<p>Hi,
My son is 3qd and has a nomination although we're not positive it's the principal nom., it appears he is the first choice.
I noticed on the the CC forum that candidates are getting invited to CVW's and called his regional admissions director today and asked if he could receive an invitation (on his voice mail), also followed the advice on the forum and son called same to tell him the Naval academy is his first choice and he would really really like an appointment.
Well the regional admissions director called us back tonight with bad news. He told my son his SAT's are too low and his grades need improvement. Mind you he is a candidate who is taking college courses in his senior year, v-lettered, well rounded etc....
He said the board looked at his file and decided this. I called him back and left a vm asking that my son be considered for NAPS.
Last week our BGO told us his file wouldn't be reviewed until after Jan 31st when the other noms are submitted.
I also contacted the nom source and was told there had been no appointments from their pool yet so my son stands a good chance.
Called the BGO tonight to ask what's up and why the discrepancies but he hasn't called us back.
I just read on another post someone appealed a rejection and was offered NAPS. Any thoughts on this? I also read that 3qd with noms are automatically considered for NAPS or the Foundation if rejected.
Just a little history here, the day son got his official candidate number we didn't have any bubble wrap. Car accident. Totaled, no injuries but as you may know very inconvenient not to mention traumatizing.
The day he received the phone call announcing his nomination, my Navy Career brother of 20 years (Vietnam) brother passed away after hearing the good news. It was icy here in CT. so we couldn't travel to his funeral and my son ended up meeting with and Thanking our Congressman for the nomination, in addition to having photo shoots and being invited to a private reception with the Congressman at his high school.
It certainly seemed as though one Navy Officer left this earth for another to take his place.
We were sure he would receive an appointment and are soooo hurt. Our whole town is rooting for him and waiting for the good news.
The admissions officer told my son to go to college and apply next year. Without going through any more details about hurt and tragedy I'll just put it this way. We can't go through it again. I'm a single mother in bad health and he's been abandoned emotionally by his dad. It was one glitch after another with Concorde and Dodmerb........
Not looking for sympathy, I have felt terrible too when I saw the disappointment on CC from candidates who didn't get a nomination or an appointment. Now we're one of them and it seems so unreal. Not to brag but my son is extraordinary in many many ways. Hate to see him hurt again. Any advice?????????</p>
<p>I do not know your son nor anything about him besides what I have read here but if he really wants the academy then he should keep at it. I am a strong christian and in my eyes, maybe God is using this as a test to see him persevere, or maybe it is not his plan. Who knows? the only way you can know is to keep trying. If he doesn't get it this year then keep at it if HE still truly wants it. It might just take him an extra year or two if it is in Gods plan. Also maybe consider a foundation school (Marion Military Academy, etc), enlistment, NROTC, etc if he is not offered. After this then reapply. Who knows? It might work out. The best of luck to you. Keep strong and have heart. It will all work out in the end. </p>
<p>One last bit of advice: Get HIM to show that he wants it. If HE calls the admissions office frequently (do not get annoying though) to ask for updates, it will show his desire. Just don't give up.</p>
<p>"I will never quit!I persevere and thrive on adversity. My Nation expects me to be physically harder and mentally stronger than my enemies. If knocked down I will get back up every time! I will draw on every remaining ounce of strength to protect my Teammates and accomplish the mission. I am NEVER out of the fight!" -Creed of the US Navy SEAL</p>
<p>Never quit short of your best</p>
<p>scubaguy17,
Thank you for your reply. Being very strong Christians ourselves I had the same thoughts you wrote. God is in this all the way.
