@ShieldOfGod does that means receiving no LOR for L&S is a good thing? I haven’t got any request… 1530 SAT and 4.0 UC GPA out of state lol…
@mainer199 Well for L&S, it doesn’t really matter. So here’s the the whole process laid out to all of you. I have copied and pasted the following:
Your application receives two readings. Both readings result in one of three ratings: “Yes,” “Possible,” or “No.” Generally speaking, one yes is necessary (and typically sufficient) in order to get admitted to L&S, and two yesses are necessary in order to get admitted to the College of Engineering.
The author of the study created a regression of many “stats” (which for the University of California includes things like school ranking and parental income in addition to GPA/SAT/etc.) to “Admission Index,” which translates to statistical chance of admission based on modeled stats. The majority of applicants have a very low (<10%) “Admission Index,” so take that for what you will. Please bear in mind that this statistic, created by the paper’s author, is descriptive, not predictive.
LOR’s were sent out to applications that received “Possible” ratings on their first read-through. Those "Possible"s were generated by a mixture of actual reading (implying that Cal starts reading applications immediately, likely even before November 30) and computer-determined "Possible"s, judged entirely by stats and likely similar to the author’s “Admission Index.” Note that a “Possible” rating by either computer or human would result in an LOR request. They didn’t need to agree.
Only second readers had access to the submitted letters. Several readers “told me [the paper’s author] that they did not put great weight on them.”
An indication of the computer invitation model’s accuracy: “61% of applicants invited to submit LORs in 2016 received Possibles on their first read.” That number was up from 52% in 2015, and the computer model for 2017 is likely even more accurate. What that means: if you received a LOR request, it is more likely than not that your application will get “Possible” based on its first read. That means that if you applied to the College of Engineering and received a LOR request, you’re statistically very likely to be rejected come March, and if you applied L&S and received a request, you still stand a good chance of admission.
LOR’s help about 25% of the applications for which they were request. For the majority of applications, the first and second reads/ratings agreed, and a minority (15%) scored worse with LOR’s attached. My takeaway: think about who’s writing your LOR, and unless there’s a good reason they wouldn’t write you a good letter, attach one. Chances are it won’t hurt you.
Some few statistically strong applicants are invited to submit LOR’s. I would imagine that they come from a mixture of the non-visible statistics (school ranking, parental income, etc.) and desire to collect extra data for next year’s analysis of the effectiveness of collecting LOR’s.
TL;DR: If you received a LOR request, it almost always means that, according to Berkeley’s metrics, you are “borderline.” Of course, those metrics aren’t always right, and the chances are that you were determined to be borderline by a computer (but one that is right 60+% of the time). Submitting a letter tends not to hurt or help you, but you are helped much more often than hurt. So submit one if requested. If you received a LOR request and applied to the College of Engineering, it’s best not to get your hopes up for admission.
Hope this is helpful. CC doesnt allow me to post the link
@ShieldOfGod Very helpful! Thank you! A quick question: when you say “non-visible statistics such as parental income”, does this means low or high income applicants from OOS? Would the income level from OOS make a difference? I would think that if an OOS applicant comes from a high income bracket, it may be better since the possibility of yield is higher if admitted. (I am in the middle by the way and may not be able to afford the entire bill if admitted.) Please share your thoughts if you have an opinion, thank you!
@ShieldOfGod , thanks for the post. Very informative.
Same question as @thespian18, if parental income is considered, do you think they would like to see high income (for “full pay OOS”) or low income (for “social justice”)? Unfortunately, my S just randomly put in a number without asking me. Maybe he can still correct it before Jan 31st?
@ShieldOfGod Thanks! But does this apply to international students as well?
Regarding LOR requests, remember that the process changed this year. While UCB requested LORs from more than 30 percent of applicants last year, it is limited to 15 percent this year. Therefore, the process for determining who receives a request will need to change as well.
UC’s are need blind so income is not considered in admission decisions. Since OOS or International applicants get little to no FA, the UC’s can assume they are full pay and I am sure they take that into consideration when calculating their expected yield for these type of applicants.
Query: do requests for LORs come via email? I checked my portal and don’t see anything noted there, so am assuming if I didn’t get an email from Berkeley, they aren’t expecting me to submit anything further.
I got a LOR request from berkeley about an hour after i submitted my application. Also got an email for global edge, I’ll probably apply within the next day or so as it’s due the 5th. Cognitive science major (L&S) In-state, female, 4.0 weighted 1320 SAT (660 each) pretty solid EC’s and essay. I’d say I have glowing recs too. Good luck to everyone applying!!
@Ballsandstrikes I think I see what’s going on with LORs this year. This year, the number of LORs is limited to 15%, not 30% like last year, so those that received a request in early december/just after submitting application are the only ones that are ever going to get the request. The system of a human reading your application and then requesting a recommendation just isn’t happening this year. The only way you will be getting a request is if a computer thinks your stats are borderline. All the requests have already gone out. Does anyone have any contradictory evidence, such as a request coming after December 5th or so?
Does anyone know whether sat subject tests help if you apply college of Letters and Science?
They are not required testing anymore; however, they do satisfy admissions requirements (A-G requirements if they are a certain score or higher). And they only accept math II in terms of the math subject test. Look at the UC website for the A-Gs and alternative ways to meet them. If you have the classes, and the grades, and redundant subject tests, I have to think that helps.
@YoungOne4 oh I see… but does it helps in terms of admission to L&S?
One would think, but I’m not aware of any data
Sat - 1320 , major- business, International student, Predicted % - 92.8/100 , class rank since past three years - 1/30 , Essays - I’d rate them 6.5 or 7/10, Pretty strong ECs- National level table tennis player, Won a lot of Model Un conferences and in various debating events, have my own startup that has received great response, played Indian classical instrument ( tabla) and finished two exams of it with full marks, cricket captain of Club team and we’ve been winning the cup since past three years, volunteering done to UN share the meal and various other programs.
Applied 11/31. Just received a mail stating my application is received and under review. No update after that. Haven’t been requested LOR. I’m really worried. Chance me and please give me honest review whether I’m competent to go into my dream university. Thank you
Correction - Received a mail two days after I applied.
@Nealthakker not receiving LOR means whether you are definitely qualified or definitely not. Two extreme and you can see. Compare your data with international student profile:)
@Nealthakker btw I didn’t get one too and I’m international… but mine is a special case I think… I fill in wrong grading policy and grades while doing UC App and corrected it 16days latter which is December the sixteenth… also took my first sat with essay(only took sat without essay before) during December… but I still didn’t get it after I corrected all my grades and fill in my sat… so me too i’m really nervous right now…haha
Did anyone get an EC verification email?