Used to live with mom...Now living with dad?

Paying for College
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<p>The Child Support Standards Act does not require college payments in a divorce situation in NY. It is often put into a divorce agreement but it is not required. What is often used in NY is what is called the SUNY cap which caps the tuition payment to what a chosen SUNY school charges when the student is college bound. But it is not mandated in the state of NY. </p>

<p>A lot of divorced NCPs refuse to even complete the FAFSA or PROFILE because it is a pain in the neck and they cannot be forced to do so. Unless the student and CP can get a waiver, that can quash financial aid.</p>

<p>It’s not just NCPs that refuse to pay or complete the financial statements either. There are posts abound in the forum of intact families who won’t pay for college when they might well be able. Even more who won’t pay EFC (hey, that includes me!) Getting payment for college from parents is not a right.</p>

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<p>*I agree with you, there has to be a fairer way. I dont like it when the rest of pay and NCP doesnt contribute or contributes secretly. *</p>

<p>Yes…either we have the attitude that both parents have to contribute or why have any expectation that ANY parent contribute…especially when both parents have been involved.</p>

<p>And, yes, there is a lot of secret paying of college costs by either NCPs or game-playing with determining who is CP.</p>

<p>We’ve come a long way where many divorces have “shared custody”…it doesn’t make sense for two parents to have “shared custody” yet not have the same expectation that married parents face.</p>

<p>Getting payment for college from parents is not a right.</p>

<p>True…but getting tax-payer aid because parents refuse to pay shouldn’t be a right either. If a college wants to give its own funds then fine.</p>

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<p>Cpt, you are correct. But what NY does is allow a judge to order college tuition. That compbined with Child Support will help. Many states do not allow a judge to order tuition or CS to continue past HS. Children of divorce have lower graduation/attendance rates than children of intact families, and I realize there are many reasons for this, but I think money is one. I have hear this “SUNY Cap” but I am not aware of any requirement for judges to cap tuition at SUNYs.</p>

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<p>No requirement, but it is commonly done when college tuition is ordered. I don’t know anyone who has gotten more than when it has to be judge ordered. In other states when the college payment is put in loosely, it sets off another law suit when college time rolls around and the resolution is often the old state school tuition cap if anything. </p>

<p>I’ve been fortunate enough that most of my friends here in NY have willingly supported their NC kids college plans without such caps. But I’ve also seen abuse of the system and some nastiness on part of the parents too. Children of divorce not only have lower graduation/attendance rates at college but for high school too, and are at greater risks for all sorts of travesties. Money is definitely an issue as what usually happens is the parent with less financial resources gets custody of the kids and usually ends up worse off while the NCP ends up doing better after such divorce. Such is the ugliness of divorce and it has a toll on the kids, no doubt.</p>

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<p>I live in NY, and where I live most CS agreements are negotiated – courts too clogged. But I tend to think that most people going through divorce want to get an idea of what a judge would order as basis for negotation, and I think the “suny cap” is not a firm limit. As to other states, I think it depends on which ones. There are other states that will allow judges to order college, including NJ and Mass. Most states will not allow a judge to order, so it can become an interpretation of an existing agreement.</p>

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<p>Kayf, that is what I have seen here in NY and just looking it up on line, you can do the same, it appears to be the common fallback position. I agree that most CS agreements are negotiated because it can get expensive and take too long other wise. It’s nearly always smarter to work it out.</p>

<p>I ‘ve known a woman for years who is fighting for a CS and assets, has been for years from a very well to man. Drives a frigging Mazerati, lives the high life, etc, etc. She’ probably going to lose it all from what my attorney friends who know the situation well say. And NY is much better than a lot of states in this regard. PA won’t even touch support after age 18 or after high school grad. Dads call to get that exact date of graduation so they can pro rate that last check. I’m no fan of the stingy, vindictive NCP, believe me.</p>

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<p>Cpt, it may be the “most common” fallback, but I really think it depends on income of people. Also please remember that the tuitition is in additon to normal Child Supporrt. As to whether the woman you know should or should not be driving a Mazerati, I would suggest there are a lot of factors, including lenght of marriage etc.</p>