My son not only wants it but is going to achieve his dream no matter what. I have to have faith there is a plan.</p>
<p>I do hope they offer NAPS to make him more competitive scholastically for Plebe year. Really gives an edge to that hectic time of life.</p>
<p>If anyone else needs inspiration check out tridude87's posts. He didn't give up and prayer was involved. </p>
<p>Thank you again scubaguy17. Will take all your advice and post The Creed of the US Navy Seal on our fridge!</p>
<p>I do not know from experience but I have heard numerous times that previous applicants who apply again impress the review boards because it shows that they really want it. </p>
<p>It looks like I might be in that same boat but not sure, and still hoping but I will definately apply again next year if I don't get offered an appointment this time around.</p>
<p>Chins up! and goodluck hopefully he is offered NAPS!</p>
<p>I am confused; how can he be 3q'd and then told he isn't competitive at this stage when all the applications are not even in??</p>
<p>
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The admissions officer told my son to go to college and apply next year. Without going through any more details about hurt and tragedy I'll just put it this way. We can't go through it again.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>The admissions officer gives good advice. If he doesn't make the cut this year, he should apply again next year if this is what he really wants. No one else should be making the decision for him, it's something he needs to decide by himself.</p>
<p>
[quote]
Last week our BGO told us his file wouldn't be reviewed until after Jan 31st when the other noms are submitted. I also contacted the nom source and was told there had been no appointments from their pool yet so my son stands a good chance.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Yes, that sound like good news, don't throw in the towel just yet.</p>
<p>BTW - last year, there were 474 3Q's with nominations who did not receive an appointment, so it's not a sure thing. </p>
<p>Make sure he has a back up plan this year (i.e., enrolling in community college and take plebe-level classes before re-applying next year).</p>
<p>Good luck.</p>
<p>My son was one of those 474 last year. Yes he was dissapointed, Yes he did have a plan b, c, and d. He chose to take an offer from USMA for civil prep and attend WP in 2008. It is hard to know how the decisions are made, there were those offered appts. last year whose record was not as impressive as my son's. You just have to trust that God is going to put your son where he needs to be.</p>
<p>md, </p>
<p>your MOC should be in a position to tell you whether or not they provide a ranked list of nominations or not, many MOCs just provide a list of "approved" nominees and leave it up to the academy to sort out which candidate(s) they want. </p>
<p>also, it may be too late but if one of the negatives cited by admissions is his SAT scores, take them again, I know there is a test this coming Saturday, if it's too late to get into this one, you may be able to hit another soon or switch to the ACT if the timing is better, you can always update scores though time is very short.</p>
<p>lastly as others have said, he should be making the calls, especially to his BGO, the last thing the Academy wants is an applicant that arrives on I-day to fulfill the ambitions of his/her parents, they have to be the one that wants to be there. </p>
<p>good luck and hang in there</p>
<p>FYI....never too late for SAT...can be expensive. Son #1 needed a score, did a walk-up reg...make sure you have a check w/ you...it's good if you have a form filled out ahead of time, too. Info for wak up is on the college board web site. It costs about 3X the normal price, but if you need the score, worth it.</p>
<p>Md, I'm also a bit confused by your statement that your son is 3 Q'ed, yet CGO told him his SATs and grades were too low. Maybe they are saying that he is qualified, but only marginally, and that there are many 3 Q'ed candidates with better scores/grades. Still, typically people whose scores and grades are "too low" are not considered academically qualified. Did your son receive a letter from CGO indicating he was triple Q'ed?</p>
<p>Also, if someone is academically qualified, that person typically is not offered NAPS/Foundation because those programs exist largely to help students who need additional academic preparation (and, in the case of NAPS, to assist those transitioning from the Fleet). Thus, if you are academically qualified for USNA, you probably don't need the extra help from NAPS/Foundation.</p>
<p>Finally, there isn't much your BGO can do for you at this point. BGOs are not directly involved in the admissions' decisions. We aren't told when CGO will review a packet, we aren't told when students are assigned to/slotted to a particular nomination source, etc. We know only if a student is triple Q'ed, whether that student has received any noms -but not if the student is a principle nom, and whether that student has been offered (note the past tense) an appointment, NAPS/Foundation, has been waitlisted, or has been rejected. We learn this AFTER the candidate himself, so your BGO actually has less information at this point than you do.</p>
<p>Does he have more than 1 nom? Maybe the regional could see that for the congressional nom his WCS was lower than another candidate that had already submitted their packet and so they were going to offer the appt. to someone else. I know this gives very little comfort, but to make it to his level speaks very highly of your son. Has thought about obtaining his commission through NROTC, it may not be his dream education, yet in the end of the day his ultimate goal should be obtaining a commission. 4 years is very little when you compare it to a 20 year career.</p>
<p>My very best wishes that the sun shines down on you soon</p>
<p>My heart goes out to you and your son. I relate to you on so many levels, yet we are still in the waiting-to-hear-more stage. I have been trying to prepare for the worst, but I don't know that anything prepares us as moms for watching the disappointment our kids go through. I have been lurking for several months now, trying to understand this whole process as our son is applying to USMA. It is extremely hard to remain patient and hopeful, yet at the same time to be realistic, knowing that there are so many candidates who are highly qualified with strengths and weaknesses each in different areas. It is tempting to constantly be second-guessing on the "what if's", and wondering exactly where our candidate stands in the midst of hearing of lots of kids admitted who already had LOA's when our candidate did not. </p>
