USAMO and College Admissions

Colleges and Universities A-Z Harvard University
1

<p>Hi everyone,
Does making USAMO almost guarantee an admission to top colleges?</p>

<p>[probably not, but I'd like to know to what extent it does]</p>

2

<p>It’s a nice accomplishment at the national level. We’ve seen that IMO doesn’t even guarantee admission though.</p>

3

<p>Nothing “guarantees” admission-- not winning Intel, playing at Carnegie Hall, being in the Olympics–but Harvard like to see that an applicant is passionate and has married passion with ability and demonstrated excellence-- USAMO is one way to do so. But USAMO by itself is insufficient --Now if one was the Gold medal winner of the IMO—that–that will make a reader sit up and take notice–but not even that guarantees admissions.</p>

4

<p>I made USAMO but got waitlisted at Harvard/Northwestern and rejected from Yale/UPenn/Stanford, though I did get into UChicago, Cornell, and Dartmouth.</p>

<p>I don’t know anyone else who has made USAMO because it’s so rare.</p>

5

<p>Winning Intel is a different story, Etondad. </p>

<p>Sent from my iPhone 4 using CC app</p>

6

<p>Etondad, as I mentioned in my post I realize that nothing guarantees admission. </p>

<p>I want to know whether making USAMO would be better than, say, attending MIT Primes or taking linear algebra and complex analysis in high school.</p>

7

<p>USAMO doesn’t guarantee admission but it certainly boosts your application; particularly if you make it more than once and do well and maybe advance to MOP.</p>

<p>And yeah, winning Intel might be the trump card of awards.</p>

8

<p>

</p>

<p>This is what happens when Northwestern hires Princeton’s old Dean of Admission.</p>

9

<p>everliving48: “Does making USAMO almost guarantee an admission to top colleges?”</p>

<p>everliving48: “Etondad, as I mentioned in my post I realize that nothing guarantees admission.”</p>

<p>But that said, those are all nice accomplishments, if you can tie it all together. If you can’t, well, they’re still nice accomplishments. Anyway, they tend to be fairly correlated. There will be more than a few applicants with USAMO, advanced coursework, <em>and</em> MIT RSI (or primes, whatever that is). History shows they’re not all going to get in. And why would you trade off among them based on a hypothetical admissions advantage, instead of which excites you more?</p>

10

<p>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I made USAMO but got waitlisted at Harvard/Northwestern and rejected from Yale/UPenn/Stanford, though I did get into UChicago, Cornell, and Dartmouth.</p>

<p>I don’t know anyone else who has made USAMO because it’s so rare.


&lt;p&gt;Did you make USAMO in 2011? &lt;/p&gt;

&lt;p&gt;To apply for colleges in 2012, qualifying for USAMO in 2011 is best.
To qualify for USAMO in 2010 but not in 2011 doesn't look good.&lt;/p&gt;
11

<p>I qualified for USAMO in 2010.</p>

<p>Last year I did the AMC and qualified for AIME, but then I was out of town for both of the testing dates due to spring break and science fair. I explained all of that in my application, though I can see how they still might not have liked it.</p>

<p>Either way I don’t care because I like Dartmouth and that’s where I’m going.</p>

12

<p>Most USAMO people I know have gone to HPSMC (C = Caltech), (H, M, C, S, P, in order) but there are a couple I know at Berkeley, and I have heard of others going to many other colleges. I started a thread about this in the College Search & Selection board.</p>

13

<p>According to my son, there seems --at least in 55-- to be a real division between the Olympiad and the advanced college course types-- he can even tell by looking at their proofs which of the two camps classmates come from. Now he is Olympiad trained and has a prejudice (and admits it is a prejudice…) toward that background, but both do very well indeed in higher mathematics. </p>

<p>bobtheboy–soon you may have to add Williams to that list as I saw that they beat out even Princeton in the Putnam (came in 10th). Their math department is amazing–my D will be going there in the fall so I have been watching them for the past few months and have been very impressed.</p>

14

<p>^^ Etondad, what is the division between the Olympiad and the advanced college course types? And for those who are both, on which side of the division do they end up?</p>

15

<p>I’ll ask him – he has mentioned it to me on several occasions, but I’ll ask him to be more specific (actually he has but I can’t recall it with sufficient clarity to repeat it here). And I’ll ask him about those who have both…</p>

<p>He is traveling for a few days so I’ll post once I speak with him…</p>

16

<p>^^etondad. I’m very interested in the advanced course type vs. Olympiad types issue. Is there really a divide? Wouldn’t many of the Olympiad students also take advanced courses? Are the advanced course tuoes more likely to do RSI? And, admissions aside, which path is better for the development of a mathematician? My son after his first year of high school is trying to make this decision–whether to graduate high school with several 300 level courses at the local Ivy, or competiton, or both.</p>

17

<p>both are excellent–but again, my S noted just a difference in style between the two types of classmates in 55. RSI he has grouped with the university course type kids…</p>

<p>Of course there is overlap–but those for whom Olympiad was the formative experience seem to be different.</p>

<p>I asked him since my last posting and he said as a gross generalization there was more “rigor” in the university course/RSI students but more creative thinking in Olympiad as the Olympiad requires a great deal of out of box thinking to solve the questions, especially given the time constraints. However, he restated he could tell Olympiad kids by just looking at Psets. FWIW</p>

<p>As to which your son should do, he should sample both and see which or neither or both appeal. I don’t think that there is a “better” or “worse” option just as there are those who like abstract algebra more than analysis and vice versa (the fall and spring parts of 55). My son loved Olympiad but that is his thinking style–and yes he loved abstract algebra and tolerated analysis.</p>

<p>Again, there is no prescribed way–he should find the way that works best for him. They key, however, is that by the time he gets to a course like 55 (and to a lesser extent 25) he should be very very comfortable with proofs and abstract thinking.</p>

18

<p>^^ Thanks, Etondad.</p>

<p>I do find – another gross generalization – that math competition types tend to favor algebra over analysis, probably because the type of questions in math competitions tend to to be more algebraic and discrete in nature, rather than require epsilon-delta reasoning.</p>

19

<p>Thanks. He’s with a tutor/mentor math PhD who was a Silver Medalist in the International Olympiad. His tutor says there’s a lot of luck involved with reaching the top in competiton but the work involved can be valuable. It’s a proof based approach, which will be alongside advanced courses–so he’s covering the contingencies. </p>

<p>Here’s an interesting read in which one Fields medalist says that Wiles, who solved Fermat, was not a genius in the competiton sense, but someone with great strategic ability, cleverness, and courage. </p>

<p>[Great</a> Mathematicians on Math Competitions and “Genius” - Less Wrong](<a href=“Great Mathematicians on Math Competitions and "Genius" — LessWrong”>Great Mathematicians on Math Competitions and "Genius" — LessWrong)</p>

20

<p>Here’s an example of a Harvard student (just finished Sophomore year) who never did competitions.</p>

<p>[Climbing</a> Mount Bourbaki](<a href=“http://amathew.■■■■■■■■■■■■■/]Climbing”>http://amathew.■■■■■■■■■■■■■/)</p>

<p>From what I’ve seen and heard, he’s doing quite well despite eschewing the competitions.</p>