<p>But back to tuition. I still think that unless states follow the lead of NY, NJ etc and allow judges to order college then FAFSA should NOT be changed. And the rest of us should remember we are paying for kids of some wealthy NCPs.</p>

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<p>The woman is not driving the Mazerati. The man is. The length of marriage is over 25 years. </p>

<p>Fortunately, it does not come to it that that many kids are qualifying for PELL with wealthy NCPs, though not considering an absent NCP’s financial at all, even one who id not making that much does , can throw a kid into the PELL eligible range. That child support is included in the FAFSA mitigates the impact somewhat.</p>

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<p>oops sorry for confusing parents, CPT. My point is that the states have to help make this happen. Its not just Pell, its state aid and subsidizied Stafford too.</p>

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<p>Yes, I am applying for a school that uses the CSS profile. Will they take into account my dad, step mom, AND mother? Because if so, I can count on getting no money whatsoever… </p>

<p>It also may help to know that I’m looking into schools like Wellesley and Brown where they meet 100% need based off of their own calculations. I believe they use both the CSS and FAFSA to determine need.</p>

<p>I honestly do not know how I am going to pay for college then. My mother (single mother 4 kids) will be helping out a little bit (a few hundred a month) but my father nor step mother will be helping me pay for college at all because they believe its my education and I should have to be responsible for it. If I cannot afford to go to Wellesley or Brown I will have to go instate to the University of Washington (my backup). </p>

<p>Please note I am not trying to get any Pell Grants or FAFSA money. I would simply like to have the college give me as much grant from the endowment as possible. Also please remember, IM NOT TRYING TO CHEAT THE SYSTEM.</p>

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<p>Brown, and maybe Wellesley too, will use ALL parents income/assets (including spouses) to determine aid.</p>

<p>So, THEIR calculations will see that there are 3 parents’ incomes/assets that can contribute to your education. </p>

<p>It’s ok to apply to a few of these schools “just to see” what will happen.</p>

<p>But…if it’s likely that these schools will determine a total “family contribution” that won’t be paid for by any parents, then you need to protect yourself by applying to a few schools that will give you HUGE merit scholarships for your stats. </p>

<p>You said something about your mom contributing, but with her situation, I would be very careful about relying on that. She’s a lowish-income single mom with a few kids to support.</p>

<p>How much is she saying that she’ll contribute each year? Ask her for a REALISTIC number…not a “hopeful” number. </p>

<p>Are you saying that your dad won’t contribute any money?</p>

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<p>

</p>

<p>I see this advice given frequently on this forum, and I think it’s really quite odd. As a parent, my answer would depend entirely on the student, his skin in the game, the degree, the school, the plan. </p>

<p>I would suggest that you approach your parent/s with the intent of having a more substantial discussion. There’s no way to answer a “bottom line budget” question without more context.</p>

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<p>Yes, my father nor step mother will contribute to my education. They say that they’ve contributed to my success financially my entire life and college is my own responsibility. If I cant afford to go to Wellesley or Brown, I wont go there, that’s the bottom line. And mom2collegekids, I dont plan on relying on my mother for help. She’s got enough problems as it is and she’s just being nice by trying to contribute. In all honesty, she needs the money more than I do. At this point, I really don’t know what to do. </p>

<p>I dont want to take financial aid money or grants from low-income families that really do need it. At the same time, its just hard for me to accept that schools won’t give me money because my family makes too much money and is expected to contribute (even though they arent). I dont know how they can expect me to pick up the $30,000+ tab a year.</p>

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<p>*How much is she saying that she’ll contribute each year? Ask her for a REALISTIC number…not a “hopeful” number </p>

<p>I see this advice given frequently on this forum, and I think it’s really quite odd. As a parent, my answer would depend entirely on the student, his skin in the game, the degree, the school, the plan.*</p>

<p>I gave this advice because this student indicated that the mom’s family has “very little money” and the single mom is supporting 4 children…yet the student says that her mom is going to try to help her with college expenses.</p>

<p>There have been other similar situations on CC…students with low-income single moms who’ve promised to help make college happen…but when push comes to shove the money’s not there. The truth is…if the single mom could find a way to come up with more money for college, it’s likely she would have opted for that venue a long time ago. </p>

