So I was admitted to Richmond RD and I am waiting to hear from Wake Forest and I think I have a decent chance of admission.
Anybody have input as to the general similarities and differences?
I am on the west coast and have never toured either one.
I am looking for small classes, good discussions and am thinking of majoring in psychology or philosophy.
I have heard that Wake has grade deflation and to be honest I am concerned about that since I am interested in Law school.
Is Richmond also known for grade deflation?
Are both very grueling and competitive or known for being collaborative?
Any experiences or insights would be greatly appreciated.
@SaSmith - Are you going to be able to tour the schools?
My daughter toured Wake Forest and Richmond several times (easy for Richmond; we are 15 minutes away).
Richmond is a gorgeous campus. You’re 90 minutes from DC, two hours from VA Beach, hour from Williamsburg, hour from Charlottesville. They also have a $4,000.00 fund for each undergraduate to finance research, study abroad, etc., (I can’t remember what it’s called). My daughter chose University of Southern California. One of the big reasons was an outstanding Neuroscience program and Philosophy Department. She’s currently double majoring in Philosophy, Politics and Law (PPL) and Neuroscience. Richmond has a similar major; Philosophy, Politics, Economics, and Law (PPEL).
My daughter liked Wake Forest but it was probably sixth on her list (USC, Richmond, Davidson, Vanderbilt, William & Mary, Wake Forest, etc.). Wake is a great school but there is grade deflation (supposedly), it’s very Greek, but more importantly, it’s very isolated. There is nothing on the immediate outskirts of the campus. That was daughter’s biggest turnoff on Wake Forest.
@jcwjnw99 thank you for your response.
Is UR less isolated than Wake?
Is it less Greek?
If your daughter had not been accepted at USC would she have chosen Richmond?
Nobody around here has heard of UR and basically I think they only know Wake because of sports.
I want to try something new and different but both schools are a big unknown…no one from my school has ever gone to either one…
Did your daughter think that UR is big enough? Good vibes?
I am going to try to tour but it is pretty expensive so I may have to choose only one to tour.
@SaSmith - As a matter of fact, my daughter asked me to pay the deposit at Richmond on 3/23/17, I think. She loved Richmond. Only downside for her; she wanted something a little further from home. She told me if University of Richmond was in Williamsburg (hour away) it would be perfect. She was still waiting on some schools, so I told her to cool her jets a bit. USC’s box came two days later. She actually had USC just kind of filed away in the back of her mind.
She wanted to apply to one school in California. I told her no public’s with OOS tuition. Probably not Stanford because it’s so hard to be accepted. She narrowed it to Pepperdine and USC. Settled on USC, applied, and forgot about it. Thank god she did, the USC 2021 forum last year was heartbreaking to look at. I expect the same thing this year for USC 2022 forum. Acceptance rate down to just under 13%.
Richmond is about 3,200 undergraduates and maybe 800 post-grads (Business and Law school). It’s become increasingly popular with Northeast students and West Coast students as well (mainly Northeast). The school is located in kind of a suburban area, kind of like Haverford. Definitely less isolated than Wake. You can get to Carytown in about five minutes by car. I think they run buses from the school. They do have Greek life but no Greek row. They have lodges, I believe. Wake is very Greek.
It’s a little preppy (the Northeast students) but artsy as well. My daughter definitely would have gone to Richmond if she hadn’t chosen USC. I was a little surprised. I was lucky all through her college visits and she didn’t fall in love with any one school. Until the last school visited; Davidson. She attended some classes there during her visit. When she got back in the car, I asked how her visit went and she started to cry. She LOVED Davidson. Had me pull her ED to Vanderbilt because of Davidson.
That wore off after a few days. Davidson has a nice little town right next to campus but then is also a little isolated. Davidson remained high on her list but top three ended up USC, Richmond, Vanderbilt.
@SaSmith - As far as no one hearing about the school out West, I wouldn’t worry too much about that. Find your best fit. That’s what matters the most.
If you mention Harvey Mudd, Pomona, Colorado College (daughter applied there), etc., most East Coast people probably haven’t heard of them.
Mention schools in the East to someone out West, like Richmond, Davidson, Haverford, Williams, etc., most probably haven’t heard of them (well maybe they’ve heard of Williams).
Daughter applied to big schools, small schools, privates, public’s, big research schools, small LAC’s. She kept an open mind.
@jcwjnw99
Being from SCal I kind of want to avoid schools with the “Ca Vibe”.
Too much of that in high school-though I can understand the draw of USC for sure.
My brother attends Vandy and I was denied ED…that is why I applied to what I felt were similar schools, including UR and Wake.
