undergrad engineering - public vs private

College Search & Selection
1

<p>Is private engineering college worth the money? We live in NY State, and Stony Brook, Buffalo and Binghamton all seem to have good engineering programs. Aside from the cachet of private schools, why would someone choose the financial stress of a private engineering program over any of those specific schools? </p>

<p>My son is in 11th grade in an elite public high school. He has an A average overall, A in science, A- in honors Math, 2300 SAT with decent but not extensive extra-curriculars. </p>

<p>Any feedback is greatly appreciated.</p>

2

<p>some private engineering programs are better than state ones. with your sons stats he could probably get into many engineering programs - so don't limit him to just public ones. </p>

<p>the thing about money is, once again with your sons stats he could probably get some decent merit aid. i don't know your financial situation but, if your EFC is on the lower end, then you could probably get some good need-based aid. </p>

<p>you also have to take into consideration the fact that maybe, going a little into debt at like MIT is worth it. it might pay for itself in your sons years after undergrad.</p>

<p>but not too far into debt. 200k in debt is not worth it, not for any university. </p>

<p>good luck.</p>

3

<p>well it depends on what the private colleges are. In general, I find that for engineering, many of the top schools in this field are public like Purdue, UC-Berkeley, Georgia Tech, Illinois</p>

<p>SUNY-Stony Brook is good for engineering, not so much for Binghamton</p>

4

<p>suny stony brook is much better for engineering than binghamton.</p>

5

<p>vadennis, </p>

<p>Engineering employers are very egalitarian when it comes to starting salaries for BS engineering grads. You will not find a huge starting pay disparity graduating from more renowned programs vs. lesser known programs.</p>

<p>IMO, save the money and go to an in-state public. If however, your son gets into a school the caliber of MIT or Cornell I would definitely consider it, if costs are in-line with cheaper options or you can afford it.</p>

<p>I would not recommend a student get saddled with huge student loans for an engineering degree from a top program. His/her starting salary will not be enough of a premium to warrant the cost difference.</p>

6

<p>Cornell is definitely worth looking at with those stats.</p>

<p>Check out Case Western-- they give out fantastic merit aid (with those stats, in years past, you'd be looking at full tuition) and is a FANTASTIC engineering school.</p>

<p>Oh, and Buff is the best of the SUNYs for engineering.</p>

7

<p>^ I agree with UCB but with a couple of caveats. Your son's stats could make him competitive at many of the top engineering schools, of which at least half are public (UC Berkeley, Georgia Tech, UIUC, Michigan, Purdue). But the top privates (MIT, Caltech, Stanford, Cornell, Carnegie Mellon) generally give better need-based financial aid. So depending on your personal finances and EFC, that could bring the cost of a top private school down to the level of an in-state public. If you earn above $80K or $100K, though, the in-state public will almost always be cheaper. Don't expect any merit aid at most of the elite privates, however.</p>

<p>The one OOS public you might consider is the University of Minnesota which has a top 25 engineering program (better than any of the SUNYs) and reasonable OOS tuition pegged at $4K/year above the in-state rate (so currently about $14,800/yr for OOS). And with your son's stats he's very likely to qualify for merit aid at Minnesota which would bring the cost down further. Minnesota engineering is a terrific bargain for OOS students.</p>

8

<p>I agree with UCB, there is not much of a difference in starting salaries between the engineering schools (you can make $55,000 with a computer engineering degree even at New Mexico Institute Of Mining & Technology starting out). Unless your son gets accepted to MIT, Cornell, Caltech or Stanford, I'd go to SUNY-Stony Brook over a private school. SUNY-Buffalo is also another excellent engineering school and if you are looking for cheap, engineering schools look at Virginia Tech, Minnesota, and Texas A&M.</p>

9

<p>Cornell's freshman class is usually like over 20% New Yorkers, so your son will have a great chance there. If he's looking for warmer weather and a bigger city, Berkeley is good and so is Stanford.</p>

10

<p>Thank you all very much for your responses! This is very helpful to us.</p>

<p>Two people mentioned Cornell. If you would, what makes Cornell engineering better than SUNY engineering programs? Is it $140,000 better? We will not get need based aid.</p>

<p>Do you get much better engineering work and research opportunities at select schools? Better future connections?</p>