<p>Our son talked with me last night and broke into tears at the pressures he feels of everyone wanting to know if he has heard anything yet when he wants this more than anything in life. Deep down he knows he needs a backup school, but he honestly does not want to go anywhere else so it is hard to motivate toward those means. Now schools with Army and Air Force ROTC programs are unindating him with requests for interviews and some have put pressure on for making their school top choice. This has only added more stress as they are offering full 4-year scholarship, but he wants the academy life, not the civilian college life. Most of son's friends have already been admitted to a college and know where they are going, so I believe this is all the more unsettling. </p>
<p>He has taken the CFA 3 times, first time administered by his track coach-didn't count as coach was not certified in the field of Phy. Ed., 2nd time by his Lt Col in JROTC, but basketball score was too low, and area admissions sent letter telling him b/c of overall strong record, they were authorizing him to retake it a third time. Third time all scores improved but mile time, which increased by 11 seconds, not a great time. He has guts and is determined to do whatever it takes even if it means taking this a 4th time (except making the phone contacts, see sentence below), but there are still no guarantees. (And I know that he needs to be the one making the contacts, but he wants this so badly that he is afraid he will break down on the phone with the area admissions officer, so has emailed instead. Unfortunately, we have not had timely responses from emailing area admissions...) Ironically, DoDMERB was the easy part of the file for him even though son had been on accutane for acne, and had a hip condition that developed in track last spring requiring some phys. therapy before re-submitting the information to DoDMERB. He medically qualified fairly easily from what I have been gathering from others.</p>
<p>Attendance at West Point has been his desire since 8th grade. I knew it was a lofty goal and tried to convey the difficulty of admittance to him early-on. He took harder high school math classes than he had really been prepared by our middle school to take. Consequently, lower grades and lower GPA in a school system that does not weight for accelerated, honors, or AP courses, yet a school that has the 3rd highest ACT scores in the state. He has had academic highs and lows throughout all of high school, and has a lower GPA and class percentile (school does not rank) than if he had attended some of the easier county schools in our area. We have not received anything from WP since the "retake CFA" letter, so do not know if son is now considered officially physically qualified, or "scholastically qualified", though we thought they would not have sent the third chance CFA if they didn't think he was a fairly strong candidate all the way around including academics. Now I am wondering if we were mistaken in this understanding. His strength definitely lies in his leadership skills, not as strong academically or athleticly, though he is very well-rounded and his JROTC SASI says he is a very competitive candidate. He was selected for interviews with both of our senators and our congressman, but the congressman's interviews were not held until Jan. 12, so none have released their slates of nominees yet, or at least he has not been notified of his status.</p>
<p>I do know that in talking with our regional admissions officer at a seminar last spring, he indicated that a nomination should not be problem in our area with our son's test scores, which are great in Eng. and Reading, lower in math and sci. This makes me wonder if part of the acceptance is based on the competition within a region---perhaps your son is in a highly competitive region (rather than the whole nation) where others were a little stronger academically. It all seems to be relative to who else is applying from your area, and I know that sometimes that just seems really unfair as you have no idea who else is out there and just how qualified they are. One quote that has stuck with me from an area admissions seminar by our MALO (who is a little different: he was also the "panel" for one of the senators and in my son's interview he asked him what his ACT score was on the social studies portion!), "We will not set your sons and daughters up for academic failure. We want to see them succeed, and if we are not confident they will succeed academically, we will not put them in this position". I guess this has been reassuring to me in a strange kind of way. He also told us 1/3 of the entering USMA class will come from a college rather than out of high school. Which means there are many who apply the second time after at least a year of college before they are admitted. One boy from our school system who is in his 3rd year at Navy did not make it in the first time, but went on for a year of college first. I know you feel like this would be too hard to go through again. My son goes round and round with that whole idea, but the second time you know what to expect and what needs to be done first. DoDMerb will already be done (someone indicated medical eval. is good for 2 years) so that is at least one hurdle he wouldn't have to deal with if reapplying next year. </p>
<p>Emotionally, I do understand how hard it would be to go through all this again. Right now our son vacillates between saying he'll reapply even if he doesn't get in this year and saying he'll just go into ARmy ROTC and stay put. I guess that is where part of the tenacity becomes visible. As I told our son, only you can make the decision if it is worth it to you to take the CFA a (second/third) time. If you want this bad enough, then you'll do it, but don't do it for anyone but yourself. If it is not worth it to you, drop it all now. This is why so many start a candidate file and do not complete it. It is certainly not an easy process!! In the long run, he decided he had come too far to quit at a basketball throw being the only thing to hold him out physically. </p>
<p>And prayer has also been a part of this all along as I am part of a Moms In Touch group that meets weekly to pray for our children and their high school. All along I have told my son, "If this is where God wants you, he will put you there. If he needs you somewhere else, then he will give you the peace that you need to see you through the disappointment. I wish I could tell you that this is where he wants you, but I am not the one authorized to make that decision!" I do believe our children are learning/gaining a great deal from this whole application process: perseverance, patience, tenacity, and a never-give-up attitude will take our youth a long way in a difficult world. </p>
<p>Please know that you are in my thoughts and prayers as we as parents navigate these murky uncertainties together.</p>
<p>as hard as it may be....</p>
<p>-if he wants it bad enough, does he want it bad enough to apply again?
