My daughter’s partner tested positive for COVID AFTER my kid picked them up at the station. My daughter immediately went to my small apartment, since I was away, and tested for three days. She left my place last night because she missed her routines at home and tested positive this morning. I am still away and going to give a little time for my apartment to air out before I return.
My other daughter and I are both medically vulnerable and knock on wood still haven’t gotten it but are very careful (masking, avoiding eating indoors etc.). I keep turning social invitations down because noone wants to test beforehand. I don’t understand why testing is so difficult but I guess it is a psychological resistance. Once the holiday surge is over I am going to loosen up a bit but I do think, as the recent NY Times wrote, that some of us are kind of left behind.
Testing is not difficult, but not everyone has an unused stockpile of tests, getting them with no hassle through the USPS is limited (20 from previous rounds, 4 for the current round), and they may have been used up if the household had COVID-19 go through it. People might not want to go out of their way to get more tests…
Of course, there are other sniffly or feverish illnesses (flu, RSV, colds, etc.) that are going around. Some people think that if it is not COVID-19 (after testing negative), it is ok to spread them around because they are “minor” (and people generally seem to underestimate the flu).
It would be nice if there were readily available rapid antigen tests that could detect multiple viruses in one test, so that one test can be used to check for COVID-19, flu, RSV, and whatever else is among the more severe things that a sniffle or sore throat may indicate.
I get 8 free tests every month at the pharmacy and my friends are also eligible. Supply is not the issue. People just aren’t doing it.
My understanding is that COVID is different in that contagiousness occurs before symptoms. Is that still true? The other illnesses at least give some warning with symptoms happening before or at the same time as contagiousness. But yeah a home test for flu would be great.
I wear a mask for protection against everything. I can’t even afford to cough with the state of my bones after cancer treatment.
Yes, COVID-19 can be contagious for a few days before symptoms, although that is not always the case. Vaccinated people who get breakthrough infections may show symptoms before the viral load gets to contagious levels (as shown on rapid antigen tests that are not immediately positive when symptoms start, but become positive later), although it should not be relied on that this is always the case, especially since COVID-19 can also cause asymptomatic or barely symptomatic infections that are contagious.
However, the presymptomatic contagious period for flu (1 day or less) was generally considered to be much shorter than for COVID-19 (2-4 days, at least for the original strain in unvaccinated people), which meant that COVID-19 had a much greater head start period of spreading before someone felt sick enough to stop being near other people.
Probably just comes down to most people in the US just wanting to be “over” COVID-19, even though the virus is still circulating and mutating, and is probably at least as dangerous as the flu (but people tend to underestimate the severity of the flu, despite tends of thousands of deaths in most years) with some risk of long COVID thrown in on top.
I think the problem is multi-fold for you. People are just COVID exhausted. Almost no one is willing to do a screening test because it just brings the topic back to mind. Then there is the issue with the (in)accuracy of the home test. I won’t inquire about your medical comorbidities. I will say that as a healthcare provider, I do believe that proper masks clearly reduce one’s risk for respiratory infections. That said, I point out that I now know of at least 4 studies that are showing a higher incidence of COVID infections in people who are multi-vaxed (3 or more). The sweet spot is actually 1 vax plus 1 past infection. There is a theory of immune imprinting which may explain this phenomenon. Also there is a study which shows after the 3rd vax, the predominant stimulated antibody is IgG4 which is less active in clearing COVID. So while the antibody titers go up after each vax, they may be less effective.
I randomly saw your message and intended to be snarky but I no longer care to be. I would tell you that another booster, at least in the setting of the current COVID variants/strains, is NOT a good idea. If a more virulent strain comes out in the future, it may then make sense for you. Take zinc and Vit C daily. Wear a mask in risky settings. But don’t live in fear. If you get an Omicron variant you probably aren’t going to get seriously ill. Best wishes to you and your family.
I+nV is better than either I or nV alone (n = number of doses).
For vaccination, recency of the most recent dose matters.
Bivalent booster is better than monovalent booster against recent variants, but is not an invincible shield.
However, the greater incidence of getting COVID-19 after 3+ doses is likely due to (a) most people no longer doing other things to avoid infection (masking, avoiding indoor places, etc.), and (b) the higher contagiousness of the Omicron variant that became predominant around the time people were able to get to 3+ doses of vaccine.
That matches with my anecdotal observations:
2020 before vaccines: most people were actively trying to avoid COVID-19 by masking, avoiding indoor places, social distancing, etc., so few got it, but a high percentage who got it had bad cases and/or long COVID.
late 2021, most people had 2 doses, Delta: people started getting exposed more and getting it, but a smaller percentage had bad cases.
2022, many people had 3+ doses, Omicron: people mostly stopped trying to avoid COVID-19, so lots of people got it, but hardly any had bad cases (although some still had unpleasant experiences for over a week).
You know what I’m tired of? “We’re tired of testing. We’re tired of Covid” blah blah blah. I’m sorry, it takes a minute and it makes a huge difference for people who are vulnerable. Rapid tests don’t catch all positives, true. Seat belts don’t save everyone. The fact is that people who don’t yet test positive, are probably not as contagious. Testing unquestionably makes a difference.
And yes, there are other bugs out there–Flu, RSV, etc. None are remotely as contagious as the newer strains of Covid, which are approaching measles level of contagion. And masks help guard against them all.
I went to my local supermarket this morning; literally half --at least-- of customers and workers were masked.
Testing–not a big deal. Masks–not a big deal. Many Americans–big babies.
@pablopaco I assure you I am not living in fear. Just rode the NYC subway- masked.
