UF and FSU Team Up on Tuitions

<p>From the St.Petersburg Times: <a href="http://www.sptimes.com/2006/10/08/Perspective/Too_cheap__to_be_great.shtml%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.sptimes.com/2006/10/08/Perspective/Too_cheap__to_be_great.shtml&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>By SHANNON COLAVECCHIO VAN-SICKLER
Published October 8, 2006</p>

<p>Tuition at the University of Florida is too cheap for the school ever to become great, says its president, Bernie Machen.</p>

<p>And he is confident his institution is hot enough that students will shell out more to get in, even if it means taking out larger loans.</p>

<p>"I don't think there's any question we could charge more," Machen says. "We had 20,000 applications for 6,700 spots this fall."</p>

<p>But he can't, under current rules for Florida's 11 public universities. And that irritates him. So he is pushing for fundamental changes in how the system works.</p>

<p>Florida has both low tuition and nationally recognized programs. Yet Machen insists UF will never be ranked among the nation's top 10 public universities - his goal - unless he can bring in significantly higher tuition revenues.</p>

<p>"My biggest problem compared to the other top 20 universities in the country is the student-teacher ratio," he says, frustration in his voice.</p>

<p>"I have the highest ratio, 23 to 1, compared to the others. They were at 14 and 15 to 1. I want us to be able to compete for faculty, in terms of salaries and workloads, with the other top universities. We're never going to make the real top tier until we equalize that."</p>

<p>Tuition this year for Florida undergraduates is about $2,200, not including fees for health and other services. That's barely enough to maintain the status quo, Machen says, and leaves little to improve the caliber of UF's faculty or the quality of its academic programs.</p>

<p>The state's smaller, less prestigious universities can keep their rates low, he says, but UF and even Florida State University should be allowed to charge more.</p>

<p>"It seems to me that we have different needs at different institutions," Machen says. "Some universities can't afford to charge more and still get students. Well, fine, but don't hold us back because of that."</p>

<p>U.S. News & World Report recently ranked UF No. 13 among public universities in the country, up from No. 16 last year.</p>

<p>It is the only one of Florida's 11 public universities included in the invitation-only, 62-member Association of American Universities. UF brought in more than half a billion in research dollars last year, thanks in large part to its esteemed medical school. UF has the highest admissions standards in the state, with a majority of admitted students scoring more than 1400 on the SAT.</p>

<p>It's little wonder bright students are passing up Ivy Leagues to attend. A recent USA Today comparison of tuition and fees at the nation's 75 flagship public universities put UF dead last. Florida State University was next to last.</p>

<p>Tuition at the University of Michigan is three times higher than UF's. Students at Penn State University pay four times as much.</p>

<p>The board that oversees Florida's 11 universities is considering a 7 percent tuition increase for undergraduates next year. That amounts to about $5 more per credit hour, or $155 a year for the typical student taking 15 credits per semester. It would raise an additional $27.5-million.</p>

<p>But that won't even put a dent in the university system's needs, says Mark Rosenberg, chancellor of the state university system.</p>

<p>"If tuition were to go up 41 percent next year, and 8 percent every year for the following five years, we would still be below the median tuition nationwide," Rosenberg says.</p>

<p>Last year, universities asked for a 5 percent tuition increase. The Legislature approved only 3 percent.</p>

<p>Why are Florida lawmakers willing to sell their schools so cheap?</p>

<p>Blame two popular state programs that obligate the state to cover hundreds of millions of dollars in undergraduate tuition each year.</p>

<p>Under the Florida Prepaid tuition program, parents lock in a tuition rate when their children are young and pay toward it all at once or during the years leading up to college. The state pays the difference between that locked-in rate and the rate in place when the student enrolls in a state university or community college.</p>

<p>The state's Bright Futures scholarship pays most or all of undergraduate in-state tuition for students meeting SAT and high school GPA requirements.</p>

<p>Last year, Bright Futures covered all or part of the tuition for more than 95 percent of UF freshmen. Nearly half of all undergraduates in the 11 state universities are on Bright Futures. Cost to the state: more than $335-million last year.</p>

<p>When tuition rises significantly, so does the state's obligation.</p>

<p>"The system is book-ended by those two programs, and it almost assures a minimalist approach to university financing," Rosenberg says. "It may be satisfying that we can provide scholarships for more than 40 percent of our students, but the question is, 'Is the quality of education sufficient to make them competitive in the world?' "</p>

<p>Machen doesn't think so.</p>

<p>"If you look at tuition and fees at each university in this state, for 15 credit hours, who do you think is the cheapest?" Machen asked. "We are. Now does that make any sense at all, for us to have the lowest tuition and fees when we are considered the top university in Florida?</p>

