Under 3.6 (GPA) and Applying Top 20 Parents Thread

Parents Forum
141

<p>

</p>

<p>Pizzagirl–I’d say your list is quite reasonable. I’d recommend that you add Tufts to it. I know you mentioned your S’s strong interest in IR/history. Tufts has an excellent IR program. Since you’re going to Boston anyway, it would be easy to visit Tufts while you are there. D1 and her husband (both '05 grads) were kids with 3.6 GPA (son-in-law a little lower) and SATs in 1400-1500 range (D–low 1400s and Son-in-law–low 1500s). A few years ago Tufts added an optional question. If you look at the website, you’ll see that the question really allows for a great deal of creativity and provides another way for the applicant to provide a picture of himself/herself. Tufts seems to make an effort to get kids from outside of the northeast. There’s also a Judaic studies major–your son could take Hebrew (Tufts requires two years of a foreign language for graduation).</p>

142

<p>ellemenope --Used frequent flyer miles, earned frequent flyer miles, used Amtrak free miles, too. Also combined many of of the visits with vacations. DH specializes in the five days/5-7 schools death march. I did the local/short drive trips.</p>

<p>Fortunately we are all seasoned travelers!</p>

143

<p>I was wondering if I could join this thread.</p>

<p>DS - 3.5 unweighted ( I think -school doesn’t report UW), 3.75 weighted and a 31 on the ACT. Not many EC’s (football 4 years, starter and captain this year, and one other EC). Rigorous prep school. He’s not in the top 10%. Probably 25% but the school doesn’t rank. There’s only 70 kids in his class. He has 2 AP classes under his belt (both 5s) but is taking 4 senior year. No hooks at all.</p>

<p>His performance is very inconsistent. Will probably be a National Merit Semi-finalist (but only by the skin of his teeth). Has won several National Latin Exam awards but beyond that, nada.</p>

<p>When you look at Naivance, he is always an outlier at his reach schools. High on the ACT, not so good on the GPA. Even on his matches, he tends to be on the right lower quartile.</p>

<p>High reach schools are Duke, Emory, U of Chicago, and LAC honors program.</p>

<p>His counselor has come up with Kalamazoo, Lewis and Clark, Lawrence and St. Oalf as potential matches. He also suggested Reed as a high reach, American as a match and Carnegie Mellon, George Washington, Claremont-Mckenna, Macalester and Skidmore as lower reaches but DS has not shown any interest in those.</p>

<p>Anyway, I am looking for a home on CC. Feeling frustrated because our state has few good matches for son. The LACs are safeties for him and he’s not really interested in them but I’m not convinced that when it comes to decision time he will leave the southeast. He is quiet and shy and has never liked even going to camp. For that reason, I don’t see him going half-way across the country for school. He insists he wants to get out of the SE but,well, I’m not feeling real confident that he will ultimately decide to do that. Unfortunately, that will leave him only with the LACs (all big universities) as choices and we’re not sure that it will be a good fit for him. Any advice welcomed!</p>

<p>Also, my apologies in advance if I am on the wrong thread. The only other thread I saw was 3.2 and under.</p>

144

<p>DebbieS7, it looks like you’re in the right place. Welcome!</p>

145

<p>^^ FYI, DebbieS7, LAC generally refers to small, solely undergraduate liberal arts colleges (not the arts & sciences of a larger university).</p>

146

<p>DebbieS7, when you say LAC, what do you mean? As Keilexandra says, on College Confidential, LAC means a liberal arts college. In your list, Reed, Lewis & Clark, St. Olaf, Lawrence, Macalester and Claremont-McKenna are LACs (maybe Skidmore, I’m not sure).</p>

147

<p>^ Yes, Skidmore is an LAC.</p>

148

<p>Ah, I see. I’ve been reading CC for a while and for some reason I thought that LAC meant Local Area College. My mistake, thanks for correcting me.</p>

<p>Yes, his counselor has suggested that a liberal arts colleges would, in general, be a better fit for son. Obviously, our state universities are not LACs. There are a few LACs in the state but none that appeal to son.</p>

149

<p>Kalamazoo would love your son, DebbieS7. Would he want to play football in college? A small liberal arts college would give him that opportunity.</p>

150

<p>

</p>

<p>Probably not. He plays on the offensive line but he’s not huge. He’s 5’11 (will probably be 6ft) and 180 pounds. He’s actually pretty good but he’s was sort of ‘pushed’ into JV football by his peer group in 7th grade (small school) and has only stayed with it reluctantly because he is good and he doesn’t want to let his friends down. His team has won the regional championship and has been through 1-2 state playoff rounds every year sine he’s been on varsity. Every year a few of the football players get recruited to LACs and one made it onto a SEC team this year but that kid was huge (OL, also) 6’6" 250 pounds.</p>

