One thing to keep in mind - as up to 60% of kids don’t make it in engineering - you be assured that whoever is sitting near your kid in class on day one - at least one won’t be there the next semester.
They’ll have paths out of engineering…at least to an arts/sciences - like Econ.
They have to…
It’s not really complicated and I’m sorry they made it sound so.
At Orientation, you indicate DUS (or Pre Engineering, your choice).
ALL students have to meet specific “entrance to major” criteria, from whatever pre-major they were listed for. NO ONE is already “in” a major. This way, students can switch easily, and many do.
The process is selective (ie., you can’t get into Engineering if you failed Math and didn’t do well in several pre-requisites) but it’s not competitive (everyone who meets the standards has a place in the major).
As a student in Schreyer/DUS considering both Engineering and Business, she’ll need to take Math 140-141, the Honors section of Micro&Macro Econ (MUCH better as Honors: interactive and, while rigorous, fun), the 2 Schreyer seminars (137-138H), Chem 110, Phys 211, Engineering Design Seminar (Honors?), SCM 200H (Statistics for Business, Honors section). She’d need a minimum of C in each of them and at least a 3.0 at the end of freshman year (3.2 at the end of sophomore year) to be guaranteed the major-specific courses.
She could also start in Engineering, take the above classes, and switch to DUS at the end of 1st semester if she decides she doesn’t like Engineering. Her Schreyer adviser will help map out her choices and possibilities:
You can look at the flow chart:
You’ll see 1st semester, as described above and on the flowchart, has a lot of overlap for Engineering and Business (only class that doesn’t “count” for both is Engineering Design, and I’m not certain it’s required the 1st semester though it’s required the 1st year).
Most importantly, she will have a personal adviser who knows her, her goals, etc., and will work with her.
Schreyer is considered one of the top 5 Honors colleges in the country. The reasons for that are related to the quality of faculty advising&engagement, the financial support, the breadth&depth of honors classes, the special opportunities, the quality of programming&housing.
UF’s program isn’t in the same ballpark at all - the “perks” may superficially sound similar but the breadth, depth, and personal support aren’t there compared to Schreyer.
(For comparison, FSU’s and UCF’s Honors Colleges are a notch below Schreyer but still considered excellent. FSU and UCF use their programs to attract students who are likely to have been admitted to UF but want a less impersonal university experience.)
“Honors” isn’t in itself what matters for employers. However, “Honors”, and especially Schreyer, facilitates so much, that all the opportunities and special experiences make the resume stand out.
The decision here would be an easy one. Schreyers is one of the BEST honors colleges in the country. The support, network and opportunities in this honors college are second to none. Negatives to UF are no guaranteed housing (unless it’s different for honors students), having to take 9 credits one summer (FL requirement for public schools) and I would not have a daughter in Florida given some of the issues with the state administration.
That is an overcomplication.
you cannot transfer straight from Business => Engineering without spending a semester in DUS. you cannot transfer straight from Engineering => Business without spending a semester in DUS. That is purposefully designed to prevent all the engineers who struggle to just go straight to Business.
As to getting IN the major - the process is the same from DUS or from Business pre-major (if she is admitted into Smeal). It is a 3-step process
There are no other requirements. If you fulfill those basic requirements, you are in the major. For engineering, it is a similar process - the ETMs are different, the credit window is different, the gpa is different, but again, you know that list when you enter as a freshman and it does not change.
DUS advisors work with kids who are undecided. If she truly has it narrowed down to Engineering or Business, then that actually is easier - they can focus her on those two colleges. Where the struggle is real is when kids don’t know where to start, spend 2 or 3 semester ‘exploring’ and then need the classes and are running out of credits in the window to get into their major.
@MYOS1634 looks like you’ve nailed it and I’ve repeated much of what you said. sorry about the repetition - I typed this and then decided to bake!
I am just curious how you know this. You may be 100% correct, I certainly don’t know otherwise, but have you had kids at both schools, or are you going by rankings that are posted online?
