UVA Student Environment

<p>qx3kbenzene, I guess it's just a matter of perception. The majority of students don't feel that way at all.</p>

<p>I'm not negating your experiences. I'm saying that you shouldn't use words like "most people think this and that" because you overheard a few people making snide comments about the 3rd World. Like Cavalier302 said, UVa is the top producer of Peace Corps volunteers among medium-sized schools. I doubt a school comprised of people who mostly think of the 3rd World in a negative way would be such a civic-minded institution. </p>

<p>I'm not saying you should conform. You should always be yourself and believe what you want to believe. I'm saying you shouldn't categorize all your fellow students a certain way based on a few experiences.</p>

<p>I do agree that UVA is not a good school to go for science. In terms of public schools, place slike UCBerkeley are much better in that aspect. However, I don't see what that has to do with the OP's question about student environment. Additionally, I also am unaware of how not having a science section in the school newspaper is relevant. I mean, no offense but the Cav Daily is **** poor as it is in terms of a newspaper, and I wouldn't want to see them attempt to write scientific articles.</p>

<p>The White CIO thing is an obvious minority, and it's not like it's going to negatively affect anyone's enjoyment of UVA since you rarely come across these people. I mean, kids at my HIGH SCHOOL tried to create a White club in contrast to the various minority clubs at my school. Of course it failed, but this is probably the same thing, where students say,"If other ethnicities are going to create clubs about themselves than why not do the same for ourselves?". Yes, it didn't make that much sense, but did it matter to anyone else in the high school of mine, which is much smaller than UVA? No.</p>

<p>Anyway, I think that using an outdated term to describe developing nations is in itself relegating them. Still, it's very vague on what they said, so I'm not sure what the extent these kids took the denouncing. Either way, the conversations I hear in the dining hall are never about politics or related subjects from what I remember. I'm sure after four years I'm going to hear some random people trashing some developing nation no matter (to an extent) where I go.</p>

<p>Edit: I know you alums have never used facebook, but we've had it for awhile and just by nature of using it I can tell UVA isn't some conservative college. Like 30%+ of the students describe themselves as liberal, which is much higher than the national average, and add that in with moderates and I'd say that only leaves another 30-40% as self described conservatives.</p>

<p>Okay I see what you mean. </p>

<p>Let me correct what I said before:</p>

<ol>
<li><p>Most people at UVa do not make discriminatory remarks about 3rd world countries; just the group of 5 guys whose conversation I overheard. </p></li>
<li><p>However, most people at UVa do believe that Science is useless. I say this because the Cavalier Daily (CD) has recently cancelled its Science section because students do not read it as frequently as other sections. Since the CD circulates 10,000 copies on a daily basis, I'd think that popular opinion from its readers can be generalized to the entire university community. </p></li>
</ol>

<p>I doubt this cancellation has much to do with the writing or editing of the page. </p>

<ol>
<li>Most people at UVa do consider it more important to wear pearl necklaces than to ask intelligent questions. I've been in large classes (~100) and have seen how people would laugh at the one student in the class who asks questions that require the professor to pause and think. These people come from affluent backgrounds and spend money on materialistic things. I'm not saying these spendings are wrong. However, I have my association because the same people excludes others for being curious about classes beyond what is taught in the class.</li>
</ol>

<p>UVA might not be great for science compared to its peer institutions, but it is by no means bad. People here can and do succeed in the natural and applied sciences. In all other areas, UVA is quite strong, and science majors surely benefit from taking humanities classes and partaking in the various social opportunities UVA has to offer. I'm not going to deny that there are shallow students here, but I challenge you to find a single other to school (with the possible exceptions of caltech and MIT) where there aren't shallow students.</p>

<p>Yes, it depends on the quality of the articles being written and how interesting they were. I don't think any intelligent person can say "science is useless" and still use a computer, live in a dorm, drive a car, or whatever. UVA just isn't a science oriented school, and it's more focused towards its social sciences. That's not to say that they think science is unusable, but most people feel that science just isn't their thing, which I guess says something about the student environment. I don't know how you made such a broad, sweeping generalization on it being useless just because the CD cancelled a science section.</p>

<p>I believe a lot of people find it amusing when certain professors have to pause and think because some professors often come across as trying to flaunt their knowledge and what not. I don't think people would laugh just because the question-asker was asking a question unless it was a stupid one. Also, I'm not sure how wearing a pearl necklace corresponds with asking intelligent questions. Neither will influence the decision to do the other, so it's hard to say if a student would "rather" wear a pearl necklace than ask an intelligent question or vice-versa. There may be more students who wear pearl necklaces than ask intelligent questions, but that's not showing any preference of choosing one over the other. And I don't see questions asked in large lectures often because I would say it disrupts the flow of the lectures. I don't.. if I have a question I take it to them after class or office hours.</p>