-if he wants it bad enough, does he want it bad enough to attend a local collage for a year and make the grades?</p>
<p>Sometimes the parents think that their son/daughter want it bad enough....but do they? Actions- their actions speak volumes.</p>
<p>Seems like a lot of adversity hitting your home all at once, and perhaps a delay before adding more to the plate might prove to be a good thing. I mean that in the sincerest of ways.</p>
<p>But for practical advice:
1. Make sure your son calls his BGO and lets him/her know that he would "gladly except" a foundation offer should one come his way.
2. If it is a matter of SATs, take them again if there is still time.
3. Make sure he has his applications to other colleges completed.<br>
4. Reapply for the following year. IF he wants it bad enough.</p>
<p>Best of luck!</p>
<p>In the next few weeks there will be families rejoicing and families crying. In the end your child must determine whether they want to be in the service. Our commanders for our area ARE NOT acad grads, if they want to make the military their career, you can make O-6/7 without and acad degree. They must decide are they applying for a career or and education.</p>
<p>I do not mean any offense to someone who decides after their committment to leave, you did your duty and honor. I am just saying to those who want to make a career, don't give up you can be a leader without the ring knocker.</p>
<p>This is from Pima (AD/DS)</p>
<p>"Also, if someone is academically qualified, that person typically is not offered NAPS/Foundation because those programs exist largely to help students who need additional academic preparation (and, in the case of NAPS, to assist those transitioning from the Fleet). Thus, if you are academically qualified for USNA, you probably don't need the extra help from NAPS/Foundation."</p>
<p>But it is still possible to go to NAPS if your acad q'd. My brother was academically qualified with no nomination and received a offer from NAPS.</p>
<p>Our children spend the bulk of their life up until to point of graduation from high school, preparing for what comes the day after they graduate. It’s all part of the rush to become adults with all the associated stress. They have little in the way of a frame of reference to consider what a delay in their plans really means before you even factor in the feelings associated with a rejection. With many kids that have enjoyed the level of achievement necessary get to the point of consideration by a service academy, they may have little if any experience with rejection or what they may perceive as “failure”. </p>
<p>When my son began applying to colleges and academies I told him that his life and the path to his future career(s) would not begin and end with what would occur in the coming months. We, and I mean all of us including our sons and daughters, place so much emphasis on getting from one point or place in our lives to another as quickly as possible we sometimes forget the path we take and what we learn along the way can be far more important in terms of how it shapes us than how long it takes to reach our goals. Adversity can be a great teacher; the things we learn along the way about ourselves may even cause us to reevaluate our goals, see them in a different light and in the end take a different path. </p>
<p>Good luck to all those that are waiting.</p>
<p>
[quote]
But it is still possible to go to NAPS if your acad q'd. My brother was academically qualified with no nomination and received a offer from NAPS.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Hence the reason I said "typically." There are exceptions. However, I personally have seen few.</p>
<p>There are plenty of very qualified candidates that get offered the Foundation program. I know from personal experience. Let's say that you are triple Q'd but your nomination is not the principal one from your MOC. In this case, the Academy knows that you are a highly desirable candidate but may not receive an appointment due to the type of nomination that you receive. You may be offered a slot in the Foundation program. This was the case with our son. He ultimately did receive an appointment and did not go through the Foundation program the year that he applied. If you check the information on the Foundation program, you will see that most of the participants are those triple Q'd candidates with a nomination that do not get an appointment for whatever reason in the year that they applied. There are several hundred of those candidates every year and somewhere around 80+ of those are lucky enough to get a Foundation slot.</p>
<p>rjrzoom57:</p>
<p>What terrific words of wisdom! Thanks for your reminder that the journey is when and where the real education takes place.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>The prep programs, both NAPS and Foundation, are primarily for the academically deficient. A 3Qed candidate is not academically deficient. There are exceptions to this, but they are very few and very far between. A single incident does not make a rule.</p>