Very "peaceful" tibetan "protest" in China

College Confidential Community
41

<p>the western media continues its incompetence. major news outlets repeatedly highlighted the pro-Tibet demonstrators today in London with barely a mention of the large group of pro-china counter-demonstrators present at the same event, in the same locations.</p>

<p>also eerily omitted from major news outlets was large pro-china demonstrations in Vancouver, Canada last week.</p>

<p>and Newjack,</p>

<p>I really don’t know enough about Chinese/Tibetan history to pass judgment on the issue at hand. I am merely disappointed in the quality of reporting that gets done by ‘reliable’ news outlets in the west. My message several posts up explain my frustration.</p>

42

<p>FYI: Tibet was part of China on and off throughout history. BBC should do their homework first.</p>

<p>

Consider the Tibetans looting and killing the Chinese. That is equally inexcusable, unless you’re setting very unacceptable double standards.</p>

<p>

Of course that’s true. But now that “protests” have erupted, what would you do? You’re not just gonna sit there and let the chaos unfold w/o taking any action, are you?</p>

<p>The day that Tibet becomes indepedent is the day the Aborigines are going to get back Australia or Mexico getting back California and Texas. It’s a matter of territory and it will always be that way. The Tibetan’s aim is pretty transparent: disrupt the Olympics so that we can celebrate the 49th anniversary of their failed protests instead of the 50th. And as I’ve said before, Tibet has no army nor any major country supporting their protests. One more thing, the UK is blocking websites that pro-China instead of pro-Tibet, which implies something very unsettling.</p>

43

<p>

</p>

<p>The Dalai Lama is pushing for an autonomous state, not and independent one - different things.</p>

<p>Come on - you’re defending China? Seriously?</p>

44

<p>“Consider the Tibetans looting and killing the Chinese. That is equally inexcusable, unless you’re setting very unacceptable double standards.”</p>

<hr>

<p>One must understand that when a peoples’ freedom is oppressed by a ruling power, they are going to fight back in whatever way the human spirit can to reclaim its natural need for freedom.</p>

<p>When the urban black neighborhoods in the U.S. erupted in violence after Martin Luther King, Jr. was killed, one could look at those riots and say, “Look at how horrible those people are, destroying private property and killing!” </p>

<p>However, stepping back from the flash point moment, it is clear that they were reacting to generations of subhuman oppression. The people who held them down created that turbulent situation for themselves.</p>

45

<p>

Well, two wrongs also don’t make a right. An eye for an eye and soon the whole world is blind. The Tibetans sure do have some things to be very angry about, but they have NO right whatsoever to start ruining the lives of innocent civilians. Basically,</p>

<p>

</p>

<p>likewise rings true on a personal level. Just because you have suffered an injustice does not give you the prerogative to start settling personal scores.</p>

<p>If you were the owner of one of the shops getting looted- all your life’s savings and work gone up in flames or carted away by hoodlums, or you were the parents or brother or son of one of the people who were getting stabbed to death brutally in the street, it would not simply be so easy to excuse this type of behavior.</p>

46

<p>^^
You’re absolutely right. I’m just saying that if we understand the root motivation of such violence, we can work together to end it altogether.</p>

47

<p>

Autonomous: existing or capable of existing independently.</p>

48

<p>I don’t know anything about Tibet and I’m not taking sides, but I think he may be distinguishing between completely independent, as in a separate country, and autonomous, where some degree of self-governing power is exercised. (Good example would be the state system here in the US)</p>

49

<p>I am confused about Dalai Lama’s message. On the one hand, I really really want to believe that he is for what he says, that conflicts should be resolved non-violently, that peace and cooperation are the only solutions. On the other hand, I see the reality, and any rational person would realize that there is a gap, a large gap, between his “words” and his “words in actions.” A recent interview with a senior Chinese Foreign Ministry analyst also yields a similar view from the Chinese government, that the Dalai Lama’s words do not correspond to his actions in reality.</p>

50

<p>In fact, Tibet did receive wide-ranging autonomy during the first 10 years of the People’s Republic, from 1949-1959. The Dalai Lama kept his government intact during that period, and he continued to be the political and spiritual leader of the region. During that time, the Chinese gov’t kept a relatively small presence in Tibet, with limited government personel and a few military garrisons stationed outside Lhasa. In fact, I would say that the relation between Tibet and China during that initial 10-year period was at its peak. During that time, Chinese premier Zhou Enlai even invited Dalai Lama to Beijing as well as a 4-month long tour of all major Chinese cities, factories, agricultural production centers, etc. Later, Dalai Lama was elected vice-president of the 1st National People’s Congress by over 2000 delegates from across China. That was also the highest political position any Tibetan had every held in the Chinese political system. </p>

<p>Unfortunately, this wide-ranging 10-year autonomy of Tibet was abruptly ended with Dalai Lama and his supporters armed rebellion in 1959, which deeply damaged relations Dalai Lama and the Chinese Government. From the Chinese perspective, this abrupt and unannounced coup d’etat in 1959 Tibet is the primary indicator for Dalai Lama’s questionable credibility.</p>

51

<p>"abuse of Tibetans is inexcusable, and the attempts of Chinese people here to make excuses for it, are laughable and sad.</p>