<p>Would anyone be willing to give more details on engineering at SUNY Buffalo v Stony Brook v Binghamton? </p>

<p>UCBChem, thanks for weighing in. We are inclined to go with SUNY (or if he gets really lucky, Cooper) but we want to do a good search.</p>

<p>Rice, Carnegie Mellon and Johns Hopkins engineering are tempting because they have great music schools on campus. My son is classically trained (11+ years, recent winner of concerto competition) and it would be great to have conservatory level music on campus. But these schools are very competitive. Anyone want to hazard a guess re: Rice CM or Hopkins in terms of how much merit help they might offer him (or who tends to get merit help there?)</p>

11

<p>Engineering is not a prestige-centric discipline, and "name schools", while they matter, it is not to the extent that it is with some other career paths. Often, when posters extol the benefits of top privates for engineering, it is often followed by rhetoric about opening doorways to iBanking or hedge fund firms. As an aerospace hiring manager, I will tell you that NO simple undergraduate programs are really considered "prestigious"...because, at any of them, you will be considered to have insufficient education if you stop with just a bachelors. And if you are inadequately educated, how can we be really impressed no matter what the school? For any engineering positions beyond the most menial, we expect advanced degrees. If we do hire you with just a bachelors, in most cases we will expect you to enroll in a graduate-level program. So, if you expect to be engaged in state-of-the-art engineering research you will need to go to grad school....and quality publics are just fine for admission to any grad school in the country if you do well. So, if that is your intended career path, you might want to save money at your undergraduate institution, unless there is some other compelling reason to the contrary.</p>

12

<p>vadennis, I am going through the same process this year of finding a good engineering school since I want to be a civil engineer. Here are my conclusions:</p>

<p>"Two people mentioned Cornell. If you would, what makes Cornell engineering better than SUNY engineering programs? Is it $140,000 better? We will not get need based aid."</p>

<p>My Answer: If you are unable to get need-based aid or any scholarships. I personally do not think Cornell engineering is 140,000 better than SUNY Stony Brook or SUNY Buffalo. You will not have any problems getting a good and comparable job from either Stony Brook or Buffalo if you work hard at the school you attend since they are well regarded in terms of engineering in the US. I'd also look at some cheaper schools (as you mentioned Cooper Union) especially public schools. I can help you find some other reasonably priced schools if you want me too!</p>

<p>"Do you get much better engineering work and research opportunities at select schools? Better future connections?"</p>

<p>My Answer: You can get work experience at most engineering schools through a program called cooperative education (co-op). If you aren't familiar with the program, you alternate between school and working for a company anywhere in the US where you apply what you learn in school. By participating in the co-op program, you get connections with the company that you work with and many stay with their company and get a nice salary after college. Also I'm pretty sure all engineering schools will have research going on there.....it just depends whether the professors are interested in letting undergraduates participate (less so at a larger school like Ohio State). In terms of job recruitement, I don't think you should have a problem with SUNY Stony Brook or Buffalo. They are top 60 engineering schools.</p>

<p>"Would anyone be willing to give more details on engineering at SUNY Buffalo v Stony Brook v Binghamton?"</p>

<p>SUNY Buffalo: The school of Engineering and Applied Science is very well respected and it works with corporate partners in many ways ranging from joint-research ventures to continuing education to co-op work arrangements. Engineering is the most popular major at SUNY-Buffalo. </p>

<p>SUNY-Stony Brook: Science/Engineering school. Nearly half of the undergraduates major in the sciences and engineering. There are plenty of research opportunities. Professors are not held in the greatest regard since they are more focused on research.</p>

<p>SUNY-Binghamton: Not especially known for its engineering program compared to SUNY-Stony Brook or SUNY-Buffalo. I don't think SUNY Binghamton is in the top 100 or so engineering schools in the country.</p>

<p>"Rice, Carnegie Mellon and Johns Hopkins engineering are tempting because they have great music schools on campus. My son is classically trained (11+ years, recent winner of concerto competition) and it would be great to have conservatory level music on campus. But these schools are very competitive. Anyone want to hazard a guess re: Rice CM or Hopkins in terms of how much merit help they might offer him (or who tends to get merit help there?)"</p>

