Vaccine reluctance & General COVID Discussion

Everything I’ve read has suggested if you have Covid, you only need one shot for the best immunity so I suspect your doctor will say, “One and done!”

Wishing you the best with recovery. Those I know who had side effects from the vax can take a couple of days to feel back to normal. Sending hugs. Lots of hugs.

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From CNN:

<<< Covid-19 vaccines have saved nearly 280,000 lives in the US

Covid-19 vaccines saved hundreds of thousands of lives and prevented more than a million hospitalizations in the United States, according to new estimates from researchers at Yale University and the Commonwealth Fund.

By the end of June, the researchers estimate there would have been about 279,000 additional deaths due to Covid-19 – about 46% more than there were – and as many as 1.25 million additional hospitalizations if there were no vaccinations. If vaccinations had progressed at half the pace that they did, about 121,000 more people might have died and more than 450,000 more people would have been hospitalized.

Dr. Rochelle Walensky, director of the US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, has constantly underlined the important impact of vaccines for this reason.

“Preliminary data from several states over the last few months suggests that 99.5% of deaths from Covid-19 in the United States were in unvaccinated people. Those deaths were preventable with a simple, safe shot,” Walensky said during a White House Covid-19 briefing last week.

Even with the new threatening Delta variant in play, we have evidence from other countries that high vaccination rates can help keep more deadly surges at bay.

“In my mind, vaccines are the single most important factor” in the fight against the Delta variant, Becky Dutch, a virologist and chair of the University of Kentucky’s department of molecular and cellular biochemistry, told CNN.>>>

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I have read that the 1st shot for a person who had Covid is equivalent to other’s 1nd vaccination. My second vaccination had me down and out for a good 8 weeks, and I went on a month long course of anti-inflammatories to kick the total body joint pain from inflammation. It seemed to also kick most of the fatigue.

Could be true for the US, for that specific time period and other unspecified metrics. UK, for the latest slice of time, looks different.

BBC piece and includes a take on the above stats by whoever they picked to provide it.

That’s 100% clickbait. Read the article, not the headline. Plus, it is from The GUARDIAN, not the BBC.

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I can’t help but wonder if the difference is due to the UK spreading out the two doses the way they chose to do to try to get more the first dose quickly. Correct timing could be important. I hope they come out with more data instead of just headlines.

A couple of interesting articles:

My son in the Navy got the J&J vaccine and so did his wife because that’s all they were offering. They had mild reactions. I took a continuing ed class from a guy who’d had Guillame-Barre who was convinced he was triggered by the chemicals we use in construction. (The class was on building with healthier materials.)

This is just sickening and despicable:

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I’m sorry you are dealing with such terrible side effects and feel better soon.

I was with a friend last night who also had side effects after having the vaccine after covid itself. Her husband was the same. But they said the second shot was easier for both of them.

One thing to be hopeful about is that you are having a strong immune reaction that might help your immune system deal with the long haul symptoms you’ve been experiencing.

Please continue to let us know how your are doing. :heart:

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3-5 x the entire population at large? 3-5 x the population infected with viruses such as influenza?

From CNN:

“The FDA said 100 preliminary reports of Guillain-Barré syndrome had been filed with the US government’s Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting System, out of 12.8 million Janssen vaccines given.”

Note that these cases have been reported to VAERS, not that they have been verified and determined to be caused by the J & J vaccine.

From VAERS:

https://www.cnn.com/2021/07/12/health/johnson-vaccine-guillain-barre-syndrome-fda/index.html

It would be very frightening to be afflicted with this syndrome. Hopefully they can get to the bottom of the mechanism that caused these cases of G-B, if indeed they were caused by the vaccine. If they can figure out the mechanism of action, they may be able to come up with specific risk factors that would be a contraindication for certain susceptible individuals in taking the J & J or prophylactic actions that can be taken to prevent it.

I am disgusted by this. Do people want to see us go back to the days when babies died of whooping cough? Being vaccinated against that protects those too young to be vaccinated. Do they want children to get measles? Do they want pregnant women to get sick from diseases that might harm their babies? Lunacy.

