Thanks so much for the insurance info. Fingers crossed NY state health options stay good until 2019. I worry as our Federal government seems determined to whittle away at the ACA and insurance companies continue to make health care unaffordable.
As for kids and relationships and marriage and babies. Just be warned it can all happen really quickly. When my two oldest were in their early 20s I could not possibly imagine either one of them getting married. Now my eldest is married and expecting (her first) and my middle son is in a committed relationship (I am not sure if they want or are talking kids or not, but I expect they might once my son is done with being a post-doc fellow). Also these days on the east coast (in Boston/NY/DC) 29 is considered young to have kids. A huge part of that is that most people in their 20s simply can not afford to have kids.
I’ve thought for a while that a thread like this - what does life look like for aspiring musicians at the other end of the school experience - would be helpful for those embarking on the journey. So I’ll jump into the fray. My son graduated from college in 2016. He had taken a gap year between high school and college and was anxious to get out on “the scene” full time, so decided not to go to grad school (at least for now). He’s NYC based and has found that making a living as a musician is very much an entrepreneurial endeavor. His primary income streams are from performing (private and public gigs), teaching (about a dozen private students and could have more but he wanted to make sure he had time for everything else), and accompanying classes (musical theater, vocal ensembles and even dance classes). He’s been doing a lot of touring with his trio lately - midwest and Canada in March, Japan in May, currently on the west coast. He acts as his own booking agent, so putting together every tour is a major undertaking. And he makes less money when he’s on tour than he does gigging in and around New York - primarily because he has to sub out the lessons for his students and loses that income stream when he’s out of town - but he thinks the tours are important to try to develop more of a name and, hopefully, get even better gigs in the future. Most of his touring has been with his own trio, but when he’s in New York he also performs with a wide variety of groups led by others - including some older, more well known, jazz musicians. And he’s doing a tour in Europe in July with a singer who is the lead for the group and who is doing the bookings - actually something of a relief to have someone else responsible for the business side on that tour.
All of it is tremendously uncertain, but he loves doing what he’s doing and is making enough to support himself reasonably well as a single, unattached young adult. It’s an open question whether this kind of life is conducive to a serious relationship, family, etc., but he’s young enough that he’s not yet felt the need to face that question. And he’s still on our insurance - won’t roll off for another year - but the insurance info in this thread is definitely helpful and comforting on that score.
I’m curious what others are doing as far as “closing the bank of mom and dad”. Once they started working on their own, did you basically switch all of their related expenses to them, i.e. car, car insurance, cell phone etc? I am guessing that those in NYC don’t have/need cars so maybe there is not that expense for them. I feel like we will always help if needed, but I also feel like if we always backstop, then my daughter will never HAVE to make it work. What are thoughts on this? experiences?
The program my daughter will be a part of helped her secure donor/patron housing, so she will have the advantage of not having rent. She asked about it at the beginning of getting everything all setup once accepted. Definitely a great example of “you have to ask”. This will allow her to build a cushion for those other major surprise expenses that inevitably happen like car stuff, plane tickets etc. Different programs do this, so be sure they are looking at this if associated with a program.
My adult kids (and my mom) are on our family cell phone plan–the kids have been on it since they were young teens. It is cheaper for them to stay on this group plan than to buy individual plans, so what I do is Venmo-request their share of the bill every month, and they pay me. I keep the NYC kids on our car insurance plan so they can drive when they’re visiting at home. I suppose they could be considered just “occasional drivers” at this point, so I might revisit that with an insurance agent. It’s trickier for one of my daughters who lives in our city and has been using one of our cars regularly. She pays for repairs and gas, but I’m still footing her insurance bill and also the EZ pass transponder. I was about to cut her loose but now she’s starting grad school in the fall, so I’ll probably just let that slide a little longer. My parents had nothing to do with my finances after I was out of college, but I it’s a different world these days.
