see you are misreading my posts in this case, anyway. I clearly said it was not the be all and end all of academic comparisons, just that it was one of the few that could be equally and easily compared across schools. But let’s say just for argument’s sake that SAT/ACT are THE measure of academic quality. In that case, 3 of the 4 sets of stats are significantly higher for Tulane than Miami and one the same, while 3 of the 4 sets for for Tulane are the same as USC and one lower. You conveniently leave out the writing stats and the ACT, but all three report them so they are fair to use.</p>

<p>So I am not sure how that adds up in your book to anything other than supporting my contention, which I actually based on more factors than that but many of those are not as easily quantified. Are we done? I sure am. I am rather tired of being taken out of context and misinterpreted by you.</p>

<p>If you want to post your opinion on the relative merits of these schools please do. But unless you truly feel I have made an egregious error, and I just proved I have not, then I don’t think it is good form to do this as a critique of my posts. Do it as a positive or factual stating of your opinion of the schools themselves.</p>

<p>Before you yelp about my comment that you take my comments out of context and mischaracterize them:</p>

<p>

</p>

<p>However, I cited 4 sets of standardized statistics, not just those 2. You make it sound like I only cited those 2 stats, and thus make it look like I am making a ridiculous conclusion. That, and the fact that I also said those stats are NOT the only thing that went into my opinion on relative academic quality of the schools. Those reasons are why your posts are offensive to me and why I am reacting strongly.</p>

<p>Miami
Math Middle 50%: 610 - 710
Reading Middle 50%: 580 - 680
Writing Middle 50%: 580 - 670</p>

<p>*Tulane:</p>

<p>SAT, Middle 50%
Math 630-710
Critical Reading 620-720
Writing 630-720
Composite 1880-2150
ACT, Middle 50%
Composite 28-32</p>

<p>*USC:</p>

<p>SAT, Middle 50%
Math 650-750
Critical Reading 620-720
Writing 640-730
Composite 1910-2200
ACT, Middle 50%
Composite 28-33</p>

<p>These are the stats referred to in your posts. Writing is a new test and is generally not relied upon my admission committees. Therefore, I also consider it to be unreliable and did not mention it. You sited no ACT score for Miami so obviously that also couldn’t factor into my comments.</p>

<p>The bottom line is here are the stats. Now you can make whatever arguments you want concerning USC=Tulane>Miami. I’ll leave it up to the individual to consider whether these stats as you claim validate or undercut your posts that the student body of Tulane is equal to that of USC and superior to that of Miami. All I tried to do was state my opinion that you were being a bit selective and Tulane-centric and give some facts to back it up. From the fact that your name indicates a science background I thought you might appreciate some “peer review” of your opinions. It is clear to me now that you don’t. Frankly, I don’t understand how you can feel that insisting that your opinions go unchallenged provides help to any one. But anyway you win. I wish I had never posted here. Way too much hostility and too little interest in substance.</p>

<p>You have just obliterated yourself as being unable to read (and by the way, it is cited, not sited).</p>

<p>

</p>

<p>That last is Miami’s obviously, so you are completely wrong on that. As far as the writing, you can decide that it is new blah blah blah, (although they all three report it, some schools don’t report it. If one hadn’t, I wouldn’t have used it) but then don’t quote my conclusion based on your selective data instead of the data I used. That is shameful. As a scientist, if I am going to change the data set, I have to have a good reason for it beyond my opinion of the test itself and certainly I would have to acknowledge that I was changing the data set and why, which you didn’t. You say I was selective, yet you were far more selctive than I by eliminating data that didn’t conform to your position. I certainly do not insist that my opinions go unchallenged, I do insist that I am quoted correctly and not mischaracterized by selective omissions. You have not offered substance, you have only offered a critique of my posts based on erroneous thinking and actions. Keep doing that garbage, and you will keep getting hostility</p>

<p>I do owe you a slight apology on that one. As you noted the formatting was off on your post. I therefore didn’t pick up that you had actually posted ACT scores. What is odd though is that you are bringing them to my attention. Let’s see USC scores are 28-33, while Tulane’s are 29-32. So if I am following you that makes their student bodies comparable, while Tulane with a 29-32 range has a student body that is “well ahead” “overall” of Miami’s with a range of 27-31. Am I allowed to say that I don’t agree that this proves your point? At the very least I hope that you don’t find my disagreement with you offensive. BTW please stop me if you find me pointing out typos in your posts in order to substantiate my opinion.</p>

