<p>Oops. My mistake. Meant to say they posted only admitted students’ scores, not those who end up matriculating. Thanks! UofR is not the only school guilty of this. To me, it says something about a school.</p>
<p>Almost every school posts admitted students scores. That’s really the most meaningful stat when trying to figure out if the school is a safety/match/reach for you. The stats of enrolling students are not all that relevant.</p>
<p>Actually, I beg to differ. Most schools post the most recent enrolled class’s scores. </p>
<p>Typically, they give a “Class of 20-- Profile” for both SAT/ACT scores, rank in class and sometimes gpa.</p>
<p>If you go to the UofR site right now, you will find that under “Fast Facts” they oddly list
“Middle 50% Range for Admitted Students” which lists SAT and ACT scores, and underneath it “Class of 2013 Academic Profile” which gives numbers for the Top 10%, Top 25% and Average GPA. No Class of 2013 test scores.</p>
<p>Odd, no?</p>
<p>I also disagree that admitted student scores are the most meaningful in determining what schools are matches/reaches, etc. That’s why USNWR lists enrolled student scores, not admitted student scores.</p>
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<p>I’m not following the logic. If I’m a student looking to see my chances for admission and I see the admitted student scores, I know exactly how I stand in the applicant pool. If I just see the enrolled scores, I know that they’re lower than the admitted student scores, but not exactly how much lower. Looking at the enrolled scores, an applicant might think that a school is a match or safety, when it’s really more a reach or match. </p>
<p>USNWR uses enrolled student scores as a measure of the caliber of the student body. That’s useful for the applicant, but it doesn’t help as much with the reach/match/safety calculation.</p>
<p>Admitted student scores are obviously inflated.</p>
<p>Schools can <em>admit</em> all the high scoring kids they want to boost their “middle 50% admitted scores”. They know that it is not a real indication of the competitiveness of their class and not the true competition at play.</p>
<p>The best yardstick to use is the enrolled student scores, which is why every college guide book I know posts those. If one is positioned at the upper end of enrolled student scores, one is in good shape. </p>
<p>The best college websites are the ones that list <em>both</em> admitted and enrolled student score for informational purposes.In this way one can see if there is a huge discrepancy between admitted and enrolled scores. However, many school websites don’t even bother listing admitted student scores. The ones that list admitted scores only, like Rochester, are suspect, imo. I wonder why they didn’t list <em>admitted</em> class rank and gpa then? Obviously, because misrepresenting their Class of 2013 test scores puts them in a better light to uninformed readers.</p>
<p>Soze: I notice that you like to give advice on the “chances” threads. If you’re judging these kids’ scores against admitted student stats and making acceptance/rejection calls based on those, you’re doing these kids a real disservice.</p>
<p>If you are comparing UW and UR, weather is not an issue. It snows more in Rochester, it is a bit colder in Madison. Both schools are highly rated in Poli Sci. However, the problem at UW is that there are over 900 undergrad Poli Sci majors and it can be difficult to get into certain classes. It may be difficult to graduate in 4 years if that is your goal. UW is a major university and will provide you with all that implies. If you are into sports, there is nothing like going to a Big 10 game. Rochester doesn’t have anything that will compare. Madison is a college town, Rochester is a rust belt post industrial city. Rochester will give you a more personal experience with the opportunity to really get to know your professors, smaller class sizes, and few if any TAs. UW will give you a chance to take pretty much any class you can imagine. UR will give you much more financial aid than UW but will probably end up costing you more in the end.</p>
<p>In sum, both schools will give you a great education but you will find that they offer very different experiences overall. You really can’t lose by choosing either of these schools.</p>
<p>shennie: I’m definitely considering FA to be a factor so it seems UR is more giving. What do you mean when you say it’ll cost me more? How?</p>
<p>Also, I like the smaller school idea because of the closer experience with professors and etc. It seems like UR fits that.</p>
<p>What do you mean by the “over 900 Poli Sci majors…not graduating in 4 years” because I’m definitely planning to graduate in 4 years. So I might not be able to take the classes and will have to spend a semester or more doing something else?</p>
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<p>Oh, so very, very wrong.
Your goal as an applicant is one thing and one thing only: to get “admitted.”
To judge your chances of admission at a given school, you need to look at the range of test scores of the students who achieved the goal you are seeking, which is admission.