<p>"It just doesn't make any sense."</p>

<p>With higher tuition, Machen says he could offer higher salaries to retain his best faculty and attract additional professors who are tops in their fields. That would reduce classroom sizes and improve the education his nearly 50,000 students receive.</p>

<p>Now three years into his tenure, Machen has had no luck convincing lawmakers. But going into the 2007 session, Machen has support from a powerful ally - Florida State president T.K. Wetherell, the well-connected former House speaker and lobbyist.</p>

<p>Wetherell wants to get FSU into the AAU. Toward that end, he plans to hire 200 additional faculty over the next several years, to do work in interdisciplinary "clusters" meant to strengthen FSU's research and graduate studies.</p>

<p>The initiative will cost tens of millions, and higher tuition would help immensely.</p>

<p>So Wetherell says he'll be right there with Machen this spring, seeking the power to charge students more.</p>

<p>"Give us the authority, and we'll take the heat so legislators don't have to," Wetherell says. "Let's just add $1,000. Just let us try it for three or four years and see what happens. My guess is, the students will still come and every other university will want to do it."</p>

<p>The question is, will Bright Futures cover higher tuition? Or will students and their families have to pay the difference, either from loans or from their own pockets?</p>

<p>Wetherell says lawmakers could approve an "addendum" that allows Bright Futures recipients attending FSU and UF to have the higher tuition covered.</p>

<p>Financial aid could cover the difference for needy students.</p>

<p>Either way, something has to change, Wetherell says.</p>

<p>He points out that his granddaughter's second-grade tuition at a private school in Tallahassee costs about $8,500 a year. "As good as Machen and I are, asking us to run a world-class institution on half the tuition of a second-grader, well, it just can't be done."</p>

<p>We get the St. Pete Times, and the chart at the end of the article really blew me away! I don't want to see tuition rise for anyone, but the two presidents have a valid point. I wonder how UF and FSU have hung on THIS long, charging just a third of what other states' schools charge for tuition. And when you consider that most of the students are on 75% or 100% Bright Futures, it's downright scarey. Can the system survive like this?</p>

<p>And I loved the comparison the FSU president made with his grandaughter's $8,500 a-year second-grade tuition. He's right, too. Our local Catholic elementary school charges $7,500 a year. My old Catholic high school charges $8,500 a year now. (It was $350 a year when I went, a hundred years ago.)</p>

<p>Let me emphasize that I'd never want a raise in tuition to hurt anyone's chances of attending college. For right now though, they're suggesting an increase of only $150 a-year, or $5.00 a credit, and that sounds reasonable.</p>

<p>If 45,000 students paid an extra $150 a year, that would bring an additional $6,750,000 a year to each of the universities. It probably wouldn't solve all their problems, but it should help quite a bit. I think I'm leaning toward agreeing with the two presidents, IF they keep the increase to just $150 a year for now. A huge and sudden increase might force some kids to quit school, and that would be a real heartbreaker.
g8trmom</p>

<p>FSU & UF are consistently ranked top values by Princeton Review. It's not fair that these great universities can not charge what is required to truly compete on the national scene (Tragically the state of Florida is about to become the 3rd most populated state in the union, has the 4th strongest GDP, is projected to have the largest population increases, and yet our two best public universities are having trouble competing nationally due to a serious lack of funding).</p>

<p>I am currently a junior at UF and agree that tution needs to rise (even though its not a very popular opinion around here). Machen is heading UF in the right direction to being top 10.</p>

<p>would Bright Futures have to raise the requirements for 75% and 100% coverage with the increased costs?</p>

<p>thats one of the options.</p>

<p>the other i have heard is to make bright futures need based since 50% of the students that go to UF belong to homes that make $100,000 or more and its a strong likelyhood that a lot of them get bright futures.</p>

<p>NO! Too many households making 6 figures need that financial aide but get NOTHING because universities make outrageous estimates on what they should be able to afford. The middle class ALWAYS loses out when it comes to need based scholarships.</p>

<p>Just my opinion, but I dont think households of $100,000 and great are middle class.</p>

<p>One of UF current scholarship that is need based, gives money to student s that come from famailes that make $40,000 or less a year.</p>

<p>Let's say hypothetically that UF & FSU raise their tuition to a reasonable adjustment. In the highly unlikely event that some middle class students get excluded from the two universities, then they can still go to the rest of the universities in the State University System (SUS) at a cheaper cost. You should have to pay for the enhanced quality that these national universities bring. The simple truth is that both UF & FSU offer a superior product in comparison to the rest of the SUS. A degree from either universities are worth alot more than the rest of the state universities, and the loans that a student would incur at either of these schools easily make up for this. It is tragic that they are both being hamstung by Florida Bright Futures in their tuition rates.</p>

