The list has JHU, U Chicago and MIT … known tough schools for sciences and premed track, Not sure how much one wants to swear by it … I didn’t bother to read on their methodology and data though and don’t intend too.
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Not sure if this is already been said, but how committed are you to pre-med? Many people end up changing interests in college. If you end u doing something else, which school offers you the most flexibility (I personally think both do more than fine here, but I’d give the edge to Princeton since Penn has more undergrad schools/programs that you have to actually apply to get into).
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Ooh ok that makes sense- thanks! I personally think that it would be really amazing doing the junior paper/thesis (even though I’m sure it’s pretty stressful)!
I know I’m 110% committed to pre-med, like no matter where college takes me, what my major becomes, whatever, I know 110% that I want to go to med school (I’ve tried doing as much shadowing/etc. as possible before COVID). Hmm, thanks for that perspective-- I never knew of that! 
So would you say that there’s a wider array of majors to switch into at Princeton without an application than at Penn?
Would you, then, say the same about Princeton on that list?
Yes
In the last two weeks I’ve heard of two Texas students at solid Texas schools with a 3.97 and 4.00 GPA, with MCATs at or above median, who haven’t been admitted to med school. Hopefully med schools are like top ranked undergrads and look at applicants holistically and not just for GPA chasers.
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Only about 17% of US Freshman pre meds earn admission to med school. About 140,000 start out. Half drop the program before completion. Of those who “stick it out” and take the MCAT (~70,000), half do not do well enough on the MCAT even to apply. Of the ~ 35,000 who apply, a little under half get in. Among the ~18,000–20,000 applicants who are rejected (and some of those who didn’t apply after their first MCAT), about 6,000 will eventually earn admission on subsequent attempts.
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Med schools expect more than a high GPA and MCAT score. Just like top UG’s, they aren’t looking for grade drones. Medicine is much more than that.
I have heard anecdotally that being at or slightly above the median is no longer adequate-- Tristatecoog- that may be the problem.
Which university would you rather graduate from if you didn’t go to med school ?
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The problem with this is - the answer will come that Princeton is, arguably, the #1 school in the country (by people who “unofficially” rate schools and people rely upon.
But the student has to be there for four years, day after day after day…so perhaps we can rephrase the question to - what would be the best experience for you. Or where would you enjoy your 4 years.
We’re not comparing Harvard to University of Phoenix.
We’re comparing a top 3 to a top 10.
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My top 3 would be 3 out of H, Y, S and M
Personally H, S, M but throwing in an extra for those who don’t like M
OK - top 10 to top 10 or whatever it is -the point is, kids should be going to the right school for them. US News isn’t spending four years on campus, day after day, etc.
If I were in your shoes, I would choose Princeton
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Yeah and they have Princeton on their list as 1 for last 25 years? Never bothered to rationalize with that.
As mentioned I think it’ll be easier to maintain a higher GPA at UPenn. My D17’s friends that stayed pre-med (most decided to do other things) had to jump some hoops to help maintain as high of a GPA as possible. This goes on at just about any school as students try to maintain their GPA but might detract somewhat more at Princeton from doing anything you want to do. Of course YMMV and you’ll have no trouble at all. Just to give a few examples my D17 took the ISC program along with MAT 203 but friends that were pre-med ended up dropping out of ISC and dropping down to MAT 201. Keep in mind that the Senior Thesis and Junior Paper(s) (some departments require a Junior Paper each semester) are graded counts as a 3 credit class and some Advisors are tougher than others.
I’d say UPenn and Princeton are both pretty preppie even though there are plenty of non-preps at each school. Of course there will be much more to do off campus at UPenn than Princeton. Princeton will be safer. Food will be better at UPenn not talking about on-campus but all of your off-campus food options at UPenn are far superior (Princeton doesn’t have Food Trucks on campus or in the town - Philly has a great food truck scene).
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Really - read his pros and cons - and then say why??
Clearly Penn is more of what he’s looking for…well more of the important stuff.
UPenn ($12.5k/year)
Pros:
- got into their Benjamin Franklin Scholars (may be good to add on to resume)
- in a city/more urban (not just a preference, but also closer proximity and more opportunities to get involved in shadowing, volunteering, etc.)
- easier/possible to double major (neuroscience and music)
- submatriculation programs that I’m interested in which may help with post-grad jobs, med school admissions, etc. (accelerated master’s BA-JD)
- known as the “pre-professional” Ivy, so may be better for pre-med?
- more majors/courses to choose from
- cool music ensembles (Brazilian music groups, orchestras, flute choirs, etc.)
- have a friend across the street
- better social life since Penn is known as the “social ivy” and it’s in a large city
- already found a roommate and made “friends” online
Cons:
- ranked lower
- “lower” acceptance rate for pre-meds ending up in medical school than Princeton (80% vs 84% – negligible?)
- a bit pricier than Princeton
- lower endowment for more students to “share”
- not sure if being from NJ and going to school in PA will forgo my “in-state” tuition/admissions “advantage” for NJ in-state med schools.
Princeton ($9.5k/year)
Pros:
-ranked top 3 (and sometimes 1 in the nation)
- focus on undergraduate
- name may open more doors (even overseas)
- has a Sophomore Early Assurance Program
- has a program with Royal College of Music in London that I’m really interested in!
- a bit cheaper than Penn
- larger endowment with less children = better opportunities?
- a professor that I really want to do research with
- perhaps staying in NJ will give let me have an in-state admissions/tuition advantage to NJ med schools (Cooper, Rowan SOM, HMH, RWJ, NJMS)
Cons:
- grade deflation? : might be a horrible option for pre-med
- can’t double major
(kinda a bummer because I really wanted to do neuro/music) - suuuper competitive atmosphere?
- maybe a bit too small?
- perhaps everyone there is preppy?
- maybe not really a con, but it doesn’t have a submatriculation (direct entry into grad school like a BS/MS) program like Penn does
- suburban (not a city)
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This probably doesn’t tell the whole story. How many students apply to med school from each school? It’s quite possible that more students that intend on going to med school end up not applying after attending Princeton due to deflated GPA.
OP, this is a “problem” most students would love to have. There is no right answer.
One point not mentioned here is that Penn is almost twice the size of Princeton for undergrad. It would seem that Princeton would have a better undergrad focus, where you could develop closer faculty connections. Of course this is possible at a larger school, you just need to make it happen.
Choose wherever you’d like to spend the next 4 years, work hard, do your best, take advantage of all the amazing opportunities at whichever school you choose, and you’ll be in the group going to med school.
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