I think that trying to mitigate risk at a party 4 days after Christmas is prudent, not anxious. I am disappointed that friends who know my vulnerabilities could not do a 15 minute, free test, but I agree with ucbalumnus that doing home tests might be somehow triggering for people.
I am accustomed to assisted living visits and my daughter is accustomed to university policies and both contexts are still strict. I understand that is different from the way others are living. My main concern during holiday visits is not myself, despite co-morbidities, because I think I would probably do fine. But one of my kids had a life-threatening brain injury and viruses do weird things to them, including losing vision and ability to walk.
Apart from that, I think we could all be determining our behavior according to rates in our communities and be more careful during surges. The post-holiday week/s would seem to be a time to mitigate risk. Yes most cases now seem to be mild, but not for everyone. Masking and testing work and they aren’t that hard.
If someone asked to me to test, I would do it. Sometimes we do things we don’t want to, but we do at the behest of a friend. It’s really NBD to take a test. They are free! You can get them at the pharmacy. For free!
But then I’m cranky today. I feel so bad for the people working at my mom’s rehab facility. The employees have to mask, my mom is hard of hearing and she’s having trouble hearing what people are saying. Without being able to see their mouths moving. And they ask lots of questions!
But mom will get used to the masks and questions. But boy do I feel for the employees
My aunt called today, she has covid. No idea how she got it. Now she gets to isolate at her sons house.
@deb922 sorry about your mom. I had to have my mother’s hearing aid turned up due to the masks! (The staff at her facility seem okay with masks. Family visitors have to wear them too.)
I wore my mask when any staff entered the room and up and down the halls. I took it off when we were alone in the room. I understand that isn’t the best as I was respirating in mom’s space. But as you know it’s so very hard to navigate these things.
But thanks for your support. I really appreciate it.
I’m sorry. I thought it was a private message to the poster alone. Off the top of my head, go look at the Cleveland clinic study of 51,000 employees that came out in the last week or so. There is also one from Qatar which showed a similar result where the incidence increased with the number of vaccinations. Also look at the data from Portugal, one of the highest vax uptake countries in the world. The bivalent vaccine has now been shown to be around 20-30% effective. The argument that people are having breakthrough infections at a higher rate in 2022 because they became complacent is interesting. Am I supposed to believe the hardcore anti-vaxer wasn’t more complacent that the triple vaxed? Shouldn’t they have always had higher incidence? Unless, of course, there is a developing negative effect. Which I believe is true. What I find interesting is the split in beliefs about these issues along political lines. If it is actually “science” related, why would that be? It seems to be more about population control and division than anything else. There is an extreme resistance to be open to any idea contrary to a specific narrative put forth by the government, their scientists, and pharmaceutical companies. Doesn’t true science involve constant questioning and evolution of thought rather than labelling, dismissing, and censoring all of it as “misinformation” . I’m truly interested in the reaction to the above.
“In conclusion, this study found an overall modest protective effect of the bivalent vaccine booster against COVID-19, among working-aged adults. The effect of multiple COVID-19 vaccine doses on future risk of COVID-19 needs further study.”
Here is the Cleveland Clinic study. It is helpful when posters cite their sources.
Simply stating that the bivalent vaccine is “20%-30% effective” is not helpful. I assume you mean effective in PREVENTING Covid-19 infection, and this is true (it was 30% in the Cleveland Clinic study).
But, that number doesn’t include the vaccine’s reduction in disease severity, hospitalizations, long-Covid, and death…all worthwhile outcomes.
CC study Summary and Detailed Results:
Among 51011 working-aged Cleveland Clinic employees, the bivalent COVID-19 vaccine booster was 30% effective in preventing infection, during the time when the virus strains dominant in the community were represented in the vaccine.
Among 51011 employees, 20689 (41%) had had a previous documented episode of COVID-19, and 42064 (83%) had received at least two doses of a COVID-19 vaccine. COVID-19 occurred in 2452 (5%) during the study. Risk of COVID-19 increased with time since the most recent prior COVID-19 episode and with the number of vaccine doses previously received. In multivariable analysis, the bivalent vaccinated state was independently associated with lower risk of COVID-19 (HR, .70; 95% C.I., .61-.80), leading to an estimated vaccine effectiveness (VE) of 30% (95% CI, 20-39%). Compared to last exposure to SARS-CoV-2 within 90 days, last exposure 6-9 months previously was associated with twice the risk of COVID-19, and last exposure 9-12 months previously with 3.5 times the risk.
As with any study there are potential limitations. One of the primary CC study limitations is detailed below.
A possible explanation for a weaker than expected vaccine effectiveness is that a substantial proportion of the population may have had prior asymptomatic Omicron variant infection. About a third of SARS-CoV-2 infections have been estimated to be asymptomatic in studies that have been done in different places at different times [17–19]. If so, protection from the bivalent vaccine may have been masked because those with prior Omicron variant infection may have already been somewhat protected against COVID-19 by virtue of natural immunity.
You will have to take the political discussion to another thread.
That said, they haven’t updated their vaxxed vs unvaxxed cases and deaths since Sept. Any idea why? As last reported, one was 3x more likely to get it and 6x more likely to die if unvaxxed. I wonder if places are no longer keeping stats with that. I suppose most are unlikely to change their minds at this point.
We Creeklanders had both original shots and one booster, then had mild cases of Covid after a train trip back in June. We have not gotten the final booster and I’m not sure if we’re going to or not. I’m less worried about it after having had a mild case, but I’d love to see stats on whether it’s better, not, or no change.
I’d also love to see a lot more research on who’s likely to have a bad case, esp those outside the norm. What is it about their bodies making them more likely to react?
I guess I will sanitize when I get home.
mom will get used to the masks and questions. But boy do I feel for the employees