<p>Re. #2, I doubt those students who are majoring in the sciences, pre-med, architecture, nursing or engineering think science is useless, and I'm sure they make up at least 1/3 of the student population.</p>

<p>Re. #3, I don't think my guy friends cared about wearing their pearl necklaces - too flashy. (Just kidding. You did say most people which includes guys.) Anyway, who cares about those people? Let them laugh. I say ask the stupid questions, make the professor work for his money. I'm sure there are other classes where people ask intelligent questions. I surely remember being in them and being one of those people asking pointed questions and not having people laugh at me.</p>

<p>Oh Sv3a, I've been on Facebook for a long time now, and yes, a lot of UVa people on Facebook are liberal. A fellow UVa alum who's running for office here in NY mined the site to find liberal UVa folks to support his campaign, and he contacted me (not knowing who I was since I use an alias). I laughed when he tried to give me a pitch. I was like, "Sean, we had drinks last week, and I already contributed to your campaign."</p>

<p>So, globalist...you have a parody account? who are you? snoop dogg? thomas jefferson???</p>

<p>Nah, Snoop Dogg doesn't exist anymore. Whoever it was deleted it =/</p>

<p>Sh**, I'm gonna have to pour a 40 out back behind watson...</p>

<p>I think the CD is a well-established and well-written student run newspaper. The previous Science section did not have any scientific articles. They just had articles about science related topics. There is a difference between the two and that has to do with the rigor of the writing (such as using specific scientific jargon). </p>

<p>I appreciate everyone's perspectives. As you have agreed with me, UVa is not a good science oriented school. Therefore, if you like science and have gotten into somewhere better, don't come here for the science. </p>

<p>sv3a, how did you get the 30% from the Facebook? I tried putting in both "liberals" and "conservatives" in the search query, with appropriate filters, and both gave me "500+" as the answer. Do you know how many UVa students have accounts on the Facebook?</p>

<p>Don't come here if all you care about is science, but do come here for everything else. An undergrad experience isn't just about majoring in chemistry or physics, but about what you learn as a whole and the environment. I'm probably going to major in either bio or chem, and I'd still go to UVA over UChicago or whatnot. The experience in the end is very much worth it, especially if you're an instater. </p>

<p>The pulse on facebook indicated that something like 23% of students classify themselves and liberal and 8% or so as "very liberal". But from just generally using facebook for almost a year now, I can definitely say I've seen my fair share of both liberals and conservatives, as well as moderates. I know our class has about 95% people on facebook or something (they mentioned how like 90% of the '09 class was on facebook before school even started sometime back in August). There are less fourth years and such on, but still a very large amount. Either way, the first year class is more relevant to what we're talking about here in terms of student environment.</p>

<p>I agree - at schools that are better than UVA in sciences, you'll get none of the social life or other nonacademic perks that UVA offers. Life is about focusing on one singular academic discipline - especially at the age of 18 or 19. I got into several schools that are better than UVA in the sciences and economics (my intended field of study), but I chose to come here because the overall educational experience is fine and the social experience is superior. Differences in quality in academic programs really only manifest themselves at the graduate level, anyway. If you're a stud in physics or math, you'll get to MIT or Stanford or wherever.</p>

<p>I actually went back to facebook to check it out and found my numbers weren't so accurate. It said something about 16% of males and 11% of females list themselves as conservatives. Along with that, 2% males and 1% females say they are 'very conservative'. When you average that up and take into account there is a 10% margin between females and males only like 15% of this university says they are conservative. Compare this to how 25% female and 19% male classify themselves as 'liberal', and 11% females and 5% males say they are 'very liberal'. The rest are moderates (which would more than likely split between liberal/conservative in their leanings), libertarians, apathetic, or other. By the way people classify themselves here, we are looking at a more liberal leaning school than anything else. However, it's still balanced by a fair amount of other political views, which I think is good.</p>

<p>The actual numbers on all sides may be slightly higher, since some students don't list out their preference, but they're still taken into account as part of the population when making these numbers. However, unless there's some major thing that makes conservatives not want to list our their political views on facebook moreso than liberals (or they're just moderates/apathetic and don't care to check a box), I think we can assume that those that already have indicated their political leanings provide sufficient information.</p>

