Unemployed or underemployed recent top 20 college grads-why?

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<p>POIH:
It’s your posts that implied that attending the public HS was somehow ‘uncontrolled’ and would be an ‘experiment’ with one’s child. It’s that implication that I stated was ‘ridiculous’. I think you also didn’t understand the context of some of my posts in which I’m not knocking private schools and not even knocking the reasons one might choose a particular private over a particular public HS. Many parents have researched both publics and privates (including me and apparently ‘Jessiehl’) and reached the conclusions we did which were sound decisions. I don’t know anything about the private you chose vs. your local public HS options so I’m not judging that at all - I just think the implications and conclusions you’ve stated in your posts regarding the public HS option as ‘experimenting’ and ‘uncontrolled’ are presumptuous and uninformed. </p>

<p>But I think most of this may be due to semantics so I’ll exit this little sub-discussion with you.</p>

<p>At what point does a college education become “worth it”? Are we supposed to assume that the doctor in the OP’s example would be happy with an unemployed child if his “experiment” only cost $100,000? Will this same doctor suddenly feel he got his money’s worth if tomorrow his child gets a job with a company run by a Dartmouth alum?</p>

<p>I’m not asking some sort of existential question like, what is the value of education? I’m asking when do people feel that the tuition-room & board-etc. is worth it? Allowing for exceptions like engineering, medicine and a few others, if the only measure of value is getting a job right out of school, then for the most part your best deal is the local community college or a trade school.</p>

<p>ucsd<em>ucla</em>dad: I think I understand your reasoning and don’t have any objection to anyone choosing public or private HS as long as they have done the analysis.
But in my observation only very small % of people do any real analysis. Everyone generally buy home when their kids are young and make the decision based on their own criteria. People seldom move just because their kids have outgrown the local public schools.
That is why the term ‘experiment’ came into picture.
If you have rationally looked into high schools (public or private) without any constraints then you didn’t experiment.
When we were looking for HS school we didn’t have any constraint. We looked school all over USA. DD education was the foremost thing for us. We found the best possible match for her and it worked out very well.</p>

<p>Hmmm, but I’m not sure how many families can affort this kind of NO constraints search of HS all over USA. Most are not even able to relocate within the state due to job etc.</p>

<p>ParentOfIvyHope, I wish you would avoid commenting on what you think other people’s failings are. Even when you are trying to be nice, you are still (a) insulting, and (b) not very well connected to reality. People pay attention to school quality all the time when they are deciding where to live, and they often move to get their kids into better schools.</p>

<p>My old neighborhood, for example, is right on the edge of the neighborhood preference area for a relatively new public school run by the Penn Department of Education. The line goes down the middle of the street, and home prices vary by more than 25% depending on which side of the street you are on, with no difference in construction or lot size. You see the same thing in the suburbs, too – large price differences for similar homes a few hundred yards apart, when there is a school district line in between. No one with kids buys a house, or rents one, without thoroughly researching the schools.</p>

<p>In the city, after elementary school, where you live doesn’t matter so much, because students can go all over the city to magnet schools for middle school and high school. Most of the public school kids in my neighborhood go to a middle school/high school that is 10 miles away, because it is very high quality and easy to get to on public transportation (or catching a ride with Dad in the morning).</p>

<p>The ones that aspire to academic excellence compete furiously to convince students and parents to choose them over any others, and people debate the relative merits of the schools all the time.</p>

<p>^^^ don’t forget the charter schools in Philly too. My son spent grades 5-8 at one. He was in the first class of students when the school opened. It was better than what would have been his ‘neighborhood school’. If you follow the news, you’ll know what school I mean when I say the that principal committed suicide earlier this year because of financial improprieties that had been uncovered. Heck here is the article
[Charter</a> founder under investigation commits suicide | Philadelphia Inquirer | 05/13/2009](<a href=“http://www.philly.com/philly/news/20090513_Charter_founder_under_investigation_commits_suicide.html]Charter”>Charter founder under investigation commits suicide)</p>

<p>JHS: I do think it is true that people do pay attention while buying houses to the neighbourhood schools. But I think thats the extent of it. It might be true for the area you live in that the students are free to choose which HS school they go to but in most other places, the neighbourhood school is the only choice.</p>

<p>Still the intention was never to insult anyone and I’m quite well connected to reality.</p>

<p>blossom (119), thanks for your suggestions. My DS1 majors in Economics: i.e. big picture trends which don’t take him anywhere. He’s not a fan of statistics, but I think that’s probably the way to go for him. I’m going to steer him towards accounting too.</p>

<p>“But in my observation only very small % of people do any real analysis.
I do think it is true that people do pay attention while buying houses to the neighbourhood schools. But I think thats the extent of it.”
And what evidence exactly are you basing your sweeping assumptions on? Your own observations based on why your own family chose a neighborhood? Some secret nationwide research poll on why people choose private vrs public schools that only you are privy to? where is your proof that only a very small % of people do “real” analysis?? And if you have no proof beyond your own individual experience as a home buyer, then the “reality” is you are not aware of how condescending you sound when you make these kind of generalizations and statements about how little thought into where their children will go to HS you think others have or haven’t done.
It’s great that your family was able to choose a private school for your DD that you are happy with. Don’t make the assumption that if others make different choices for their children, they didn’t do the same amount of “research” or “analysis” that you did.</p>

<p>Come on ya’ll, give Parent of Ivy a break. People don’t always realize that they are coming across abrasively on these postings, and then they start to get defensive. You can’t tell someone’s tone and inflection, and sometimes generalizations, though well meaning, can get you in trouble. It seems best that when you have the choice to take offense or not…just don’t. Everyone on here is just trying to get or give information to help others, and doing the best they can for their kids. Why waste the effort being offended at someone else’s difference of opinion?</p>

