<p>What would be everyone's pick for colleges that are either a) treated worse than their level of academic excellence or b) don't live up to the hype? (Note: USNWR ranking isn't what I think we want to take as a placement guide. Public perception is a better metric of the 'hype,' IMO.)</p>
<p>My picks (With reasons):</p>
<p>Overrated: If I had to say one school was overrated, it might be Penn (note: they did reject me, so maybe take this with a grain of salt). It just seems to me that while their CAS is excellent, much of the hype is the result of Wharton...and an amazing undergraduate business school does not an all-around excellent university make.</p>
<p>Underrated: Rice. This is the elephant in the room for me (Note: I'm not a student. I didn't even apply). It seems like they get a bit of the short end of the stick because they're an engineering-dominant school in the south, but they continually get the best college life awards as well as being in an excellent place for medicine and having an exceptionally strong engineering program. They're somewhat recognized, but not nearly enough, IMO.</p>
<p>Underrated: Rutgers, at least by New Jersey residents posting here. State schools in New York and other northeast states also compete for underratedness.</p>
<p>Overrated: New York University, although students seeing it as a dream school due to its location seem to be less common now than before.</p>
<p>I agree rice is definitely underrated.</p>
<p>As for overrated, Berkeley. They get so much hype from the grad programs while the undergrad fails to excel like the grad programs do.</p>
<p>^ Umm, they don’t rank too many undergrad programs, but for the ones they do (business and engineering), Berkeley’s programs are top 3. </p>
<p>I’d say Duke is overrated. Its prestige is derived from privileged old tobacco money and being selective for undergrads. The faculty research accomplishments don’t hold a candle to the universities it’s ranked with in the USNWR. Biomedical engineering is its only standout major - which, IMHO, is an extremely limiting degree for undergrads. </p>
<p>This thread is not going to end well. It is way too controversial. </p>
<p>@ucbchemegrad <a href=“Duke Researchers Cited for Their Influence - Research Blog”>Duke Researchers Cited for Their Influence - Research Blog;
<p>And although research is important, it is not as important for an undergrad. For undergrad, teaching is most important and on rate my professor, duke is ranked as the best school as rated by the students <a href=“http://www.ratemyprofessors.com/toplists/topLists.jsp?list=topuniversities”>http://www.ratemyprofessors.com/toplists/topLists.jsp?list=topuniversities</a></p>
<p>Therefore, I think duke is not overrated.</p>
<p>Girls, girls, you’re both pretty…</p>
<p>One way to expose overrated and underrated schools, systematically, would be to compare the US News peer assessment scores, or GC assessments, with either the overall ranking or with other components of the ranking.<br>
(<a href=“http://www.usnews.com/education/blogs/college-rankings-blog/2013/02/28/which-universities-are-ranked-highest-by-college-officials”>http://www.usnews.com/education/blogs/college-rankings-blog/2013/02/28/which-universities-are-ranked-highest-by-college-officials</a>)
For example, there is a large (15 pt) disparity between Berkeley’s PA score and its overall ranking. Depending on your point of view, this could indicate that Berkeley is either overrated or underrated. Ditto for Michigan (with its 16 pt disparity). Texas and Wisconsin have even bigger disparities (24 & 19 pts respectively). Do you believe the PA scores are closer to “ground truth” … or do you believe the other measurements are?</p>
<p>If you don’t like the overall US News rankings, use something else. Consider cross-admit data, for example.