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I am also disgusted with the department of health for bowing to political pressure.

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I just finished reading that whole article and all I can say is, “wow” as I pick my jaw up off the floor. To say more would probably get too political, but hopefully I can still say I wish health folks could be in charge of health related things instead of politicians.

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When my reluctant daughter went to the pharmacy to get her shot, the intake person asked when her last tetanus shot was. Umm? So I pulled out her vaccination records and it has been more than 10 years. That means her sister also needs one, and so do I.

Mine came up on my ‘my chart’ (also need pneumonia and shingles).

WHY do they try to make this so difficult? I will say I don’t think it is ‘red’ states that do it. Florida has a very thorough system for getting all kids vaccinated for all required shots before you can start school there. Has to be through a Florida’s doctor’s office or the county health department. Mississippi also has a high vaccination rate for MMR, DTap, etc.

In Colorado, vaccinations are not required. Our pediatrician wouldn’t see patients who opt out.

It has been noted that having only the first dose of the vaccines available in the UK (Pfizer - BioNTech and Oxford - AstraZeneca, both two dose vaccines) is only about 33% effective against B.1.617.2 / Delta, worse than against B.1.1.7 / Alpha (still only about 50%).

Vaccine 1d vs Alpha 2d vs Alpha 1d vs Delta 2d vs Delta
Pfizer - BioNTech BNT162b2 49% 93% 33% 88%
Oxford - AstraZeneca ChAdOx1 51% 66% 33% 60%

(1d = 1 dose, 2d = 2 doses)

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In the link you provided, data is updated through July 9th and show 257 Delta variant deaths, of which only 92 are identified as occurring in the unvaccinated.

They break the data out by age and vaccination status. Based on the data, it looks like your chance of death if you are <50 is about the same whether or not you are vaccinated, but that your chance of death is more than halved if you are vaccinated in the 50 or older category.

While this data has limitations (doesn’t say anything about potential behavior differences based on vaccination status, and wow those are unhelpfully broad age bands), it does make me feel slightly better for my brother and sister who are vaccine reluctant. Both are in their forties. I still hope they get vaccinated, of course.

Not sure what population is included in the baseline number. Perhaps the CNN or other articles clarify this.

That is correct. The association seems strong enough to suggest a link and prompt a warning, but they haven’t determined a causal connection at this time nor have they halted the vaccine.

Pfizer met with gov’t scientists earlier this week re booster shots. The gov’t scientists are waiting to get more data from breakthrough cases.

But here is where I’m having problems…the CDC only cares about breakthroughs if they result in hospitalization or death. Pfizer thinks efficacy to prevent mild cases is decreasing (Israel), but that is not going to matter to the U.S.

The necessity for vaccine boosters might further decrease converting the vaccine hesitants. They will figure if vaxxed people are getting sick, then why bother with the vaccine? I think that is another reason the U.S. doesn’t want to emphasize boosters.

I have done what I was supposed to. I still mask indoors and avoid stores unless first thing in the morning and uncrowded.

I rec’d my 2nd vax dose at the very beginning of February. So I fear that my immunity may be waning. When do I get a booster if I’m not in a LTC facility or immunosuppressed or a transplant recipient? I have read that these are probably the people who will be recommended to get a booster shot.

I do not want to get even a mild case of covid-19. I don’t want long covid. And, since the viral load is so much higher with Delta, I find it hard to believe that the chance for long covid doesn’t also increase with breakthrough Delta cases.

I really resent that this country has pandered to the vaccine hesitant/unvaxxed and unmaskers. We need swift and strong mask mandates, at the very least. I would also favor a national vax passport.

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I definitely wish we had this and private businesses who wanted to could choose to require them. I look at what France is doing and am envious.

I also still would like to know if the UK breakthrough “fully vaxed” deaths were vaxed at the recommended time frames or the extended time frames. Essentially, was the recommended time frame better than what they chose to do extending things or did it make no difference.