For me prestige is important, but more importantly-community and opportunity.
The spider is a bit of a problem though…
(tbh Demon Deacon could be worse)
Is Richmond a fun place?
It seems a little like Nashville, which I think is awesome! My brother has really enjoyed his time there.
@SaSmith - Vanderbilt does have a much higher acceptance rate with transfers. I think it’s around 30%-35%.
If you really want Vanderbilt, something to consider. My daughter really liked Vanderbilt but being 18, she felt that Nashville being literally steps off campus, and Nashville designed with 21 and over in mind, it may be an issue.
Misspoke earlier, her top three were USC, Richmond, Davidson, then Vandy.
S has toured and was accepted at Wake Forest, Richmond (and W&M). He chose Wake and is finishing his freshmen year. He loves it.
There is probably more similar than different between Wake and Richmond. Both enjoy great academics, small classes led by esteemed, engaged professors, beautiful campuses, etc.
Greek life is similar in that neither has residential houses so virtually everyone lives on campus in dorms. (Wake requires you to live on campus for three yrs.). Although lots of kids go Greek (about 50%), still has quite an inclusive community because everyone is still living together. They have “lounges” within the dorms for on campus parties and off campus houses for parties.
Winston Salem is a pretty cool city and is only 10 minutes away. Lots of pubs and restaurants. However, Richmond is a very cool, historical city. Cary Town is fairly extensive. As a freshmen, S doesn’t go to WS much. They did open an engineering program in downtown and offer many STEM classes there so for those students, they take a 10 minute shuttle and get to experience the new world class facilities in the innovation center. S doesn’t take those classes.
School spirit - this was a big deal and major deciding factor over both Richmond and W&M for S. There is a ton of school spirit at Wake. D1, ACC sports are big and well attended. He loves sports and all the excitement that surrounds it. Partly because of that and maybe because Wake is a bit larger than Richmond, he just felt there was a lot more excitement. He felt Richmond was too low key compared to Wake but likely would have been happy there.
U need to visit. Both schools have a very preppy vibe (very) and being from Cali, it may be a culture shock. A lot of really wealthy students wearing Vineyard Vines, etc. A friend of ours son really thought he wanted that (being a very preppy northeast kid) but thinks the Southern vibe is a little different and doesn’t love it. I think he’s sticking it out at Wake, but wasnt as great as he expected.
Definitely visit. Can’t speak to Richmond but Wake is heavily attended by:
Northeast (usually means NY / NJ but at Wake there are lots from New England too)
Mid Atlantic (DC area is big)
Florida
South (as opposed to FL which isn’t a “southern” state)
TX
IL
CA (California is actually one of the top represented states which surprised me. Son’s room mate is from Oakland and he actually had four kids from his HS attend)
Wake has the rep of being rich and preppy. There certainly is a lot of that but there’s plenty of “other”. My son has friends all over the political spectrum. He also has friends ranging from wealth (Dad runs a Private Equity shop and lives in a mansion) to several on work study which means they qualified for need based aid. I imagine there are many like us, full pay but not killing it (comfortable).
I can’t answer any questions on Wake Forest but My eldest is a senior at Richmond and my son was accepted and it’s high on his list. He’s considering the PPEL major that was mentioned earlier. We are from california as well and while people used to stare blankly at me when eldest applied there, I’ve noticed a big increase in how many people have heard of it just 4 years later.
My daughter has loved the classroom and found her major highly collaborative (journalism) but she says there is a different feel in some of the other departments like business and leadership that tend to be a little more “fratty” as she puts it.
Greek life is a big presence. 50 percent of females and 30 percent of males are involved. You aren’t going to miss it and my D has found it overwhelming at times but she’s also made plenty of friends including Greeks.
U Richmond is kind of a bubble. A beautiful bubble but you aren’t going to walk into the city from your dorm. Without a car, it can be a bit confining (public transit not the best, school shuttle is a bit limited.) The city itself is pretty cool. Lots of activity on the James river. The positive for anyone in journalism or political science is that the state capital is accessible. Lots going on in Virginia politics right now and DC is accesible for shadowing and internships (our eldest has taken advantage of both.)
We aren’t paupers but things like the Richmond Garuntee, extra scholarship for study abroad, the ease in finding a campus job that wasn’t going to interfere with school, the liberal dining dollars, free laundry machines… made all the difference. In the end, we spent less on a Richmond education that we would have for a UC which kind of blew my mind. Of course Wake may be similar.
Thanks everyone for all the great feedback. I have recently been accepted to Emory and BC as well but I am still favoring Richmond and Wake-if I am fortunate enough to be accepted.
