Tulane Reputation and its Effect on Med School Applications

Colleges and Universities A-Z Tulane University
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<p>I apologize for the long-windedness of this, but here it goes....</p>

<p>So I am a potential Tulane student in the fall with intentions to do Neuroscience Pre-Med with a couple of minors, so on and so forth... I am a presidential scholar and in the honors program (4.0 hs unweighted gpa, all APs offered at my hs, 35 ACT, etc), and I love New Orleans, but I am having trouble selling my parents on it. I am deciding between Ohio State ($20k w/ in-state tuition) and Tulane ($30k w/ scholarship + travel), and I just need to figure out exactly what I am getting from Tulane. I feel that the academics, particularly as a result of being in the honors program (and I will ultimately attempt to get into the Top Scholars Program as well), are superior at Tulane, and the nola/service opportunity puts it above and beyond. But what my parents are concerned about is the partying and mixed reputation of Tulane. How exactly do med school admissions counselors feel about Tulane? Depending on where you look, Tulane is either regarded as a top private research institution, or a fall-back school for rich white kids who want to party. I don't want to go into Tulane thinking of it as a top institution, just to be disappointed that it is really just a "party" school. Sure, I want to get out a little bit, but more importantly, my plan is to work hard and ultimately get into a top-tier med school. I already intend to put myself in a good atmosphere by living in Butler, but my parents are especially concerned about going to Tulane puts a lot more financial burden on me than OSU (I have already ruled out Vandy for this reason). So, I guess my question is, exactly what is Tulane? It has this alter-ego of sorts, and since I dont really know any current students, I cant really figure out which one it is in reality!!</p>

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<p>This might turn into a long answer as well, but I will try and stick to the main points.</p>

<p>Leading with the thing most favorable to OSU (do I have to say THE OSU?) is saving about $40,000 over the 4 years of your undergrad. Clearly that money would be useful in going to med school. While the cost of med school would still be exorbitant, $210,000 is better than $250,000, or whatever the numbers would be. In fact, if your parents invested that money in something relatively safe, it would be a bit more even, but not much. Whatever the details of where that $10K a year would be coming from, financially you are clearly better off not incurring it. So the question boils down to is Tulane worth that extra $10K a year? I’ll come back to that.</p>

<p>Let’s address the party aspect and Tulane’s reputation first. I can absolutely guarantee you that the highly educated people on med school admissions committees think very highly of Tulane. Tulane students get into excellent med schools every year. These people know that there is a heavy party atmosphere at all schools. Do you honestly think they don’t consider OSU as having a lot of students that party all the time? Surely your parents realize that there is a considerable number of OSU students who chose it because it is “a … school for … kids who want to party”. Large state schools with big time sports are considered the most notorious party schools for the most part. Besides, if they considered Tulane more of a party school than others and you still came out with a 3.8 GPA and great MCAT scores, wouldn’t that make you look even better? But that is rhetorical and based on a false premise, because Tulane is well regarded, definitely. Also, how much or how little you party is 100% up to you. No one, and I mean no one at Tulane is going to consider you weird or anti-social or anything else if you prioritize your academics more than they do. You can definitely find the appropriate balance that suits you, no problem. Don’t worry about that, as long as you have the discipline to stick to your plan. And frankly that won’t be any different at OSU for the most part.</p>

<p>Med schools look at various aspects of an applicant, but nothing is more important than overall GPA. GPA in the core pre-med courses, and MCAT scores. Recommendations and other factors, like great service projects and/or excellent research participation as an undergrad certainly help as well. Med schools really don’t look as much at what school you attended as you might think. They are always accepting students from small, fairly non-competitive schools, because some students really managed to do great work at those schools. The reason you hear about students from Harvard, Yale, Stanford, Duke, etc. getting into med schools at higher rates is because they were the best students to begin with. There is an extremely high correlation between SAT scores and MCAT scores. Obviously those schools I named have students with the highest SAT scores out of high school. So in that limited sense it really doesn’t matter if you go to Tulane or OSU. Getting great grades and doing well on the MCAT at either serves you equally well.</p>

<p>So why go to Tulane? Why not just save the money? Doing well in school has a lot to do with how happy you are overall. If you are pretty sure you will thrive in an environment with smaller classes, more attention from the professors (not to mention a lot more classes taught by the professors rather than grad students or post-docs), and where it is much easier to do great research so the prof can really see your contribution and therefore write a more personal recommendation, then Tulane is the better choice. There is the service aspect as we have both mentioned. And there is enjoying being in New Orleans. This isn’t all just about getting into med school, though that is your primary objective. It is also about you creating the memories that will last you forever. You have to decide if these and any other factors you are aware of are of sufficient value to be worth $10K a year. No one can answer that for you.</p>

<p>That’s the best I got for now. Hopefully other opinions will surface. And of course discussion should now ensue. I am sure you have more questions.</p>