<p>For a parent to come up with even $4k every year for college, that means that the parent needs to have about an extra $350 every month. Few low income single moms have an extra $350 per month for 4 straight years.</p>

<p>Edit: Cross posted with OP…so …</p>

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<p>* If I cant afford to go to Wellesley or Brown, I wont go there, that’s the bottom line. *</p>

<p>good attitude.</p>

<p>So, your top choices can be Wellesley and Brown. Apply to them and see what happens. Likely, they will expect a family contribution that no one will pay based on your dad’s family’s income.</p>

<p>Now, you need to find a few financial safety schools. If you have the stats for Brown, then likely you have the stats for other schools with big merit.</p>

<p>You will need BIG MERIT for other schools to be affordable. What are your stats? </p>

<p>What is your likely major?</p>

<p>* They say that they’ve contributed to my success financially my entire life and college is my own responsibility.*</p>

<p>Does your dad plan on being consistent and not pay for this other two kids’ college costs?</p>

<p>Anyway…what are your stats and what is your likely major/career? We can probably find some affordable options for you in case your top choices don’t work out. </p>

<p>Are you a likely NMSF? What was your PSAT?
:)</p>

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<p>Hhaah unfortunately no. I just copied and pasted some stats I used for a previous post. Thanks so much for your help! </p>

<p>Gender: Female
Race: Asian (1/2 Chinese, 1/2 Vietnamese)
HS Type: Medium sized/in a small city
Income Bracket: Middle/Higher Middle
State: Washington</p>

<p>Father: University of Washington
Mother: Did not finish 10th grade (will be first on my mom’s side to go to college)</p>

<p>Courses:
Junior: AP Biology, AP Calculus AB, AP Economics Micro, AP Economics Macro, French 3rd Year, US History, English
This year’s GPA: 4.0 (unweighted)
Class Rank: 3/312</p>

<p>Senior Year Schedule: AP Government and Politics, AP Physics, AP Statistics, AP French, Humanities, Leadership</p>

<p>Cumulative GPA (as of this year): 3.982</p>

<p>PSAT: 1950 (590 CR, 710 M, 650 W)
Will be improving score and taking SAT in June</p>

<p>Extra Curriculars:
School Varsity Soccer (Captain)
School Varsity Track
Nationally Ranked Club Soccer
Volunteering (tutoring) at the local library
Volunteering at church (Children’s Ministry)
National Honor Society
S.T.E.M.(Science, Technology, Engineering, Math) Club (Founder and President)
ASB Secretary
H.E.L.P Peer Tutoring (Founder and President)
American Math Competition
Church Worship Team (singer)</p>

<p>Awards/Recognition:
Outstanding Junior of the Year (District)
Spirit of the Highlander Award
Top 5 in Mathematics
League’s Player of the Year (MVP)
Washington State All State Goalkeeper
Scholar Athlete
League 1st Team All League (2 years in a row)
Impact Player of the Year
Junior Prom Princess</p>

<p>Schools I’ll Be Applying To:
University of Washington (Instate/Safety)
Wellesley College (Reach)
Smith College (Sort of a reach)
Corban College (Safety/Possible athletic scholarship)
Claremont McKenna (Reach)
Brown University (Reach)
*The reason I have so many reach schools is because if ultimately, my backup is UW. It’s instate tuition so it’s my cheapest option. I figured I mind as well spend my time trying to apply for other reach schools than additional safety schools that aren’t as good as UW.</p>

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<p>mom2collegekids, Actually, kids from divorced families are put at parity under the current FAFSA rules. Your idea (that ncp must also fill out FAFSA) would put them at a disadvantage. Right now, all kids put down the information for both parents/stepparents in their houshold. Your plan would require kids of divorced parents to take the assets of 2 people who are not related to them and have no responsibility and add that to 2 people who are related to them and have no responsibility. </p>

<p>I agree with kayf that unless states even address this in child support agreements, it is useless. (In the state where I was divorced, I asked for a college contribution and my attorney said no judge would award it.)</p>

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<p>No one is going to come knocking on your door</p>