<p>If you think that Cornell is not going to give you any aid, I don't think you might get much from either colleges in terms of need-based aid since Cornell and Rice the most generous out of the colleges you mentioned. Carnegie Mellon, I know for a fact is not very generous when it comes to financial aid.</p>

<p>Hopes this helps, ask me if you have any further questions!</p>

13

<p>In terms of music, though not highly regarded, there is a good music program at SUNY-Stony Brook. Unless your son wants to major in music as well, I don't know if it would be worth paying extra money for him to go to a high-level conservatory school.</p>

14

<p>
[quote]
Rice, Carnegie Mellon and Johns Hopkins engineering are tempting because they have great music schools on campus. My son is classically trained (11+ years, recent winner of concerto competition) and it would be great to have conservatory level music on campus. But these schools are very competitive. Anyone want to hazard a guess re: Rice CM or Hopkins in terms of how much merit help they might offer him (or who tends to get merit help there?)

[/quote]
</p>

<p>I cannot express how much you should be considering Case Western then. Premiere music school on campus (Cleveland Conservatory) and the Cleveland Orchestra's home is literally on campus as well (ranked 7 in the world!). Add that to the fact that full tuition scholarship is well in range of your son and it's an EXCELLENT engineering school....</p>

<p>You'd be nuts not to think of Case if RIce, JH, and CM are attractive.</p>

15

<p>thank you, rogracer and pierre (and other responders,)</p>

<p>your detailed advice is extremely helpful to us.</p>

<p>our inclination is to save for graduate school. we are glad to hear our expectation confirmed that if you do well in a public undergrad engineering program, many doors may be open at the grad level. our son will need and want an advanced degree. </p>

<p>we do not want to rule out the privates with merit opportunities if they have substantial hidden benefits, and now we have a lot of great leads.</p>

<p>thanks very much for your help. and good luck to you, pierre!</p>

16

<p>hmm. I thought I posted thanks to melody, but I don't see it.</p>

<p>melody, many thanks. we will definitely check out case and we are very glad to hear about their music program and their good merit support.</p>

<p>thanks to all for your useful feedback.</p>

<p>V</p>

17

<p>I also heartily endorse Case for anybody who is price sensitive. Along with Case, I would seriously look at RPI and Rochester, which can offer some pretty enticing merit scholarships as well. </p>

<p>At Cornell, if your child is interested in bio-engineering, the program would actually be in the Ag school for the first three years, which comes with a rather enticing half-price tuition if you are in state. And if he is just interested in biology, environmental science, bio-chemistry, or statistics, the Ag school is the place to be.</p>

<p>In my view, the benefits of going to a top private school over a public like SUNY-Buffalo amounts to resources, peers, and opportunities. There will be more research opportunities and support for students, so the drop out rate is lower. One's peer group will be stronger, which is important not only for in-classroom learning but also for networking down the road. And all things equal, a school like Cornell or CMU -- or even Case or RPI -- would definitely open up more career doors down the road vis-a-vis a SUNY, to say nothing of a place like Stanford and MIT, especially if you want to pursue a career outside of New York State or even internationally.</p>

<p>SUNY-Buffalo has some great academic programs. The biggest drawback in my view is the campus and the relative lack of campus life. They made a huge mistake by putting the new campus in Amherst and not in the city.</p>

<p>One option that I know is fairly popular it to attend SUNY-Buffalo for undergrad and then go on to Cornell for a M.Eng or M.S. in engineering.</p>

<p>Is a top private worth $150k in debt? No. Is it worth $30-50k? Definitely.</p>

<p>The music program at Cornell is also quite good, for what it is worth.</p>

18

<p>

Given that, he may want to consider U Rochester. The music department is superb (probably the BA rather than the BM for him), and Rochester is quite strong in engineering and the sciences. He'd stand a very good chance of merit aid there.</p>

<p>School</a> of Engineering and Applied Sciences
Undergraduate</a> Degree Programs Offered by The College - Music
University</a> of Rochester : Money : Merit Awards</p>

19

<p>Here are the US News undergraduate engineering rankings for schools that have both an undergraduate and graduate program (on a scale of 1-5) and how much you can expect to pay for each school before financial aid packages and scholarships:</p>