<p>Thanks for that fine analysis, sv3a. I suppose my impressions drawn from being in Jeff Soc, Honor, and the CD have tainted my opinions of the general student body. </p>

<p>I agree with Cav that if you don't know what you want to do and would like to receive a broad survey of different subjects, UVa is a good place to do that. </p>

<p>However, if you have your heart set on something specific and if that happens to be a hardcore science or math, then UVa will pale in comparison to many west coast schools. </p>

<p>I think it's hard to be objective when you try to define the overall educational standards of one university. This is because many of us have only been to one university for undergrad. </p>

<p>Therefore, if you have enough people give you their subjective views, then perhaps you can paint an honest picture.</p>

<p>No, I didn't assume the identity of someone else. I just used the anagram of my name.</p>

<p>You know, I was thinking about this Cavalier Daily debate, and I admit that I'm such a nerd that I read the CD online almost every day. As far as college newspapers go, it's pretty good, but I do miss the days when we also had the University Journal. Yes, there was a time when UVa had 2 competing daily newspapers, and though the UJ wasn't really better than the CD, it at least brought competition - therefore I believe better writing from both.</p>

<p>Anyway, I think if there isn't any interest in the CD's Science section, it's not because UVa students don't like science or technology. I think it comes down perhaps to the editorial and journalistic choices of the newspaper. Why won't the CD write about the hot new gadgets or video games coming out? Gaming is huge right now. How about articles about the research that some undergrads, grads, and professors are doing? I would find that interesting - like how an undergrad devised a simpler sign language for the mentally challenged or that UVa Engineering student who drove cross-country on a bus w/ an engine he designed that only uses bio-fuels. So basically he had to stop at restaurants along the way and ask for their used cooking oil and other waste to power his bus all the way to Alaska and back. Or how about an article on those 3 UVa professors who created a whole new metallic alloy? How about writing profiles on alumni who making contributions to science and technology? For example, Francis Collins who is the director of the Human Genome project or Eric Anderson, who founded Space Adventures, a private company that sent millionaire Dennis Tito to outer space.</p>

<p>More to the point, let's take a look at the Virginia Quarterly Review. Usually, whenever someone refers to any 'zine with the words "quarterly" or "review" in its name, people usually think of them as boring ivory-towered publications, but the VQR has recently become the darling of the magazine world. Two years ago, Ted Genoways who got his MFA from UVa took over the university publication, and with fascinating articles and an updated modern visage, the VQR this year has been nominated with an unprecedented 6 Ellies (which are the Oscars of the magazine world). Only Atlantic Monthly received more with 8, and the magazines that received 5 or less? National Geographic, Harper's, The New Yorker, Vanity Fair, and New York Magazine. These are the perennial magazine powerhouses, and UVA's VQR with only 4 full-time staff employees and a circulation of 6,000 beat them.<br>
<a href="http://www.vqronline.org/%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.vqronline.org/&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>You see, there is an interest in compelling topics in all areas including Science. The questions are, "What are you presenting?" and "How are you presenting it?"</p>

<p>I agree with you that the lack of interest in the CD's Science section may have to do with a lack of interesting and relevant topics. </p>

<p>However, I still stand by my initial claim that the general student body has very little interest in scientific issues such as the ones you described. </p>

<p>I tried my best to recruit writers and include relevant stories. We covered technology, discoveries, research...basically every realm of science from anthropology to competing internet browsers. (I must admit that I am biased because I was Science editor for a year. The newly elected Managing Board told me that without Science, the newspaper will be better... quite literally.)</p>

<p>In truth, the MB's decision reflected the fact that students are much more willing (or should I say, desparate) to read about someone's sex life (covered in the existing Health and Sexuality page) rather than someone's drive across country on bio-degradable fuel.</p>

<p>By the way, just to see what some other schools are doing, I checked MIT's, Columbia's, and U. Chicago's school newspapers online, and they don't have a Science section. I doubt that means that students at schools like MIT aren't interested in science and technology. </p>

<p>Also, I just reviewed the CD's Science section online. Though the Pluto article is interesting, I think there are far more fascinating topics the CD could cover that would garner people's interest. </p>

<p>What I do find odd is the article titled "What Is Science?" Considering that UVa students had to take 3 or 4 years of science courses in high school before they could even enter the University, I find it puzzling that the CD would need to explain to UVa students what science is. </p>

<p>With all due respect, I think if you want UVa students to be more interested in the Science section, the CD should up the ante a bit. I'm not trying to be overly critical. It's just constructive criticism from someone who works in journalism albeit television.</p>