Yes, the phone plan is a no-brainer. She’s on my health insurance plan until November and will be able to afford a new plan. I also pay her car insurance. That was going to be transferred to her but she began paying for her voice lessons out of her own pocket. I was going to pay that “educational” cost. So instead I just pay the insurance bill and she pays for her voice lessons. For travel to auditions, she has used money from placing in competitions. If it runs short for the year (which it will this year), I have told her I will pay. My husband and I have decided to fund voice lessons and auditions for a number of years as long as she can pay her living expenses. My biggest concern is the car. If that dies, I suspect the bank of dad and mom will have to step in (not an easy thought). We did pay for a new battery this year as we knew it would be a big expense for her but a small expense for us. I have faith that we will figure out when and how to decrease support year by year. My D wants to be self-sufficient and is practical. So we will just go year to year but by age 30…I’m quite sure we will ALL have a different opinion about support.
I will also add here after reading over my comments…and wanting to be totally honest…I think my D is doing well as I had fairly low expectations (lol) on how this would all work. I’m just glad she can “basically” support herself (I had wondered). But I do know she worries A LOT! She knew it would be hard…and it is! BUT I don’t know if she cannot be involved in the arts…bc even when bummed out (rejected again) she just keeps at it…fiercely…and she does have other safer outlets that just don’t seem to have the draw (at least not yet).
So it goes back to the old saying: If you can imagine doing something else, you should do it…bc being in the arts is for those who CAN’T stop themselves…no matter the obstacles. That old saying is playing out before my eyes…and I totally understand it now (while secretly wishing it weren’t so).
@CurlyMom my D’s YAP paid all housing/utilities and had a fairly generous travel stipend (outside of the pay) allowing 2 trips in 4 months. However since it was only 4 months, she had her old apartment’s rent to pay…as did the other young artists. My D has had the same experience for summer programs…paid housing and okay stipend (bc they are paying the housing!) but you still have your rent at home. But they are young and I have found the programs (even the short one) exceptional so…what ya do? It’s good she won’t have rent and will be an excellent opportunity!
The financial end of continuing education and career development is tough. In my case it is the “bank of Mom” and the balance is sinking! But just had a phone conversation hearing about all the exciting music and academic things coming up and it is worth it. My kids resist help but they need it and eventually I prevail, but try to balance that with respect for whatever sense of autonomy they can have so we compartmentalize certain expenses as off limits for my help. Anything educational or medical, I pay. And I sneak in clothes, food, Uber when needed etc. Subletting their apartments during programs in the summer helps…
Although,in past years she’s also noticed that summer educational programs, even though they are fully funded and also often include transport costs, create a cash-flow issue in that she does not earn income during those week. This year for the first time her summer program balance is tipped towards teaching gigs and away from YA fellowships: 2 3-week teaching gigs and one 3-week fellowship.
Looking back now, what did everyone do to finance the educations? Loans, competitions, scholarships? Anything you would share with those coming after us that would be helpful for them to know?
My son specifically attended Berklee Global for his Master’s because it was 100% tuition free. He knew given that he did his undergrad in the Boston area that he could earn enough to cover his rent and living expenses gigging and he basically did. I do think we helped with little things …I know I got the occasional call asking if he could buy a coat or shoes using our credit card. But mostly he did pay for himself.
For undergrad we avoided debt. That meant not going to some great schools despite acceptance, even with merit. Financial aid was key for our family in the end, which meant a university with an endowment. For grad school search was limited to programs with full funding and stipend (with teaching duties). I wish we had had the resources for limitless choices, but the end result has been wonderful anyway. Summer programs have been funded entirely or partially by the schools, which helps a lot.
My daughter took on some debt for undergrad tuition but did not have to pay tuition for grad school. She had a number of teaching fellowships and enough gigs to cover living expenses for undergrad and grad school.
Like the others chiming in, we chose not to take on any debt for undergrad, but she attended a state school with a conservator, so tuition was much more affordable than some of the other schools she was accepted to, we were lucky that her top choice was the public university. Daughter did have a church job that helped pay for expenses, and then she won some local competitions that really helped out as well. Grad school was paid for as far as tuition, but no stipend so we footed expenses, and she also had a church job that paid pretty well and for the most part covered food and gas and other expenses. We did cover things like shoes, clothes etc as well. Our goal was to get her through with no debt so she would have a fighting chance to make expenses on her own.