If Parchment is to be believed, admitted students choose Duke over Berkeley by a 7 to 3 margin (<a href=“Compare Colleges: Side-by-side college comparisons | Parchment - College admissions predictions.”>Compare Colleges: Side-by-side college comparisons | Parchment - College admissions predictions.). Again, if you believe the US News Peer Assessment score reflects “ground truth” about undergraduate college quality, then the Parchment comparison suggests Duke is overrated relative to Berkeley (by admitted students, anyway). On the other hand, if you believe those HS students are better arbiters of undergraduate college quality than the “peers” are, the Parchment comparison may suggest either that Berkeley’s PA score is too high, or that Duke’s PA score is too low.</p>
<p>The US News PA scores seem to be more consistent with world university rankings (like ARWU) than with the overall US News rankings. World university rankings like ARWU seem to emphasize research output (as measured by publication and citation volume) and faculty quality (as measured by awards and distinctions). I think it is not unlikely that the US News Peer Assessments reflect the same interest in research productivity and faculty quality. The other US News factors, and the Parchment cross-admit comparisons, probably reflect different concerns or emphasis. </p>
<p>This thread should be closed. </p>
<p>^ Having said that, Duke’s research faculty is among the most productive in the world. The school attracts more research funding than virtually every other university in the US (it’s ranked 5th overall). Pratt is the most improved engineering school in the country. 23 Duke professors are members of the National Academy of Sciences (Penn has 22, Brown has 8, and Hopkins has 26). 34 Duke professors are members of the Institute of Medicine (Chicago has 13, Cornell has 17, and Yale has 40). 48 Duke professors are fellows of the American Academy of Arts and Sciences (Brown has 36, Dartmouth has 6, and Penn has 59). </p>
<p>Clearly Duke is competing with its peer schools on equal terms and outcompeting them in certain areas. Furthermore, if you look at the number of members who were elected in the last 20 years, Duke’s numbers will be even better. </p>
<p>Let’s not hate on some of America’s best universities. Berkeley and Duke are both phenomenal schools and anyone who is fortunate enough to be educated at either one of them is truly privileged :)</p>
<p>tk, cross admits do not take into account several factors, least of which includes financial aid and ED commitments. Cal will lose to virtually all private elites on both fronts. I am not sure that they determine institutional quality. Besides, it is fair to say that in the US, the USNWR serves as a great influence to many students choosing universities. In the case of high school children, universities ranked out of the top 20 (like Cal) will most certainly be viewed as inferior to universities ranked in the top 10 (like Duke). So I am not sure the USNWR or cross admit data proves much. I do not think the PA alone does either. It is safe to say that all well respected universities are probably overrated.</p>
<p>Totally underrated: Reed. (and don’t tell me it’s underrated because it’s not for everyone. Chicago and Swarthmore aren’t for everyone, yet they have <15% acceptance rates.)</p>
<p>And omg @Transferret Hahahahaha.</p>
<p>I don’t want to comment on the overrated part but Rice and Caltech are, imho, extremely underrated. They might not be huge powerhouses but that’s exactly where their strengths come from- their small student bodies mean that their financial aid, endowment/student, cost of attendance, etc., are on par with HYPMS. Looking at them in terms of financial/career outcomes- as well as experience (like Rice’s residential colleges or Caltech’s STEM-heavy environment and ridiculously skilled student body)- they just can’t be distinguished from HYPMS. Rice has a solid reputation in academia (which is great since Rice tends to be research-oriented) and Caltech consistently ranks near the top (or at the top) when starting salaries are considered- and does just as well (sometimes even better) in mid-career salaries. Caltech might not be as underrated (given their Shanghai ranking) but they need to be placed in the HYPMS tier. So HYPMSRC- or HYPMSC since Rice might just be a little bit weaker if you don’t factor in the undergrad experience.</p>
<p>On top of that, public universities as a whole seem to be extremely underrated when it comes to engineering. On the top 10 engineering schools ranked by ARWU/Shanghai (all American, yay!)- only 3 are private universities: #1 MIT, #2 Stanford, and #8 Carnegie Mellon. UC Berkeley, UT Austin, Penn State, UMich, and Purdue are all up there. They might not be as selective overall (although engineering schools tend to be way more selective than the overall university) and might be crippled by poor legislation (in the case of UT Austin) or funding issues (particularly in the case of the UC’s) but they still perform extremely well in engineering. Many of the top engineering public colleges easily outdo most private universities.</p>
<p>Mmm… I don’t know anyone who ever underrated CalTech, honestly.</p>
<p>@intparent Could be regional.</p>
<p>I live in the Midwest (have my whole life), and have always known that CalTech was at the top of the heap for STEM (I have personally always thought they were better than MIT… realize that not everyone would agree with this, of course).</p>
<p>Texas here, so it shouldn’t be too different. Caltech’s humanities department is also (surprisingly?) very good and seems to be underrated by their own students.</p>
<p>2014 Reuters Highly Cited Researchers List (the researchers represent the top 1% of most highly cited influencers in their respective fields):</p>
<p>@UCBChemEGrad you were saying something about Duke not excelling in research? Perhaps you should take a look at this comparison (Reuters has immaculate timing). Berkeley also did phenomenally well by the way. Congratulations are in order.</p>
<p>Duke beat every Ivy League school with the exception of Harvard. How’s that for research prowess? </p>
<p>Duke - 32
Princeton - 27
Hopkins - 26
Yale - 21
Cornell - 21
Columbia - 21
Penn - 17
Caltech - 17
Chicago - 10
Emory - 6
Brown - 5
Dartmouth - 3</p>
<p>Perhaps we should restrict the conversation to underrated schools. That should help foster a more collegial environment. </p>