<p>Hmm... being substantially below middle class myself, I still agree with raising the tuition. Bright Futures should be able to support at least an extra 2-3 thousand per student (after all, it is funded by the Florida lottery).</p>

<p>And I agree with making Bright Futures need-based. Too many people I know have nice, expensive homes (with parents bringing in great paychecks, which is what really matters) and plan to go to UF/FSU/UM/wherever on Bright Futures. Doesn't seem right to me, but what do I know?</p>

<p>I totally agree. The benefits totally outweigh the negatives factors with raising tuition. With that extra money UF can get better and more well known professors (nobel, disting., etc,). The liberals arts and science funding problem would be fixed. Students would get more services geared towards them. Happiers TA, with high pay. I wish i would be there when we see the benefits (currently a junior) from higher tuition. I dont think it will happen in the time I have remaining there.</p>

<p>I am totally anti- higher tution. that's what makes schools in FL better than all others, IT'S PRICE, if I have to to take out loans for that I'll just go out-of--state. (NY-It's where i'm from and I love it ( I'll be going there for Law. S. that's for damn sure!)- See and that's because Law school is expensive everywhere so might as well pay for your ed, where you'll be happIEST.</p>

<p>i love Fl, but if i have to take student loans b/c of this guy "genius" idea, i 'll have to reconsider where I'll be going for undergrad, when I transfer.</p>

<p>If anything college tuition should be FREE like in europe-it's possible</p>

<p>It is a "genius" idea in my opinion.</p>

<p>I dont understand why people would be against it. When Machen said he wanted higher tuition, he wasnt saying he was going for $3,000 a year to $30,000. And from my understanding he wants to double the credit hr from $100 to $200, so tuition would be $6,000 instead. That is not that much compared to the high tuitions such as UM ($40,000 per year), UMic (~25,000/year). Currently UF only recieves 3% of its budget from tuition fees. Others schools could not even fxn with such a low number.</p>

<p>Neither FSU nor UF will be able to reach the levels they want without better funding. Both want to be nationally known for excellence.</p>

<p>If this happens, enough students will pay for what they get - an excellent education. More may even come from out of state.</p>

<p>Just because a household brings in between $100,000-$120,000 doesn't mean they're always in a position to be able to afford college without help. This income bracket already gets ignored when it comes to financial aide, and, believe it or not, having "that much" money doesn't mean you can stop worrying about finances. Especially with 3+ kids in college at the same time to worry about. Making Bright Futures need based would be a crime. UF basically told my parents they should be able to afford some outlandish sum per year for my education. Bright futures was a Godsend for us.</p>

<p>And no, I'm not saying this for my own benefit, I'm already in school and so are my siblings.</p>

<p>Even if UF doubled the in-state tuition to $200/credit hour it would still be an amazing value. As a parent, this would be out of my pocket, but I would still be all for it if it helped UF achieve its goals of a lower student-teacher ratio and increased educational quality.</p>

<p>sounds like one solution would be to increase the number of out of state applicants being accepted. this would get the university more $$ and not force them to increase their tuition rates. an increase of 600-800 out of state applicants accepted each freshman class (above the current level) would yield an estimated $10,000,000 windfall for the university. after four years of increasing the out of state population, this could result in a huge increase in revenue.</p>

<p>Problem with that is that many of the out of states students that go to UF, have large financial support through national merit scholarship and academic based scholarships. Its rare to see an out of state student that pays the full amount to go to UF. Most likely if they can afford that, they can afford some of the higher ranks schools that they might of gotten in to. Thus increasing out of state accepts probably wont have the benefits that you propose.</p>

<p>ASMAJ</p>

<p>good points. how do you know that? is that information posted anywhere? i still think more tuition revenue can be yielded from out of state rather than in state applicants. from what i have seen, UF has a lower then normal out of state population. univ of delaware for instance has nearly 50% out of state ( not to compare the two) but delaware is a state school</p>

<p>"UF has a lower then normal out of state population. univ of delaware for instance has nearly 50% out of state" </p>

<p>I wish that the University of Florida was allowed to take more out-of-state students (let's keep in mind that UF's administrators can set OOS tuition at a competitive rate, whereas in-state tuition is ultimately being kept down by the Florida Bright Futures scholarship). The legislature mandates that UF must take a very high percentage of In-state-students. Hopefully with time UF will get more autonomy from the Board of Governors & the legislature. From a political insiders perspective, I can guarantee that their are some wheels being set into motion that will allow alot more leeway for my Alma Mater.</p>