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<p>Thank you very much for this!!! I agree wholeheartedly about everything you are say, just not sure that I have the stats to back up these statements (my parents are accountants and thus facts and statistics are very important to them). While Tulane is undoubtedly a good school (and from what I understand, a fairly elite one), I’m having trouble framing it as an elite one to my parents. I have looked at pretty much any stat you can think of to comparatively look at (the) OSU and Tulane, and the big question that I cannot seem to back up is research at Tulane. While I have heard wonderful things, when it comes to stats and rankings (I realize that the usnews and other rankings are frowned upon in this community, but they, as quantifiable evidence, are important gauges of a school to my parents, and for whatever reason (i assume katrina?), they do not give tulane a whole lot of credit) merely show Tulane as average and no better than OSU or any strong public school for that matter. I guess my next question is understanding better the research dynamic at Tulane. How good is it, and there evidence out there (trust me, ive looked) that backs this up??</p>

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<p>Here’s a fact and statistic for your parents. Tulane has about 8,000 undergrads, OSU has almost 50,000. Do you want to attend a mid-size school, or the third largest school in the country? </p>

<p>I don’t know the facts about research, but I suspect that if OSU has more opportunities, they also have many more students vying for them. I would also think that Tulane’s smaller class size and easier rapport with professors can only help come med school application season.</p>

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<p>@thenewkidaw71‌ - These are excellent questions, both from you and your parents. Some of my answers will contain assertions that I can back up, but it would take pages to do it on here. So hopefully they can accept some points I make as just “OK, I can believe that”.</p>

<p>The first big point, and this is really important, is that when it comes to research and rankings in all fields probably, but certainly in the sciences, it is all driven by graduate school and post-doc level work. There is absolutely, positively no such thing as a credible ranking system for undergraduate majors. Your parents are into stats and facts? Then I would challenge them to tell me what stats are available that could meaningfully measure how the chemistry department at OSU is better for undergrads than Tulane’s. For grad school? Sure. I did some graduate work in chemistry at a top-ranked school much like OSU, and there is no question it was stronger for getting a PhD than Tulane, as is OSU. But that isn’t what we are talking about here. It is easy to measure number of publications, how much money they get, how many grad students they have, so on and so forth. None of that is important at the undergrad level.</p>

<p>In fact, it is exactly that situation that makes Tulane such a great place to be an undergrad wanting to do research. Tulane is a member of AAU, a group of about 60 research level universities that are considered to be top-notch. <a href=“https://www.aau.edu/”>https://www.aau.edu/&lt;/a&gt; OSU is a member also, of course. No matter what source you look at, Tulane is always considered a top tier research university. But since their graduate programs in some areas are much smaller than at OSU, the profs are very involved with the undergrads in doing research. I can tell you from my experience that the research groups at a place like OSU have many grad students, often 20, 30 even 40 or more, plus post-docs. The professor is so busy managing these people, writing papers, writing research grant proposals, consulting, and teaching (usually an upper level undergrad course or a grad level course, not intro courses) that they really don’t have much time for the undergrads. Now this is the “worst case” scenario (from your point of view) and there are certainly profs not in that situation, but their goal in a school like OSU is to get to that situation. It is not like that at Tulane.</p>

<p>So the very thing your parents are focusing on as making OSU seem more prestigious is the same thing that makes the experience for undergrads less satisfying. I know we had about 18 grad students (including me) in my group and 3 post-docs. We had no undergrads, and frankly I cannot remember any of the other groups having undergrads doing research either. There probably were a couple here and there, but I have to wonder what level projects they were given. In groups like that they are usually given the most boring and routine work. Again, not at Tulane. It is only anecdotal, but when I was doing my undergrad at Tulane, I had an idea for a line of research that my prof actually listened to. Now my idea was the seed and turned out well due to fairly dumb luck on my part. It mostly turned out well because he made a key suggestion to use one component that was different than what I was suggesting. The point is that it resulted in 3 publications in the top journals in the country, he gave me lead author credit on the first one because it was my suggestion that got it started, and it has been cited in hundreds of papers and several textbooks since then. I can say with 99.8% certainly that never would have happened at OSU.</p>

<p>This situation also means that the profs at Tulane are actually teaching the undergrad courses, even the intro level ones. It is another opportunity to get to know them. The Tulane faculty is very undergrad oriented.</p>

<p>It is hard to give you statistical evidence about undergrads doing research at Tulane, these things just don’t exist. But as a Tulane grad and a Tulane parent I can tell you it is definitely there. In an entirely different field, I remember a few years ago a 2nd semester freshman wrote me that she was thinking of transferring because she had become interested in an area of linguistics that Tulane didn’t have as a major or concentration. Long story, but I found out that a professor in another department was doing research that was very similar to what she was wanting and suggested she go talk to him. That next Monday she was in his research group on a project that was exactly what she wanted to do, and is now going to be a happy Tulane graduate going on to grad school at Michigan in this field. I know, just anecdotal, but there are a lot more like it.</p>

