<p>hey, im debating between the two schools right now. im an in stater, but because of scholarships and grants, usc will only cost me $1200 more than ucla each year.
im also going into premed...
which school would you choose if you were in my position? and why? thanks</p>
<p>Think about the condition the UC’s are in financially right now…</p>
<p>I agree with Arctic92 - even if usc costs you 1200 more, its better than gettin stuck at a UC for 5 years</p>
<p>First, let me say I go to UCLA.</p>
<p>I would just like everyone to stop having a ■■■■■ fit concerning the California financial crisis. Like most things in this world, it is blown out of the water and way out of proportion to support the needs of 1) UCLA and other public education entities as an excuse for driving up the costs of something that is, in principle, suppossed to be free (and then when the market rebounds fail to reduce costs) and 2) Those who hate UCLA and the public school system in general (these people do exist).</p>
<p>The financial crisis for the school is really unaffected. I mean sure, you see and feel the cost going up, but did you know USC’s cost went up just as much as UCLA’s did last year? Yes, classes are being cut and enrollment is over-capacity, but you still get all the classes you want, and I really don’t see how ANYONE can’t graduate in 4 years unless they changed their major late (sophomore/junior year), have decided to add a minor at the last minute, or took a year off. </p>
<p>I have plenty of friends at USC and they describe it as an extension of the high school academic experience in the sense of hand-holding. Sure, the classes are smaller and leads to more classroom interaction, but there is a point when there is too much one-on-one and not enough personal/independent study.</p>
<p>So, I guess you could say that UCLA is much more for the self-studier rather than the hand-holder, but both have their pros and cons.</p>
<p>I would see if your financial aid is guaranteed for 4 years. I’ve heard a few horror stories of individuals who recieved half-tuition scholarships, decided to go, and then they were not extended over their remaining years - these students either transferred or graduated with 75k+ debt. </p>
<p>Personally, if you could GUARANTEE that financial aid, I would go with USC, but that’s just based on a gut/personal feelings.</p>
<p>You said pre-med right? I believe USC has something where you are guaranteed entrace to their med-school or something like that, that is definately a perk. (I’m a Biz-Econ major and SERIOUSLY considered Pepperdine over UCLA and USC because they offer a 5 year dual BA/MBA that FORCES you to essentially network, get great internships, and essentially sets you up with a solid job post graduation, but I couldn’t afford it either)</p>
<p>Go visit the campuses.</p>
<p>I agree with the poster above.</p>
<p>The UC financial crisis is heavily exaggerated. For one, this is a USC thread, so you will only hear good things about USC and only bad things about UCLA. To be objective though, USC did also increase its overall costs just as UCLA did. When I applied to both schools, the cost of UCLA was ~$25,000. It is now ~$27,000. When I applied to USC it was ~$51,000. It is not ~$53,000. The only difference is that the LA Times only talks about UCLA because its a public school, which makes it a bigger deal with its tuition goes up. Privates control their tuition so if they want to make their tuition go higher or lower, that’s their deal. In addition, nobody at UCLA graduates in 5 years as a result of the budge crisis. The only people that graduate from UCLA or USC in 5 years are the ones that decide to double major, or double minor, or the ones that change their majors from Biochemistry to History during their junior year.</p>
<p>I don’t know about USC being a hand holding school, but my friends that go to SC and LA tell me both schools are huge and that you’re pretty much a number to them. Both schools will have lecture halls featuring 100+ students. Get used to it, that’s what you get for attending a large university. If you want personal hand holding and an intimate experience, go to a liberal arts college with a 2,000 student body.</p>
<p>thank you so much for you detailed responses, binks09 and notaznguy! very helpful =)</p>
<p>
Hahaha! You guys are funny. Two UCLA students hanging around the USC forum agreeing that UCLA is super-dee-duper (which I happen to agree with, by the way) and that USC isn’t as super-dee-duper (which I don’t happen to agree with).</p>
<p>Cute!</p>
<p>fruits and veggies,</p>
<p>Each year students come here with the same question. Please use the search function and you will find threads with all sorts of opinions.</p>
<p>The student who posted must not have felt the cuts personally, but these are huge and are now starting to affect academic life. Following are some excerpts from a speech from the Chancellor and quotes from a N.Y. Times article from October 26, 2009 in the next post. </p>
<p>Here are some statistics from U.S. News regarding the two universities. </p>
<p>From latest U.S. News:</p>
<p>Faculty student ratio:</p>