I am doing this research and soul searching because it is likely I will only be able to visit one, because of my schedule and the expense.
At that point I guess if the school I do visit is unappealing then I will need to schedule another school visit…?
This is kind of overwhelming.
Keep in mind that the east coast isn’t like California. The distance between schools not so extreme. Wake forest to Richmond is less that 4 hours drive.
What we are doing for son and we did for eldest, we fly into a close airport and drive to each school then fly out of the city closest to the last school. It may be exhausting on a tight schedule but I feel like every kid should see a campus before committing if at all possible.
Atlanta (Emory) is not that far from Wake so you might be able to go see three of them on one quick trip.
My daughter is attending Richmond. She visited Wake but passed on applying. Was accepted at UVA (out of state), BC, among other schools. The size, 3,100 undergrad, has led to immediate friendships, including students from California and across the U.S. and beyond. This is a “high touch” school with a lot of resources and opportunities. Unlike Boston College, there is flexibility to take courses at the business school and explore academically. It’s a bubble, but an incredibly top rate bubble as far as the quality of facilities. The food is by far the best found across many East Coast schools. As others have mentioned, Careytown is an eclectic, fun stretch of blocks between UR and downtown (including VCU). Not expensive or competitive - perfect college atmosphere. In the liberal arts category, Richmond is similar to Colgate and Bucknell but with much better weather, access/location, and endowment (resources).
And to the previous points on athletics, while UR is not in the ACC, we compete at a very high division 1 level in the A10. We have a $15 million basketball and performance facility going to be built in one and a half years, and have had many basketball games broadcasted nationally. Attendance is also most popular with basketball. In football, many students tailgate (especially in the last year or so). We also have a very good lacrosse team that has been nationally ranked the off few years and has beaten UNC twice, Duke, Marquette, etc. We also have success in other sports like in women swimming and diving and golf.
UR is a great school for me because it has given me a wonderful college experience. There was a balance of top academics, social scene, city life, athletics, extracurricular activities, among other factors, which makes it such a wonderful place.
We just finished a visit at UR. I had not heard of it until we began this college search but am very impressed with all I have found out about it so far. Agree with what others have said, it is beautiful, amazingly so, and everything is immaculately kept up and looks brand new on the inside, including the dorms (I think they renovate them all every 5 years…??!) I agree that you should visit both, and yes just drive to one from the other. We were a little concerned about the rich/preppy vibe, and that seemed confirmed during our drive through where we only saw like 5 white male students either in premium athletic wear or shirts and ties, but later on our tour the student body looked and felt more diverse (economically and culturally, didn’t see a lot of racial diversity) so our concerns on that note were alleviated a bit. Again the facilities are top notch inside and out. One cool slide showed that they are 20 min from Richmond city, 2 hours from beach, 2 hours from mountains, voted “best river city”, and of course have the tiny town a few minutes away. Seemed to be a strong connection with Richmond and internship/community ties there. Many students didn’t seem to want to leave! The slide showed very low student/teacher ratios and class sizes…I belive they said there are NO TA taught sections and no class size over 30. This definitely was talked about on the tour, personal attention. Also, almost all of the 8 tour guides who introduced themselves had double majors, often quite diffrent from each other, which I found interesting and a testament to their flexible, LAC philosophy toward education…they encourage varying interests and make them work academically. I believe 30% of graduates attend grad school.
Following up, I was waitlisted at Wake…so…back to a few of my other options. Emory, BC, SMU, Tulane, or Richmond.
Based on my research I am favoring Richmond for cool city nearby (and over-all location), small class size, ease of study abroad, and beautiful campus.
It is quite a bit smaller than my other options and I am wondering if that might be a problem down the line?
@SaSmith if you’re concerned about Richmond being small, DON’T BE!! There are so many incredible benefits of UR’s small size. First, small class sizes make it easy to participate, ask questions, and form personal relationships with teachers who help you inside the classroom (with presentations, essays, understanding material, preparing for exams) and beyond (writing recommendation letters for jobs/grad school, connecting you with other people in your field of interest, offering research opportunities/internships). Also, even though we’re a small school, we have an incredible alumni network. Our alumni are so eager to get involved with UR students (helping them form connections, find internships, jobs, etc.) because they know the high quality of student that UR generates so they’re happy to help but they also know that because UR is small, that they can really form close relationships students they engage, something both the Alumni and students benefit from.
We are also looking at a Richmond visit. All of the above qualities are exactly what my daughter is looking for. Is there anything you don’t like or would change about Richmond?
Do students frequently visit the city and the river for fun excursions?