<p>He might be willing to try to walk-on once he gets to college but right now he says he’s not interested.</p>

<p>Kalamazoo is one of the schools on the list that has piqued my interest and we plan to visit in December (after football season).</p>

151

<p>Debbie, we recently visited Lawrence and were very impressed by it. It strikes me as a hidden gem. There’s quite a bit of money there too - one alum just donated $10 mil, another $16 mil and there is a lot of construction reflecting that. They really strive for diversity and the southeast might be a slight hook.</p>

152

<p>Pizzagirl, thanks for the feedback on Lawrence. I haven’t gotten around to looking at that one yet. Will definitely take the time to research it. Son’s counselor said there are a lot of hidden gems on his list. Most I have never heard of but am starting to like the sound of a lot of them.</p>

<p>I have wondered if the southern thing might be a tiny hook for some of the colleges. We’re in South Carolina - that’s about as southern as it gets. My husband was born and raised here but I’m from the NE, so son has a good mix of southern culture and that of a Yankee. I taught him to say ‘you guys’ instead of ‘y’all’. Irritates the heck out of my husband and his family. LOL.</p>

153

<p>

</p>

<p>A quality EC with demonstrated commitment is a lot more important than quantity. A long list of ECs does not get you anywhere, but one dedicated EC with great result does. Your son’s EC is fine.</p>

154

<p>Can you talk about that more? I want to believe you … but I also see the legions of kids with perfect scores / GPA AND outstanding EC’s that are getting rejected left and right.
How important is it, IYO, that it’s a “traditional” EC (by which I mean captain of the state-winning football team, winner of Intel, etc.) vs a “non-traditional” EC?</p>

155

<p>First of all, I’m not saying having a lot of ECs is a bad thing by itself. There are kids who can do multiple things and still do them all very well. So as long as the student can shine through one or two of the ECs, then there is nothing wrong with a long list of others. In fact, in this case, the long list would actually highlight the student’s bandwidth for different tasks.</p>

<p>

</p>

<p>A lot of elite colleges themselves have stated on their admissions websites that there is no one set of criteria or formula for admission. Yes, we are going to see rejections that we can’t fathom, but the fact is statistically the “better” students have 'better" chances. Our job is to help junior be that “better” student, despite a sub 3.6 GPA.</p>

<p>

</p>

<p>I don’t think a “traditional” EC is necessarily better than a “non-traditional” one. Sure, an Intel or Siemens award is fantastic. It is fantastic because it has established a tough selection criteria which would require the participant to put in a lot of quality work and creativity. My son’s a Siemens semi, believe me, it is a LOT of work on top of his school work. It may be easier to show quality work from a traditional EC, but as long as the EC shows consistent quality work, creativity and great result, it really doesn’t matter whether it is traditional or not.</p>

156

<p>I am interested in your strategy here. Many people use the pyramid strategy - 1-2 safeties, 3-4 matches, 4-5 reaches, and 5-6 high reaches. This strategy makes sense for students that don’t go beyond high reaches. The idea is a student’s stats are in the range for those high reaches, but not in the top 50-75%, the idea is the more you apply there is a better chance that one would stick. I think you all must admit that the top 20s are probably super reaches for kids with 3.6 and below. Would you apply to a lot of super reaches to improve chances, or just a few that the student has some sort of hook (legacies, boy applying to a LAC, girl applying to an engineering school). As most of you are also aware, many schools below top 20s need a lot more love - their essays are longer and harder, they want to make sure the student has visited, maybe contacted one or two professors, show there is a particular program that is of interest.</p>

157

<p>

</p>

<p>Keep in mind that “stats” is a combination of GPA, test scores & ECs. From the postings here, I see a lot of low GPA but high test scores.</p>

<p>Whether safeties or super reaches, I think kids should get to know each and everyone of the schools they apply to beyond just stats from USNWR or “my parents told me to apply”. They should be convinced that these schools really could work for them and support their interests. As far as applying to the T20s, kids have to understand and welcome the competitive atmospere and the significant academice challenges from their peers when many classes are graded on a curve. I know kids who had turned down T20s because they didn’t want to deal with the competitiveness. That said, I don’t see anything wrong with the pyramid strategy.</p>

158

<p>Debbie, Sewanee might be a good target if you really think he’s not going to want to leave the south but wants an LAC.</p>

<p>PaperChaserPop, Intel/Siemens, etc. are no guarantee of acceptance at a top 20. Even H rejects them.</p>

159

<p>^ I’m aware of it. That’s why I wrote “better” chances.</p>

160

<p>Does anyone care to provide a short list of top tier colleges that may be more receptive to students with under 3.6 GPA, but high others? It will be great if we can see some acceptance examples.</p>