<p>UCLA 1/16
USC 1/9</p>
<p>Faculty Resources</p>
<p>USC 25th among national universities
UCLA 42nd " "</p>
<p>Giving Contributions to Alma Mater</p>
<p>USC 7th among national universities
UCLA 109th " "</p>
<p>Selectivity Rank</p>
<p>USC 20th among national universities
UCLA 24th " "</p>
<p>ACT Composite of incoming freshmen Both use same scoring method</p>
<p>UCLA 25-31
USC 28-33</p>
<p>Size of freshmen class 2008-2009 year</p>
<p>UCLA 4735
USC 2766</p>
<p>Council for Aid to Education, 2010 ranked all colleges for fundraising in 2009</p>
<p>USC was ranked 7th, ahead of UCLA at 9th</p>
<p>More information in the following post…</p>
<p>More on SC and UCLA…</p>
<p>From the article…NY Times Oct. 26, 2009</p>
<p>In the article students were quoted as commenting about large classes, inability to obtain classes in a sequence in order to graduate, sitting outside certain classes due to lack of room inside and dorm rooms for two now being used for three.</p>
<p>Speech from Chancellor…</p>
<p>UCLA will have a multimillion shortfall for 2009-2010. At UCLA class size has increased by 20% over the last three years.</p>
<p>There will be 10% tuition and fee increases. Eliminated have been 165 courses.</p>
<p>UCLA has reduced faculty and staff hiring, cut spending on equipment, travel and construction, consolidated data centers and communication networks. Faculty have taken unpaid furloughs.</p>
<p>Undergraduate student fees have increased 32%. Housing and parking fees will increase by 40%.</p>
<p>UCLA will lower faculty recruiting and has cut faculty, 95 lecturers and 109 TAs.</p>
<p>The university will reduce general funding support by 50% for research centers and 40% for teaching services. Student services will be cut by 10%. Other programs and capital projects will be cut by 5 million.</p>
<p>Average class size will rise to about 60 per class.</p>
<p>Two quotes…</p>
<p>“UCLA is critically endangered” and “Campus is overenrolled”.</p>
<p>This was from the UCLA website.</p>
<p>Binks,
There is a difference in financial aid and merit scholarships. Merit scholarships go up with the higher cost of tuition. The only way a student can lose a NMS half scholarship is if he/she did not make a 3.0 or carry the required number of units. There are some alumni scholarships which are for one year only, but a student knows IN ADVANCE these are one year scholarships.</p>
<p>Financial aid can be lowered if there is a change of circumstances in the family or for other reasons. Alamemom might explain this in more detail.</p>
<p>One more … RE: LA Times article on April 4. 2010</p>
<p>In a LA Times article by Jack Dolan he wrote about students at UCLA who were upset that $15 million of student fees funds would be spent on the renovation of Pauley Pavilion. Pauley is where UCLA plays their basketball games.</p>
<ol>
<li><p>Alamemom… did you even read my ****ing post? I said I would choose USC over UCLA. I never said UCLA was “super-dee-dooper” and USC wasn’t. If anything I said USC was better than UCLA. Don’t you have something better to do? I hear the phone ringing… isn’t it time for you to provide some commercial comfort to some homeless guy in South Central?</p></li>
<li><p>Georgia Girl… Your use of the search function is invaluable and will serve you well at USC, however, have you considered your data and the hyperolated negativity you are attaching to it?<br>
-Like I said, I have yet to meet someone SERIOUSLY complain about class schedules or fearing to not graduate on time - hell, I personally came in with AP credit for 2 classes and will likely graduate AT LEAST a quarter early if not two.<br>
-Multi-million dollar shortfall? No *<strong><em>, what do you expect when you are linked with public entity? Have you studied economics? Have you studied history? Heres the deal, theres this thing called the Invisible Hand (which I think just smacked alamemom across the face) that forces markets to equilibrium, like a pendulum, there will be highs and lows, and overtime, they will counteract eachother and produce a state of equilibrium.<br>
-165 course eliminations refers to this… What they did was they took classes that had multiple listings (say, 5 chem classes were offered fall quarter, they took away one and increased enrollment in the others by 20% to cover the difference) and cut them back.
-UCLA has cut back on workers and maintenance? It’s about *</em></strong>ing time. They are WAAAAY overstaffed and literally are spending money to create more jobs that really aren’t needed.
-OMG fees increased 32%. Oh MY ****ING GOD! USC went up the same amount, but since it already cost more, the percentage wasn’t as great… do you need to go back to algebra?
-UCLA has cut back on faculty and TA’s? Once again, about time… UCLA was giving tenure away like candy a paying teachers a full salary to teach 1-2 classes a year.
-UCLA will cut back on research efforts and teaching services? All the more reason FOR YOU to seek out your own help and internships.
-Average class size to 60, oh no!!! This means my professor in a current class of 40 will now have 20 more names not to know at the end of 10 weeks.
