Rankings are so inconsistent… and wildly different based on methodology and other factors. So choose the one with the methodology you like.
Here is Washington Monthly’s: We rank four-year schools (national universities, liberal arts colleges, baccalaureate colleges, and master’s universities) based on their contribution to the public good in three broad categories: social mobility, research, and providing opportunities for public service. We also rank Best Bang for the Buck colleges, which help non-wealthy students obtain marketable degrees at affordable prices.
W&L #4 Best LAC 2022 (after Harvey Mudd, Pomona, Weslyan)
W&L #1 Best Bang for the Buck 2022 - Southeast (ahead of Georgetown, Duke…)
There are other rankings placing W & L in top 10 of happiest students, student retention, social mobility, commitment to service… pick the ranking you like that supports your point. They are out there.
To the OP, so while I believe rankings are good at a high level, especially when forming application lists, at a point they are somewhat meaningless unless you want to dive into data and methodologies to find ones that reflect your student’s personal preferences.
Likewise, as your son evaluates his options, your family can determine how much weight to give anonymous posters on the Internet, whether or not they have any affiliation with the schools in consideration. The priorities of others when considering a college do not matter; only yours do.
The Chetty study is not a magazine ranking. It was an academic study of economic diversity and social mobility in higher education, based on millions of anonymous tax records and tuition payments. It was spearheaded by Raj Chetty, a renowned Harvard economist.
From the NYTimes profile on the study:
At 38 colleges in America, including five in the Ivy League – Dartmouth, Princeton, Yale, Penn and Brown – more students came from the top 1 percent of the income scale than from the entire bottom 60 percent.
38 colleges had more students from the top 1 percent than the bottom 60 percent
STUDENTS FROM … THE TOP 1%
($630K+) BOTTOM 60%
(<$65K)
Likewise, the percentage of Pell Grant recipients is not a ranking either. If socioeconomic diversity is important to the OP or other prospective students, then both the Pell Grant percentage and the Chetty data provide relevant information; and it is verifiable information. It is not made up by “anonymous posters on the internet.”
Hamilton would be amazing for public policy and provides a pure undergraduate focus. For this combination of characteristics, and for its fully coordinated internship opportunities in Washington, it could be the best choice for your son.
Thank you. For more information: have older son graduated from college looking at law school in fall. Would be nice to give him a year of GI benefits. Have family ties to Maine so DS thinking of state politics there if he goes to Bowdoin. For what ever reason Hamilton did not make his short list despite being an amazing school. Really tough decision. Visiting Bowdoin and Penn now
Update:
We are down to Washington and Lee, Bowdoin and U Penn. Had a great visit at Bowdoin. Liked Penn and waiting to visit W and L next week. Would love to hear Pros and Cons of these schools.
Thanks!!!
For a glimpse at W&L, and the kinds of contentious discussion its name (among other things) can raise, see the ongoing thread on CC, “W & L: Expectations vs. Reality.” As you’ll see there, the stigma of its name (or at least half of it) can be hard to move beyond.
The most important thing is what are the pros and cons for your student? Which school seems like the best fit for him? (Knowing that the W&L visit is yet to come)? It sounds like he maybe liked Bowdoin better than Penn?
I don’t think that W&L is at the same level as Bowdoin and Penn, but what I think really doesn’t matter! I am sure he will do well whichever of these schools he chooses.
At first I thought that comparing Bowdoin vs Penn would be easy to pick where the fit would be best. But maybe they are so opposite to each other that it makes it harder to choose.
Bowdoin
2000 students
Small class sizes from Day 1
Professors focused on teaching
Small town in Maine
Collaborative students
Penn
10,000 undergrads and 18,000 graduate students
A couple of years of large lecture style classes
Professors focused on research
Large city in PA
Many preprofessional students some who are known for their competitiveness
Where does your DS see himself most comfortable and excited to spend the next 4 years? When kids are happy, they can achieve great things. They will make great connections with their peers and professors. Then they can focus on finding a path to a great career.
As connects to opinion and information posted previously, such as that related to department strength and classroom experience, I’m inclined to suggest Bowdoin from this group of three schools.
The student has been to do. The third is no slouch. I know people have concerns and they are likely aware. The weather is better, Campus nicer (that’s opinion) and excellent academically.
I think they can decide which is right for them after visiting.
With the offers you have, if you can afford the others, it’s not enough a reason to attend.
But go visit. I wouldn’t sell it short based on the provided experience. If you see it as inferior to Bowdoin I’d say not - especially if the politics major is of interest.
If you have the concerns many do of the name, that’s different.
Well, I say this as the parent of a Johnson Scholar who is loving her time at W&L, the primary benefit of the Johnson is financial… the full scholarship plus $7k stipend. Yes, there is the cohort of kids who have a dinner and programming each semester, but there are no other real benefits such as priority registration like at some schools. And since Bowdoin is also at $0 cost, the difference is really the stipend… which may or may not mean that much to your family.
So when you are on campus, ask a lot of questions geared toward fit. Look at the curriculum, ECs, talk to students, talk to faculty,… W&L has lots of other funding available to all students for experiential learning (Johnson opportunity grants), but Bowdoin may offer similar funds. Dive into all of that.
I think someone else in this thread offered to connect your son with a current Johnson interested in politics… take them up on that introduction!
Our son is at Bowdoin and we know some at W&L. Those social scenes are very very different. I would be sure to visit and ask questions. Our son would have hated W&L.
They are out there.