<p>Siting instead of citing is not a typo, it is a mistake, and I thought you would like to learn the correct term. It had nothing to do with “substantiating my opinion” nor could any reasonable person take it that way. Just another example of you making wild mischaraterizations. Anyway, the ACT is only a 36 point scale. In total there is a 3 point differential between Tulane and Miami. Sure, feel free to disagree, but over a data set of hundreds of students at each school that is statistically significant. And you didn’t originally say that you didn’t pick up on ACT scores at all, you said only that I did not post Miami’s. BTW, since you went back and looked at my original Miani vs. Tulane post, you would have had to have missed it there too, and I don’t think even you missed it twice. I think you are making it up as you go along. Looking at my post on this thread there is a pretty clear “ACT Composite” that is hard to miss. Just give it up. Contrary to what you probably think, I don’t like slicing up someone this way. Besides, you are getting boring.</p>

<p>Fallen Chemist, Here is the quote from your post 2 in the Tulane vs. Miami thread. </p>

<p>"Tulane is well ahead of Miami there overall, and the gap is likely to widen this year.</p>

<p>Miami:</p>

<p>Reading Middle 50%: 580 - 680
Math Middle 50%: 610 - 710
Writing Middle 50%: 580 - 670</p>

<p>Tulane:</p>

<p>Reading Middle 50%: 630 - 720
Math Middle 50%: 620 - 700
Writing Middle 50%: 640 - 720"</p>

<p>This is the post that led me to state my disagreement with your opinion. As you can see you didn’t give the ACT scores of the schools. I don’t know why you claim that you did, but that’s for you to figure out. Anyway, I didn’t make a big deal out of this and conceded that I missed it when you provided the ACT scores in this thread. Even though by adding ACT scores you cleverly added facts that weren’t the subject of our original disagreement, I thought maybe I could steer the conversation back to substance if I didn’t mention it. However, it is clear that I have been unsuccessful and you insist upon making my disagreement with your original post on the Miami vs Tulane thread all about you feeling that have “won”. I guess that explains your rather bizarre delusion that your posts are “slicing” me up. That’s quite an image.</p>

<p>LOL, you are the one that brought Miami into this in the first place. WOW, you really are a piece of work. Since I apparently did not mention the ACT scores in the original Miami post, it makes my point even more obvious. Tulane is 50 points or more ahead of Miami in 2 of those 3 categories, making my statement regarding the test scores clearly right. There can be no way that led to the disagreement since it supports what I say, unless you conveniently leave out the writing score, which you did to your shame. Adding the ACT just bolsters my claim regarding the relative test scores between the schools. You still have no substance, it was still ridiculous to try and use this forum to try to make people question my opinion by making me look inconsistent (which you did by mischaracterizing and falsely setting up my arguments), and that is the last I have to say to you. At this point all can see you are completely wrong. As I tried to tell you, comment on the schools all you want, stop trying to tear apart my posts unless you can really point to something I actually said that was wrong. Nothing I have said is, other than I thought I had posted the ACT scores in the original Miami post, which is irrelevant since I didn’t try to tie the two together, you did. You still clearly missed it in the post on this thread when it was totally clearly there, and then you say you owe me a “slight” apology. Worthless.</p>

<p>BTW - if you look at the total SAT range (including math):</p>

<p>Miami: 1770-2060
Tulane: 1890-2140
USC: 1910-2200</p>

<p>In total that is a 200 point gap between Miami and Tulane, and an 80 point gap between Tulane and USC. I stand by my statement on that basis alone. I would say that makes your whole premise that I was inconsistent in the way I compared the schools totally wrong. Go away boy, you bother us.</p>

<p>Look the stats you originally posted at the Miami vs. Tulane thread are there to read as are the stats that you posted concerning Tulane vs. USC. As it helps your position you give the same weight to writing scores as you do to the math and critical reading scores. Admissions committees don’t and I didn’t. But that’s OK. I even can overlook your failure to apologize for mistating what was in your original post even though this was what prompted me to post the opinion that set you off. Unfortunately, you have now taken it to a whole new level. Your claim that your posts are slicing me up, referring to me as “boy”, telling me to go away and referring to yourself as “us” as if you are the site, is very revealing and more than a little disturbing.</p>