-UCLA is critically endagered, once again, YES THE CHANCELLOR SAID IT, in an effort to garner more sympathy, more money, and reason for an increase in fees. Campus is over-enrolled… sure, I guess - Whats the differenece between 25k and 28k? I can’t notice one.</p></li>
</ol>
<p>Of course this is from the UCLA website…</p>
<p>Most of these “cuts”, or as you call them, “travisties that tarnish the UCLA name”, are GOOD! UCLA is becoming more efficient, what a concept…</p>
<p>Now, lets look at some of you other data that is pro USC rather than just a straight bashing of UCLA…
-USC is more selective… selectivity is based on stats of matriculating freshman. USC gets some of the best due to their large scholarship base.
-USC has better faculty w/ more awards… of course… It’s like choosing to play for the Nets for 20 million rather than the Lakers or Cavaliers for 2 million.<br>
-USC has better fundraising… Yes it does. USC typically enrolls students who are wealthy, and typically, wealth stays within a family and is passed down. In addition, the Trojan Alumni network almost strangles you for life to donate back if you wish to continue being a member.
In essence, USC buys its rankings. I AM IN NO (Did you read that alamemom?) WAY stating that that is a bad thing, it’s a good thing as long as you humble yourself and realize the difference between hardwork and handouts.</p>
<p>Fruits and Veggies…
I’m sorry this thread has become like all the USC v. UCLA threads - a name-calling, below the belt hitting battle.<br>
Please refer to my original post for my opinoins on USC and UCLA. Maybe this hread will give you an idea of the students at both.</p>
<p>binks09: no worries, i actually really appreciate all the input =) i just hate it when no one replies to my threads.</p>
<p>thanks everyone!</p>
<p>
binks09, I *always *read your posts over here on the USC forum. Count on it :D</p>
<p>USC chicks dawg. USC CHICKS!!</p>
<p>alamemom, in no way did my post make ucla or usc seem super duper dee. If you reread my posts again, you’ll notice I mention how both schools raised prices, both schools don’t have 5 year graduates under normal circumstances, and how both schools are large universities that won’t hold your hand. Stop trying to make something out of nothing.</p>
<p>At the same time, I think everyone who reads these threads knows that Georgia Girl essentially copies and pastes the same thing on every board and purposely manipulates and skews data as well as eisegesis to promote USC. Even a neutral poster can see through that.</p>
<p>Btw I just thought there’s something interesting between this thread and other CC threads. Many other CC threads actually have students posting advice or info. The USC board has a bunch of parents who get their information from brochures, campus tour guides, or their “D’s” and “S’s” (please, is it really that hard to spell son or daughter?)</p>
<p>notaznguy, I just think it is adorable how you and binks hang out over here at the USC forum wishing you were a part of it.</p>
<p>And, because one is never too old to take good advice, I am off to find a dictionary to learn to spell “dawder,” um… dodder? dahtur??? I shall never refer to her as “D” again!</p>
<p>No, wait… the phone is ringing… it’ll have to wait!</p>
<p>^^^ Your gonna need all the small bills you can get to afford USC</p>
<p>This is a repost, but still relevant. </p>
<p>In response to notaznguy.</p>
<p>"
Yeah, but I think private school students have the mindset that when attending a private university they will be paying top dollar and increases are expected. I know my sister (who goes to USC) didn’t complain because she was provided with additional grant money to offset the increases (and ended up paying less than she did last year). But, I don’t know if that’s the case with all private schools. We’re in that weird middle-class funk.</p>
<p>I believe where the UCs are failing is that in its mission it states that ‘tuition’ is free, that’s why we pay ‘fees’, and that public education is suppose to be affordable and accessible to the public. Privates don’t have that obligation, that’s why there isn’t a student uproar about their tuition increasing. If a private school student cannot afford to pay private tuition price they typically transfer to a more affordable alternative such as a UC. Again, the UC student complaint is that our ‘fees’ are getting too high, UCLA @ ~30k per year, that the median CA resident cannot afford to attend. The UC students alternative when ‘fees’ have gotten too high is to go to a CSU. While a upper middle class student can go from an elite private to an elite public. A lower to middle class student must suffer academic quality by going to a tier 2 school from an elite public school.</p>
<p>The main point is that there should be an affordable QUALITY education available to the public and the privates obviously don’t have to fulfill that mission, the UCs do.</p>
<p>However, there is a debate whether the UCLA can actually provide a quality education, but I won’t go into that.</p>
<p>Go Bears."</p>
<p>One more thing about factoring in cost of education is figuring out whether you will be able to graduate in 4 years. Many of the kids we know at USC are able to get their bachelor’s in 4 & masters in the 5th year. I can’t say the same for the kids we know going to UC schools, as many are taking longer due to problems getting the courses they need from impacted classes & majors. The budget crunch has hit state schools hard around the country, including CA.</p>