<p>^^^one can only hope.</p>
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<p>The e-mails shed light on the level of BOV involvement. When they talk about real estate, Dragas has expertise that is useful. When it comes to online education, however, she is out of her element. Reading the e-mails brings to mind what happens when businesspeople buy sports franchises. Some, such as Robert Kraft of the New England Patriots, hire good people and then keep their hands off. Others, such as Jerry Jones or Dan Snyder, cannot resist meddling. The latter still make money, but the product on the field is usually mediocre. </p>
<p>Regarding Dr. Wulf, let me first note that when individuals such as he were in their prime, they were paid much less than they would have been paid in the private sector. In a sense, the university underpays when faculty are in their prime and overpays when they are past their prime. The temptation, then, is to push them out when you start overpaying. But imagine that you took out a term life insurance policy with fixed monthly premium payments. After 15 years, the insurance company cancels the policy, explaining that they make money during the first 15 years of such policies but lose money after that. You would be on the phone to the insurance commissioner very quickly.</p>
<p>Actually Xiggi it was your use of the term lifetime employment I found incorrect. It usually means you start and remain at one job for life with some implication that you are more drone than star. In fact my point was that prof. Wulf proved himself at another top institution in his field and worked in industry and a policy position before returning to UVa in when already about 50. I do not see working from 50-72 at one place lifetime employment. And the implication that because he enjoys his work and would do it for free is one we should all aspire to. Leaving that out was a lucky choice for you as it would not serve your argument in the least. </p>
<p>Yes I have long thought UVa was overrated and posted to that effect saying nearly exactly what Sullivan said years ago right here. Being proven correct is its own reward.</p>
<p>And as to UW football-they played better than my expectations and do more with less than any SEC school while not running kids off so they can bring in more new recruits every year. The NFL thought they were pretty good too.</p>
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<p>Barrons, if you were to read my first post on this issue, you should notice that I framed in the context of THIS discussion. My focus was clearly on the continuous employment of professors who have reached a certain age and admitted to earn high salaries despite having reduced their work substantially. The lifetime comments were not about the length of career at the same institution, but about its crepuscule. I made no analysis of Prof. Wulf current teaching duties or contributions to UVA, nor did I weigh his past career since it was not relevant to the point I was making. </p>
<p>Again, this discussion centers on the relative weakness of the faculty at UVA, and the (in)actions by the departing President. Issues that have been raised in this regard is the need to replace a large part of the facuty by 2020 because of retirement, and the need to attract a younger and eager faculty.</p>
<p>PS I hope you noticed the smiley face that followed the comments about antagonizing and football. Panem et circenses! I would have written Caseus et circenses, but since I did not have a chance to do much classical research at my little LAC, I am not sure it really means Cheese and Games!</p>
<p>Sullivan said that UVa has less “star” faculty than some of its peers. She said the school has relied more on the strength of faculty departments, that the sum is greater than the parts. But that like many other schools, UVa is facing the retirement of faculty and the need to bring in new faculty to keep UVa current and to keep up with its peers. UVa is not unique in facing many of these kinds of issues.</p>
<p>Absolutely true! And why I had posted this earlier:</p>
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<p>The issues facing UVA are no different than at most if not every school in the country. I think the issues will be particularly difficult for large public universities, especially in states that are seeking to reduce their investment even further. Hoping that alumni donations might increase substantially at schools such as the ones that form the UC system is a pipedream. And, relying on large donations from inviduals or companies is not without its share of peril. </p>
<p>All in all, it might be time to consider that the model of yesterday that intimated endless piles of money to afford to treat faculty as divas is hopelessly broken. Coupled with the desire to transform the college experience into something along the lines of a spa or country club for the young, you have an untenable model. </p>
<p>The only answer that will ultimately work is accepting that measures of austerity are inevitable, and that people will have to work a lot more for the same money (or actually work as much as they pretend to do.) Schools really have to shoulder the blame for escalation of costs. The runaway growth in expenses did not start yesterday; it started when things were better. </p>
<p>It might not be the school that a dreamer might build, but one that “we” can both afford and find a way to justify the necessary expenses. And that is not the case today!</p>
<p>Xiggi…You and I don’t always agree, but your last post ^^^ was spot-on! Well said!</p>
<p>There are many other issues that are somewhat unique to UVa going on here. See this excellent article by a leading higher ed writer/analyst.</p>
<p>[Kevin</a> Carey: The Decline And Fall Of A Public University: How Status Anxieties Doomed The University Of Virginia | The New Republic](<a href=“http://www.tnr.com/blog/plank/104204/university-of-virginia-teresa-sullivan]Kevin”>Kevin Carey: The Decline and Fall of a Public University: How Status Anxiety Doomed the University of Virginia | The New Republic)</p>
<p>Kevin is his usual self, namely an astute observer who can dissect the main point in the middle of chaos. </p>
<p>In the meantime, these couple of lines should give all people who care about the education of undergraduates more than a small pause.</p>
