And this statement is exactly why trust is “eroded”. While Ivermectin is a livestock deworming medication, there is also the Ivermectin FDA approved anti viral for humans. That is a very reasonable thing to study as a therapeutic for Covid, and a very reasonable thing for people to want to try when there is no hope. To state otherwise is very disingenuous and to continue to degrade those who want to study or try the FDA approved human version continues to add to the distrust.
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Source please. Thanks.
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There was an earlier conversation about teachers and a) the impact of the Pandemic on teachers; and b) how teachers/teachers unions are trying to keep learning remote when the undeniably negative consequences of remote learning are becoming clearer; and c) whether F2F classes are now safe enough for students, teachers and the families of students. From some of the folks, I think there was just a sense that teachers should just suck it up. There were others who thought teachers didn’t feel like taking the medical risks and other indignities that have become part of the job for the salaries that they were getting and others saying teachers were well-compensated.
Here is an interesting article suggesting that teachers are leaving teaching at pretty high rates:
Teachers Are Quitting, and Companies Are Hot to Hire Them - WSJ.
This appears to be different than the Great Resignation, which often involves people just switching to jobs at similar companies but with better salaries or better work-life balance. Here, these folks are leaving teaching.
This trend predates the Pandemic (Teachers Quit Jobs at Highest Rate on Record - WSJ) but is clearly exacerbated by it.
When experienced teachers leave, it is consequential if they are being replaced by new teachers (or not replaced at all). A study I read suggests that teachers improve significantly over the first five years in terms of teaching skill (and probably classroom management skill) and then more or less plateau, with the possibility of decline after 20 years of experience. We live in a town with one of the best public school systems in a state which is thought to have among the best public education in the country. Our school system only hires people with five years of experience or more.
Taking the “just suck it up” stance may feel morally or politically right but it may well be exacerbating teacher departure, which is likely to be degrading the qualities of the schools.
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It’s not FDA approved as an “anti-viral”, it’s FDA approved as an antiparasitic. It’s under study, but so far the FDA has not approved it as a Covid 19 treatment or for any other virus.
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Multiple studies indicate no evidence of efficacy against Covid
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And I never once said it was approved as a treatment for Covid 19! It is approved in human form, yet the narrative continues to be that people want to take a horse dewormer.
I said it is a very reasonable thing to study for the treatment of Covid and that it is a reasonable thing for people to want to try when there is no hope.
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You said it is an FDA approved anti-viral. It is not.
So far the studies have not been promising.
From the maker of Ivermectin:
KENILWORTH, N.J., Feb. 4, 2021 – Merck (NYSE: MRK), known as MSD outside the United States and Canada, today affirmed its position regarding use of ivermectin during the COVID-19 pandemic. Company scientists continue to carefully examine the findings of all available and emerging studies of ivermectin for the treatment of COVID-19 for evidence of efficacy and safety. It is important to note that, to-date, our analysis has identified:
- No scientific basis for a potential therapeutic effect against COVID-19 from pre-clinical studies;
- No meaningful evidence for clinical activity or clinical efficacy in patients with COVID-19 disease, and;
- A concerning lack of safety data in the majority of studies.
We do not believe that the data available support the safety and efficacy of ivermectin beyond the doses and populations indicated in the regulatory agency-approved prescribing information.
If studies show effective anti-viral activity in vivo, I’m sure Merck will be shouting the news to all and sundry.
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I think this is what people are objecting to.
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It absolutely is a reasonable thing to study. The paper you linked was from October 2020. Since then there has been considerable research. See the link I posted above which summarizes those more recent studies.
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Ok. So I apologize for my wording of “an FDA approved antiviral”
It’s FDA approved
It shows antiviral effects
There are approved uses in humans primarily as an anti parasitic.
You either are totally misunderstanding my point that the constant narrative of people wanting to take horse dewormer contributes to the distrust. Or you continue to shout that from the rooftops to degrade the opinion of others.
There is a lot of distrust in this country and I completely understand why. I really get the feeling at times that some people are so invested in the vaccine that they shoot down any discussion at all of therapeutics.
I never said Ivermectin was a treatment or a cure for Covid. Why do people here continue to shout about “horse dewormer” rather than admit there are human uses. The horse deworming narrative started early in the studies when maybe there was some promise and the refusal to acknowledge that the drug itself has human uses and deserved to be studied.
My post was not about Ivermectin itself it was about mistrust. I stand by this post I had upthread.
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I guess my point was I do not understand why some people are trusting some of the sources they do! 
(They trust some unknown source that says jump up and down 10 time while you sing happy birthday before a known scientist, medical doctor, research school, govt, etc?)
As far as Ivermectin specifically - the FDA tweeted “stop, y’all”. So no, it was not FDA approved to treat COVID.
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There are many other reasons besides Covid to drive a person out of teaching. My wife has 147 high school students taking Chemistry, arrives at work by 6 am and normally leaves work between 5-6pm most days. She spends some time grading papers once she comes home. She averages grading papers 8-10 hours a day on the weekends and also charters a time consuming extra curricular while making less money than I, who rarely brings work home and never works more than 45 hours a week. I forgot to mention that she is also better educated than I am. You don’t work like that without loving what you do, but it is easy to get burned out.
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I would consider a vaccine “hope”.
(I would try putting that in my body before a deworming medication.)
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You were arguing for verbal precision, yet you objected to others pointing out the lack of it in your own post. “Expected antiviral activity” is worlds away from “FDA approved anti-viral.” It’s an important distinction.
As to the whole “horse de-wormer” debacle, that misnomer gained ground because many vocal anti-vaxxers encouraged its use on social media as an option in the absence of a prescription of the human formulation, and it took off, both for those looking for a miracle cure and for those looking to make fun of anti-vax or vax-hesitant people.
Most people who refer to Ivermectin treatment are referring to the human formulation currently in trials. But because a small percentage of uneducated/ignorant people have embraced the animal formulation if unable to obtain a prescription from a doctor, the cynical have seized upon this as if it were a widespread phenomenon. This notion has gained such ground that many people now believe that use of the “horse de-wormer” is actually what most people are advocating for.
Our local news did report at one time that several feed stores were struggling with keeping up their supply for their regular customers because so many more people than normal were buying it.
ETA: written before seeing your follow up post.
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I know people who are stockpiling the horse dewormer and sharing on FB how to get it. 
Yeah, I have seen people on Facebook advocating for its use. I’ve even seen posts that direct people to specific feed stores that have it in stock.
Still, I don’t think this is a widespread practice. At least, I hope it isn’t.
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Totally missed my point and continuing to make comments insinuating I somehow said Ivermectin was approved for Covid 19. Definitely have gained my trust with this exchange!
Have a nice day everyone.
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No one thinks/stated you said Ivermectin was approved for Covid 19. People are reacting to your misstatement of fact that Ivermectin is approved in humans as an anti-viral. Facts matter.
Then, you went on to say this… which is still not correct. Ivermectin tablets are FDA approved in humans ONLY as an anti-parasitic.
While true that Ivermectin has exhibited some anti-viral activity, a number of well-done and/or published studies have shown little to no activity against SARS-CoV2, as posted above. This data resulted in both the FDA and Merck having to make statements for people to not use Ivermectin as covid-19 treatments.
Your misstatement of facts proves your point perfectly because they have eroded trust in what you are saying, which in turn can lead people to miss your points, which often are reasonable and well articulated.
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Absolutely.
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