<p>I would point out that Tulane had 13 undergraduate Fulbright award winners last year, OSU had 16. That’s pretty elite. When you take into account that OSU is 9 times larger than Tulane for undergrad, Tulane beat their pants off, lol. They also had a couple of National Science Foundation Fellows. Tulane students know how to party, for sure, but they also know how to achieve great things academically. It just stands to reason that opportunities are a lot more accessible at Tulane for those that want them.</p>

<p>I don’t know if that helped, If I can clarify anything or answer anything else, let me know.</p>

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<p>@thenewkidaw71…you sound very similar to my son who will be attending Tulane next fall as a freshman. Good luck with your decision-making, I think you have 2 great options.</p>

<p>For my son, who attends a small private school in Ohio which will be sending many kids to elite colleges next fall (all the Ivies, MIT, U of C, Cal Tech, etc), Tulane represents an opportunity for him to go to a school that has a national reputation of excellence, with a student body descending from all across the country coming together to study and grow into mature adults in the very cool and unique setting of New Orleans. My son’s high school has historically sent a few boys to Tulane every year and they have been well-served according to parents and guidance counselors. My son was also concerned about the school’s overall reputation and “partying”, but after visiting the school twice (including Top Scholars weekend which perhaps you also attended as a Presidential Scholar) he came away with a sense of incredible access to, and support by, faculty. While there, we ate lunch with a Physics prof who regaled the undergrads he had working in his lab. Also while visiting Tulane, my son met up with a premed student (an acquaintance from Colorado) who gave all the credit for his receiving a summer internship at the Mayo Clinic to his profs/counselors at Tulane. Like yourself, my son absolutely wants a school were studying is valued, but also where he can enjoy social aspects of the school. He is very excited about the new Yulman football stadium and the intimate basketball gym (the smallest gym from which ESPN will still broadcast) at Tulane.
My son was also considering a highly regarding research institution in Ohio (not OSU), but in the end, felt that the college experience can offer him, by broadening his geographic horizon, an additional aspect of who he will become as a mature adult. He felt he already “had Ohio in his back pocket”, so to speak, and spending the next 4 years in the South will expand his world (and after this horrific Ohio winter, we’re excited to go visit!). I hope this helps. Good luck…and again, you have 2 great choices!</p>

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<p>Received an e-mail from Tulane today about research with a link to this page about research opportunities <a href=“https://tulane.edu/research/research-for-students.cfm?utm_source=Fire%20Engine%20RED&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=no-melt.student.research-ops&utm_source=Fire%20Engine%20RED&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=yield.parent.research”>https://tulane.edu/research/research-for-students.cfm?utm_source=Fire%20Engine%20RED&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=no-melt.student.research-ops&utm_source=Fire%20Engine%20RED&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=yield.parent.research&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

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<p>@dolphnlvr6‌ - That’s a great page. I hadn’t seen that before. I would like to emphasize to incoming freshmen that might think they have to go through those channels, that is not the case. If you find a prof you really like and/or is doing work that really interests you, you can go straight to them and ask if you can do research with their group. But these channels are excellent for getting suggestions and, apparently, to possibly obtain some small grants. Neat.</p>

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<p>Let’s not forget that Tulane is premed-heavy; if 10% of Tulane grads end up in med school, and 73% of Tulane grads that apply to med school are admitted somewhere for med school then Tulane is doing something right in that aspect.</p>

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<p>@Catria - That’s an excellent point. There have definitely been enough premeds at Tulane for decades that Tulane knows what it is doing in terms of advising in this area. Tulane isn’t unique in that regard, all the top privates have a lot of premeds and they all do a good job helping their undergrads as far as I can tell. But I do think the strong undergrad research activity at Tulane is a very big plus that probably helps put some borderline admits over the top.</p>

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<p>Thank you everyone for all the support!!! Ultimately, OSU’s in-state tuition (plus an additional scholarship that I was awarded) made it too favorable to pass up, and after visiting and having a very positive meeting with the neuroscience advisor, I decided to just commit to OSU. This was a really great thread though… Tons of insight and perspective on Tulane pre-med and research opportunities!! I hope it will be able to help someone else as much as it helped me.</p>

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<p>Best of luck at OSU! It is usually smart to go with the more economically favorable school, if the difference is fairly large. Of course if you stick with the med school path, you can always apply to Tulane Medical School.</p>

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<p>If you think Tulane Med is right for you, then aim for 3.8/44+… then again, this is assuming the new MCAT section is scored on 15. (A 44 in the post-2015 environment is more like a 33 today)</p>

<p>On a sidenote, every Tulane grad with 3.8/31 or better got in somewhere for med school… but I wonder whether a 3.8/31 will really be competitive for Tulane Med.</p>