<p>*Because of your sons impressive stats, I'm sure that he'll be able to get a scholarship at some schools.</p>

<p>4.8 Massachusetts Institute Of Technology $47,250
4.7 Stanford University $47,212
4.7 University Of California – Berkeley $44,034
4.5 California Institute Of Technology $44.583
4.5 Georgia Institute of Technology $30,621
4.5 University Of Illinois – Urbana – Champaign $34,098
4.4 University Of Michigan – Ann Arbor $40,591
4.3 Cornell University $48,194
4.2 Carnegie Mellon University $48,584
4.2 Purdue University – West Lafayette $31,154
4.1 Princeton University $45,695
4.1 University Of Texas – Austin $34,298
4.0 University Of Wisconsin – Madison $28,828
3.9 Johns Hopkins University $49,278
3.9 Northwestern University $48,420
3.9 Virginia Tech $25,905
3.8 Pennsylvania State University – University Park $30,892
3.8 Rice University $39,476
3.8 Texas A&M University – College Station $24,274
3.8 University Of California – San Diego $39,752
3.7 Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute $48,720
3.7 University Of California – Los Angeles $38,522
3.7 University Of Maryland – College Park $32,185
3.7 University Of Washington $30,468
3.6 Columbia University $49,306
3.6 Duke University $47,525
3.6 University Of Minnesota – Twin Cities $20,947
3.5 Harvard University $47,215
3.5 North Carolina State University – Raleigh $25,566
3.5 Ohio State University – Columbus $28,542
3.5 University Of Florida $24,861
3.5 University Of Pennsylvania $48,148
3.5 University Of Southern California $49,038
3.5 University Of Virginia $37,420
3.4 University Of California – Davis $40,634
3.4 University Of California – Santa Barbara $41,666
3.4 University Of Colorado – Boulder $34,796
3.3 Arizona State University $26,739
3.3 Brown University $47,740
3.3 Case Western Reserve University $44,842
3.3 Iowa State University $24,306
3.3 Lehigh University $47,320
3.3 Vanderbilt University $49,033
3.3 Washington University In St. Louis $48,884
3.3 Yale University $46,000
3.2 Dartmouth College $47,694
3.2 Michigan State University $30,271
3.2 University Of Notre Dame $46,675
3.1 Rutgers, State University Of New Jersey – New Brunswick $29,616
3.1 University Of Arizona $26,488
3.0 Auburn University$23,800
3.0 Clemson University $27,702
3.0 Colorado School Of Mines $32,874
3.0 Drexel University $42,575
3.0 Tufts University $49,538
3.0 University Of California – Irvine $37,442
3.0 University Of Delaware $27,348
3.0 University Of Massachusetts – Amherst $26,564
3.0 University Of Pittsburgh $30,686
3.0 Worcester Polytechnic Institute $47,270
2.9 Boston University $48,468
2.9 Colorado State University $26,770
2.9 Illinois Institute Of Technology $36,746
2.9 Kansas State University $23,379
2.9 Northeastern University $45,479
2.9 SUNY – Stony Brook $14,928 (in-state) $21,188 (out-of-state)
2.9 University At Buffalo – SUNY $15,684 (in-state) $21,944 (out-of-state)
2.9 University Of Illinois – Chicago $34,044
2.9 University Of Iowa $28,331
2.8 Michigan Technological University $28,094
2.8 Oregon State University $26,395
2.8 Rochester Institute Of Technology $37,416
2.8 University Of Kansas $22,251
2.8 University Of Rochester $48,060
2.8 University Of Tennessee $25,404
2.8 University Of Utah $22,768
2.8 Washington State University $26,655</p>

20

<p>Wow, Pierre, you sure have done your research! Kudos to you, and thanks - this is a great list.</p>

<p>And thanks to IBclass06 for info about U Roch - yes, we have a friend who teaches at Eastman (URoch music conserv) and it is top notch. </p>

<p>If anyone knows, what's the thinking about Rochester Institute of Tech vs U of Roch for engineering (beyond US News opinion)?</p>

<p>I'm shocked to see what U of M Ann Arbor is charging OOS these days. I lived in AA a long while ago and loved that town, but U of M looks less attractive at $40K. Hoo wee.</p>