I know this from professional knowledge, built from years of experience.
Basically, FSU Honors is competing with UF for the same students (or same profile): either they choose the prestige that UF has in Florida (and in the SouthEast), knowing all their peers will be high-caliber, and want the big university/big lecture hall environment, or they choose the smaller environment of the Honors College at FSU, which is a very different proposition educationally, while both offer big spectactor sports. UF Honors isn’t really a big deal for students who have been admitted to UF and want to attend. It’s not going to be make or break for them. As a result, UF’s Honors College really isn’t a focus.
Penn State Schreyer wants to attract Ivy wannabes (or kids who were gunning for Top20s and either didn’t get in or, often, couldn’t afford to go). It’s competing with this type of environment and opportunities.
I’m not aware of Honors College rankings online like USNWR’s for colleges.
There’s a very thorough website that details every honors college at flagships though, including number of Honors courses as replacement for “regular” courses, class sizes, quality of academic and non academic curriculum, special courses, support for research, special opportunities (esp. wrt national fellowships and prestigious outcomes), housing, study abroad, etc, etc.
For the past 10+ years PSU-Schreyer, USC Honors, ASU-Barrett, UT Plan-II have consistently ranked as the best honors colleges in the country - there’s no Number 1, number 2, etc, they’re all in the same group together.
At UF, she would be “Exploratory major” (same as “undeclared” or DUS at PSU). She WOULD have to choose between “Social sciences” and “Science&Engineering” and, regardless, would be associated with College of Liberal Arts&Sciences. Or she could register with the College of Engineering as Exploring Engineering and would have to add the Business “critical tracking” courses to the semester plan. Students will then take “critical tracking” classes and must have a 2.5 at the end of Semester 1, 2.75 at the end of Semester 2, to be considered for their chosen major.
You can look at the semester-by-semester tracking.
The 1st year could work with the same progam as at Penn State (ie., the 2 Econ classes, Stats, Calculus for Engineering (not for Business), Chem, Physics). There seems to be a little less leeway to pursue both interests though since the path tracks semester by semester rather than over 2 years.
https://catalog.ufl.edu/UGRD/colleges-schools/UGENG/UES_NOD/#criticaltrackingtext
https://catalog.ufl.edu/UGRD/colleges-schools/UGBUS/MGT_BSBA/#criticaltrackingtext
The 75%/25% SAT distrubution for the freshman class at the UF Honors College is 1490 - 1550. That aligns with the Ivies. What is the stat for Penn State Schreyer?
I know kids at the UF Honors College right now. It was a big deal to them and a huge part of their decision to attend.
There are many excellent resources on CC. These people are very knowledgeable about colleges and the admissions process. I suspect many are or have been admission officers, college administrators or admission consultants. I suspect @MYOS1634 falls into that area.
Schreyer is a fantastic opportunity. It’s about as close to an elite, LAC type education at a large school as you can get. Considering COA in-state is around $35k minus scholarships it’s a gem, if you’re lucky enough to be admitted. FWIW I’m a Pitt grad from many years ago. It pains me to praise PSU.
Schreyer doesn’t look at test scores. Lots of essays. I believe the professors read them. I’m assuming they have a pretty good idea who would benefit from the program and add to it.
The few I know of from our HS were Ivy caliber students. I’ve also known several NMF kids who didn’t get in.
I don’t think anyone is comparing the stats of the students between the programs. I’m sure the UF honors program has top caliber students. The comparison is between the quality, depth and breadth of the programs. That’s where Schreyer is a step above.
Hmmm…
Exactly the same with the UF Honors College.
I don’t know what this means.
Hello, thank you for replying. For UF honor program, other than honor housing and preregistration, are there other benefits such as many honor courses, networking events etc? Thanks
Yes, there are courses specific to the UF Honors College and many different types of events. You can find these detailed online and on their social media (Instagram, etc.).
This topic was automatically closed 180 days after the last reply. If you’d like to reply, please flag the thread for moderator attention.