What the scores of those who actually enroll turn out to be is irrelevant.</p>
<p>U Wisconsin and the city of Madison offer a great college experience. UW academics could be characterized as second to none. Nevertheless, U of Rochester provides an excellent education. My niece is a rising senior and a Political Science major. She just completed an summer internship in the office of an influential U.S. Senator and spent a semester abroad last year. Moreover, the “challenging” winters didn’t bother her a bit (and she’s a west coaster). U of Rochester has been great for her.</p>
<p>I’m from Rochester, and I know that UofR has a great Poli Sci department (as others have been saying). Their sciences are good, and for pre-med and med school they are very good. Yes Rochester is not the most exciting town, but there are definitely fun things to do if you’re willing to look for them.</p>
<p>“Oh so very very wrong.”</p>
<p>No, Soze, I am not wrong, and I wish someone would chime in here to help me out. :)</p>
<p>Let’s try using some common sense. <em>Every</em> college guide lists enrolled student scores. Go to collegeboard. com. They post scores for the enrolled students (usually from two years ago). Ever heard of the “How Do I Stack Up” feature on CB? You plug in your scores and they “stack you up” against the ENROLLED student scores they have posted to give you an idea of your safeties, matches and reaches. My kids and I found it very useful during the college search. It was typically right on the money.</p>
<p>Are they doing this to mislead the student population as to what their safeties, matches and reaches are? I hardly think so. They’re in the business of helping kids.</p>
<p>Since every website, guide, etc. uses enrolled scores, where do you go to find your admitted student scores, since they are not typically readily available, Soze?</p>
<p>My gosh, I hope that kids reading this board realize the amount of misinformation they might be getting.</p>
<p>@bonniemom:</p>
<p>I don’t really care what ‘collegeboard.com’ posts. The most useful information to you as an APPLICANT is what the scores of the ADMITTED students are. This is because your entire goal is to go from being an APPLICANT to being ADMITTED. What the scores of the ENROLLED students are does not enter into this equation at all. The question that they are trying to help you answer is “can I get in?” NOT “if I go here, how will I compare with the other students?”</p>
<p>If you are thinking that Rochester is being somehow dishonest by publishing information that is more useful, I don’t see how that is the case.</p>
<p>You didn’t answer where you get your admitted student scores from, Soze.</p>
<p>They actually take some digging.</p>
<p>I am surprised that you recommend giving advice as to safeties, matches and reaches based on admitted scores, because it takes quite a lot of work to find the admitted scores for each school the kids are typically listing in their posts–typically seven or eight schools.</p>
<p>Look, I have nothing against UofR. I understand that some of the things that bother me about their site, nontransparency, process, etc. would not bother other people. That’s fine. I just thought I would mention them in case someone wanted to consider them. I question whether their posting of admitted scores is honorable because they seem to have no problem posting enrolled rank in class and GPA. Posting admitted scores on their site leads people to believe the school is more highly selective than it is. Actually their CR and M scores are typically a good 40 points lower for their enrolled class. I don’t get the game-playing. I doubt they are out to help kids because they know full well that kids’ chances are better for admittance to their school than their posted SAT scores make them out to be.</p>
<p>Typically the rule of thumb is that if you’re in the 75%ile or above for a school’s enrolled scores, you’re in good shape. If you are using admitted scores, you can drop it downwards toward the 50%ile</p>
<p>High_jumper - UR is a very expensive school. I believe that their total costs are running around 50K. UW - Madison’s cost for non-residents will be around 32K. So you will have to get 20K in aid from UR for the costs to be comparable. If you are a very strong applicant to UR, you may get that, but obviously it is not guaranteed. It is not likely you will get much aid from UW as an out of state student. </p>
<p>As far as the issue about graduating in 4 years at UW, it is doable as long as you declare your major as soon as you enroll and follow their course recommendations. However, I know a lot of kids who can’t manage it because they get closed out of required classes early on in sequences and they can’t move forward as fast as they would like. I do know that UW was trying to address the issues by having a 4 year guarantee if you did certain things. You can ask admissions about that.</p>
<p>Hey I’m a current Senior at Uof Rochester. Our polisci department is very strong. I don’t know much about UW, but I know what makes rochester unique is that we are both a tier 1 national research university as well as having a low undergraduate admission. What that means for undergraduate students is that you will actually get to know your professors. It is very common for a professor to hold a class at their house or bring in pizza if the class falls during dinner time. That being said, Rochester’s emphasis is clearly natural and biomedical sciences.</p>