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<p>Unfortunately, what they are fear is exactly what has happened at almost every school that clings to the label … research university.</p>
<p>Yup, sucks to be at Stanford or MIT. Even if that claim were actually true the benefits of having some stars can and do inure to undergrads. The best up and coming young PhDs want to be at the places where the stars work. Easier to attract research and donation money to improve facilities and add staff. Many of them are actually good people and will talk to and work with undergrads who are sincere about learning. At least if they are actually THERE you have a real shot.</p>
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<p>Truer words have never been spoken. Of course, the definition of “being there” remains entirely in the eye of the beholder. Being available to undergraduates might be quite a higher hurdle to overcome. Divas who are jetting to Washington, DC or spending all their time on the nth edition of their book might be hard to find on campus. Add the leave of absences and the sabbatical, and it would not be unheard for an undergraduate to see the much heralded professor on campus, let alone have a positive interaction. </p>
<p>Barrons, and this with all due respect, I believe your understanding and knowledge of what happens on a campus seem quite dated, if not romantic. I do not doubt that you are spending some time on boosting or recruiting missions, but you might be well-served to actually listen to people who graduated recently, or at least in this century. And, fwiw, I seriously doubt that you possess any notion of how Stanford operates its UG and graduate programs, or what makes the place so different from academic factories. </p>
<p>Can’t blame you for not knowing, but it might be wise to pretend you do.</p>
<p>Actually with the Twitter I hear from students and recent grads every day. I also served on the board that advises residential colleges and several other undergrad programs and we met with students at every meeting which typically were 2-3 times a year until last year.</p>
<p>[Pathways</a> to Excellence - UW-Madison](<a href=“http://www.lssaa.wisc.edu/pathways/programs.html]Pathways”>http://www.lssaa.wisc.edu/pathways/programs.html)</p>
<p>Stanford is not an academic factory?! Now who has the romantic vision?</p>
<p>A few examples</p>
<p><a href=“https://www.biochem.wisc.edu/undergraduate_program/meet_undergrads.aspx[/url]”>https://www.biochem.wisc.edu/undergraduate_program/meet_undergrads.aspx</a></p>
<p>[Group</a> Members | Burstyn Lab](<a href=“http://burstyn.chem.wisc.edu/content/group-members]Group”>Group Members – Burstyn Lab – UW–Madison)</p>
<p>[Letters</a> & Science News & Notes | Chemistry professor becomes president of world?s largest scientific society](<a href=“News | College of Letters & Science, University of Wisconsin-Madison”>News | College of Letters & Science, University of Wisconsin-Madison)</p>
<p>[Letters</a> & Science News & Notes | L&S Honors Program honors seven distinguished faculty](<a href=“News | College of Letters & Science, University of Wisconsin-Madison”>News | College of Letters & Science, University of Wisconsin-Madison)</p>
<p>[Letters</a> & Science News & Notes | Recent UW-Madison graduates win award for strategic media plan](<a href=“News | College of Letters & Science, University of Wisconsin-Madison”>News | College of Letters & Science, University of Wisconsin-Madison)</p>
<p>[Letters</a> & Science News & Notes | Three outstanding undergrads receive Dean’s Prizes](<a href=“News | College of Letters & Science, University of Wisconsin-Madison”>News | College of Letters & Science, University of Wisconsin-Madison)</p>
<p>[Research</a> publications | UW Madison - Department of Chemistry](<a href=“http://www.chem.wisc.edu/content/research-publications]Research”>http://www.chem.wisc.edu/content/research-publications)</p>
<p>At the risk of becoming embroiled in something beyond this simple statement…
One of the best things about UVA has always been that the ‘stars’ teach entry level classes. Think Larry Sabato… Having the brightest and best is a great way to interest young students in whatever field you’re passionate about. I’m sure other schools do the same. I certainly hope they do.
The BoV is re-convening Tuesday to reconsider their colossal blunder. It’s being said they wouldn’t have called the meeting were they not assured that they have enough votes to ‘correct’ (though their word was ‘reverse’) the decision. We shall see.</p>
<p>It is a myth star faculty do not teach undergrads.</p>
<p>Berkeley’s newest Nobel Prize winner in physics even teaches a class for non-physics majors.</p>
<p>“One of the best things about UVA has always been that the ‘stars’ teach entry level classes.”</p>
<p>According to a leaked internal memo that President Sullivan sent out, UVA has very few “stars” to teach at any level.</p>
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<p>Yes, that story has been discussed in the past. The story of a seminar taught every couple of years by a Nobel awardee. Big deal! </p>
<p><a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/college-search-selection/1220219-berkeley-prof-wins-nobel-prize-physics.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/college-search-selection/1220219-berkeley-prof-wins-nobel-prize-physics.html</a></p>
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<p>Here, I will even do your smooth work for once:</p>
<p>[George</a> F. Smoot - Photo Gallery](<a href=“http://www.nobelprize.org/nobel_prizes/physics/laureates/2006/smoot-photo.html]George”>http://www.nobelprize.org/nobel_prizes/physics/laureates/2006/smoot-photo.html)</p>
<p>PHYSICS 299 seems to be the listing for both Smoot and Perlmutter. Doubt that many UG are attending! </p>
<p>Now, the French love to say "C’est l’exception qui confirme la r</p>
<p>It is a big deal. If UVA had more star faculty like Perlmutter this thread topic wouldn’t exist…except in your limited context of star faculty teaching undergrads, which I’ve shown many times before isn’t true. Even at large, prestigious academic factories.</p>
<p>I believe Robert Reich has taught undergrad seminars…what’s Condi Rice teaching these days?</p>