<p>Making comparisons to events which happened 100-150 years ago is rather irrelevant. If the U.S. was to invade a foreign country and overthrow its government today, I would be just as vocal in opposition - as I am with our ill-advised Iraqi misadventure."</p>

<p>I wonder if you can provide any solid evidence to back up your claim. Of course, China did commit various kinds of political persecution during the 1970s Cultural Revolution, which damaged Tibetan culture and religious freedom. In 1978, the Chinese government also formally acknowledged its mistakes in Tibet, and since then, attempted to re-vitalize Tibet by re-building temples, implementing affirmative action policies to help ethnic Tibetans in education and employment, as well as a series of agricultural and social aid for economically disadvantaged Tibetan peasants. In 2005, all agricultural and income taxes on Tibetan peasants were abolished by the Chinese government.</p>

<p>In a place like China, I’m sure that there are still occassional persecutations of political and human rights activists who cross the government’s “red line.” However, on a broader scale, one should also consider the general development and progress of China in the past 30 years. With a few exceptions, China as a whole has been gradually moving towards a more free, open, transparent, and socially responsible society in the last 3 decades. Although there are still thousands upon thousands of problems that need address, like land-seizure, pollution, urban and rural inequality, official corruption, human rights, freedom of press, communist party monopoly, etc etc etc, the people and the government there understand that in order to smoothly coordinate the process of transitioning 1.3 people into benefits of modernity, the most critical thing that must be maintained at ALL cost is political, economic, and social stability. People understand that no progress what-so ever can be achieved without a genuine, long-term, macro-stability. After all, England did not achieve its current strength, wealth, and democratic institutions over night, but over a period of more than 300 years of overall social, economic, and political stability. </p>

<p>As a Chinese abroad, I also want my homeland to be a strong, free, and comfortable place to live. I love China not because I’ve been brain-washed by government propaganda, but because I was born there and that will always be my root. Most Chinese people look to the United States, France, England, Canada, Japan, and they admire these countries for their past and current stability. Nonetheless, most in China also agree that China’s case is different, and to achieve these goals that Western nations have done in the past 150 years, China has to take a uniquely different road that is most suitable for China’s history, culture, and current situation.</p>

52

<p>

</p>

<p>ahahhaha</p>

<p>how much do you know about China again?</p>

53

<p>"ahahhaha</p>

<p>how much do you know about China again?"</p>

<p>I was born in China and lived there for 10 years. The last time I was there was 2 months ago in January. I am Han Chinese and my hometown is the city of Xi’an, in the northwestern province of Shaan’xi. I’m exactly sure how I should respond to your “ahahaha”.</p>

54

<p><a href=“http://www.blythe.org/nytransfer-subs/97as/Tibet_was_no_Shangri-La_[/url]”>http://www.blythe.org/nytransfer-subs/97as/Tibet_was_no_Shangri-La_&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

55

<p>CNN and all the U.S media are biased.
U.S is a country that is anti-China.</p>

<p>So,don’t explain to americans. It doesn’t make sense. You can’t convince people who hate you.</p>

56

<p>

Yes,that’s true.But you should understand that this is only want Chinese want,not what Americans want.</p>

<p>Most Americans even have no idea where tibet is and who Dalai is.And this doesn’t matter at all. The key is that they can be used as anti-China tool.</p>

57

<p>Did anyone watch the olympics torch relay in San Francisco today? It was really cool because thousands upon thousands of residents from the local Chinese community and other parts of CA all came out to support China and the Beijing Olympics. Of course, there was also the usual Free Tibet professional protestors, along with activists who are trying to pressure China on a whole spectrum of problems people like to bash.</p>

58

<p>Actually,not all of the free tibet protestors are professionals. Some of them are simply hired by free tibet organization.They don’t have enough people there now.
The pay is not bad.</p>

59

<p>

</p>

<p>You know, the funny thing about that is that we do. We want, say, people to be able to speak freely, even criticize the government, and not be imprisoned without trial. We don’t want the word “democracy” to be filtered out of Chinese chat rooms. We don’t want China to continue executing more people than the rest of the world using corrupt courts and faulty evidence as justification. </p>

<p>Jimmy, I was laughing at the one part in your post (“occasionally”? come on.), but I agreed with what you said about Chinese progress. I think you’re overestimating how far China has come, though, and your refusal to admit that your country has some very real, and very substantial, problems, is telling evidence of how pervasive China’s pseudo-utopian nationalist rhetoric remains today. It’s not the media. It’s not American bias (mostly). It’s your messed-up country. </p>

<p>And I’m not defending the protesters, anyway. I don’t give a crap about Tibet. Sorry.</p>

60

<p>^^^ I was born in the US and lived my entire life here, so I’ve not had the gracious opportunity to be subject to Chinese pseudo-utopian nationalism (though I’ve visited). But even I can see through the blatant bias of Western media and society. There is an overbearing “Its China. It’s bad” mentality here. If you don’t believe me, look no further than your responses:</p>

<p>

</p>

<p>and</p>

<p>

</p>

<p>And, pray tell, how much do you know about China? And how? Oh, yes, through the media.</p>

<p>While I can’t say much about the circumstances in China, I would take more seriously the word of a former Chinese citizen more seriously than observers like us.</p>