<p>And limabeans, has your son considered adding some computer science courses to his schedule? It seems like a combination of economics and cs could go a long way. I have read that when AS individuals are obsessed with a particular thing, they can be extraordinarily successful (i.e. Einstein, Mozart, possibly Bill Gates). He’s in good company.</p>

<p>Here’s some food for thought. I just graduated from Oberlin College. Took me 9 years to do so, but I did it. The first two-year break I took from college I went job hunting to get some real life experience. Every place I went I was hired on the spot. Granted they were bottom feeder jobs, K-Mart and car sales and assisting with the elderly, but they were jobs and I got in on a snap. Right now I’m studying for my LSATs and looking at law schools but am trying to get a job on the side to keep me occupied. No problem, I’ve got a top 20/25 LAC degree, right?</p>

<p>Wrong. I’ve applied to tons of places, local liquor stores, Target, sporting goods franchises, etc. Once again, bottom feeder jobs. This time, with a $200K degree in hand, I can’t even get a call-back. Not one. Not one interview. Nobody is interested. Maybe it’s because the economy, maybe its because I’m all of a sudden older and overqualified for these jobs, but once I’m done with my lsats I’m going to start utilizing my network instead of making these useless cold calls.</p>

<p>I can see the “overqualification” effects here. Friend’s small business was hiring and commented the flood of resumes came in with some from top-50 school. But he said he would rather hired from our local state campus, because those from the top are aiming high, he couldn’t afford to “train them and lose them”, being used as a transition.</p>

<p>Wow, Rednorth-what a tough situation. I wonder if the employers are thinking that they don’t want to hire and train you, as in a few months you might be off to law school or a better job, and they don’t want to spend the time. I’m not suggesting that you be disingenous, but perhaps you could underplay your high qualifications, not bring up law school, do something to give them a sense of permanance, that you could be a loyal employee for a couple of years at least. My employer is hiring, but they told me they are very annoyed when they train people who come home from college in June, and leave to go back in August. They want someone who will stay. And, well, whatever it takes to get the job when you need to pay the bills. Truth is, you don’t really know how long you might be there, so maybe it would be better off omitting a few things. Good luck, I hope things go better for you soon.</p>

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<p>Let this 19yo knock some sense into you. DO NOT GO TO LAW SCHOOL.<br>
Follow some law blogs to get a reality check on law professions. It’s over. Finito. Find a real job and get on with life.</p>

<p>Thanks busdriver, I’ve definately thought that discretion may be on the better side of valor when it comes to wanting to go to law school. However I haven’t even been able to make a decision on that as my plans aren’t on my resume and I haven’t gotten any call backs. Even being aggressive and calling them back isn’t working. It would be frustrating but studying for the LSATs are keeping me busy enough so I’ve put the job hunt on hold.</p>

<p>Middsmith I’ve been to those forums. Quite a few forums. Some of them are drenched with misery and warnings. Some of them are shine with stories of success. Granted the economy is suffering, but that applies to jobs I believe, across the board. In my mind that says that those people who didn’t get what they wanted out of a law degree are going to project that to everybody, and those who did are either going to sing its praises or tell other people not to join to keep competition low. In any case a degree, regardless of what it’s in, is a tool and what comes out of it is how you use it. I want to get the law degree because I want to spend my life practicing law, not because I think it will be a sure-fire way to make a big killing. Most people, regardless of their incomes, don’t get rich via their salary, they get rich by rotating their funds intelligently.</p>

<p>^^ I believe what middsmith is saying is do not perceive the JD as a versatile degree that will make you rich. Too many prospective students see it that way, and after graduation, they must find jobs in areas they may not like so that they can pay back their hefty student loans.</p>

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<p>Dan Pink is a RL college friend of mine. Linguistics major. Even with that “unmarketable” major, he went on to do pretty well.</p>

<p>I graduated in 1983 from a second tier State University with an engineering degree, near the top of my class. 82-83 was a terrible year to enter the work force, probably exceeded by 2009-2010. Best advice my Dad ever gave me was take the first job you can get, any job, no matter what. That was an easy decision, cause I only got one job offer. Civilian Test Engineer working for a Naval Shipyard.</p>

<p>Worked there for 4 years and learned a trade. It was hard, sweaty, dirty work and I learned aspects of leadership, attention to detail, commitment and a work ethic that would serve me throughout my career.</p>

<p>Once the economy recovered and we were winning the cold war, I applied to what is now a top 10 business school and earned an MBA. Upon graduation went to work with a fortune 100 technology company and learned how world class businesses were managed.</p>

<p>Spent the last ten years working for a high growth technology company and made a great deal of money for our shareholders, some of which I got to keep.</p>

<p>If DS was graduating in this economy, I’ve give him the same advice his grandfather gave me. Get a job, any job. No job is beneath you, no job is too difficult. Don’t waste a second feeling sorry for yourself. Don’t waste a second looking back. Get out there and start making something happen. No next week. Not tomorrow. But right now.</p>

<p>Lima, an econ major who knows Matlab and has some experience (either working for a professor? Even just volunteering to help on a project or some research?) manipulating large data sets should be in good stead for a bunch of different careers. I met someone today who works for a pharmaceutical company handling massive amounts of data on disease management who was an econ major. It sounds like an interesting career for someone who doesn’t want the traditional project/people management track but is good with numbers, concepts, and data.</p>

<p>Has he connected with any of his professors? They can be fantastic resources for jobs-- they have former students, colleagues, other contacts who call them just to say, “hey if you know someone who sounds like this send them my way”.</p>

<p>Good luck to you.</p>

<p>Redwing, that’s probably the best advice I have ever heard!!</p>