We only paid for a few summer programs, mostly the ones she attended during high school, and a couple during her first two summers as a college student. From that point on, the programs either have been covered or have even paid her, which is a nice change. The summer programs, though, were worth every cent as they truly helped build her network which has been invaluable.
I’m really enjoying this thread and seeing lots of things that correspond to what we have found/learned along the way.
S graduated from his MM program in May, studied cello performance.
Has 2 jobs lined up, landed a very part time job as an adjunct professor at a small college where he will teach the few college students they have that want to take lessons. They have a small music school with majors and non majors.
There is a fairly new suzuki strings program based at the college and he will teach there. They are actively looking to build the program so there is room for growth with this job. He just won a spot in a regional orchestra that is a step up from the orchestras he has been playing in through grad school. Not quite full time and still per service but 30- 40 weeks per year and the potential for benefits if he stays 3 years. Lots of driving involved as the college job is a 1 1/2 hour drive from where he’s living and the orchestra job is almost 2 hours in the other direction. He’ll supplement with other regional orchestra jobs when they fit into his schedule, played with several during undergrad and has a spot in one and subs for several others.
He’s just starting out so for right now I think he can make this work and keep building. If the college job grows a lot he may have to pick between one or the other because they might start to conflict. For now I’m really happy that he should be able to cover his basic living expenses for now. During undergrad he had fallen in love with chamber music and wanted to pursue that professionally, however during grad school things really shifted for him and he really fell back in love with orchestral playing so that is his focus for now. From my perspective I can see him happy pursuing lots of different paths, he is pretty much just happy as long as he can play- chamber, orchestral, recitals, he loves it all.
Good news- he has a newish used car that we bought this winter after his car died ( one of our old cars), should last him 10 years or more if he takes good care of it. Very validating to have won this audition, not the be all end all but a good start.
New music- absolutely! He has made a real commitment to performing new music starting in undergrad. He regularly asked student composer friends to write music for his recitals and has continued that through grad school. I think his last recital was all music composed by currently living composers with one new piece written for him. He is collaborating with this same composer friend on a festival this fall where they are commissioning 4 new works to be written for any combination of a select group of musicians and will be performed in September.
Ditto. Scholarship at a public university for UG so we could cover the cost with no debt. Fellowship in grad school covering most of tuition but no stipend. We covered rent and gave a small chunk each semester to help with some expenses. She worked to cover most expenses. In grad school she only accepted summer programs that paid.
^ That was getting long so I have some thoughts on things from previous posts.
I noticed while S was in undergrad that he possessed many of the traits that glassharmonica mentions in her earlier posts. He always arrives at gigs on time (early), well prepared and he is engaged and invested in the music. Fellow players seem to love to play with him and he gets a lot of repeat and new opportunities because of it. I see him actively looking for opportunities to collaborate with musicians in smaller groups outside of orchestral playing.
Hustling- omg yes! He is starting to develop the ability to say no which I think he will need to do just to maintain his sanity, also wonder about the long term viability but we’ll just have to see where things lead.
Practicing- he understands the importance of this but I worry that it may get pushed to the side when he is running around so much just trying to make ends meet. Will take a lot of discipline to put this regularly into the schedule and stick to a practice routine.
Bank of Mom and Dad- starting to turn off the tap. He will take over rent and car insurance by this fall. Not sure about cell phone yet. Already covers food, gas, car maintenance and repair and extras. We have said we will help with travel expenses for auditions as I don’t want him to miss career opportunities for lack of funds. He’s on our health insurance for another year and then needs to find his own. We’re willing to help if needed as I don’t want him to go without.
He has a strong drive to be completely independent so I’m not worried about him taking advantage unnecessarily.
More good news- staying in the city where he did his grad school. Has a good living arrangement that is really inexpensive. Developed lots of contacts while he was there that he can continue to cultivate. I’m also really happy that it looks like he can earn enough to meet his basic expenses for now that any extra jobs he does can all be music related.
Family- so far has voiced that he thinks it may be incompatible with his career. We’ll see if that changes, I expect it might.
Thanks for starting this thread, it’s nice to see how these young musicians are making things work and following their passions and using their talents!
We are in the same situation. My daughter will be applying to grad schools this fall. I was wondering if you had a
list of schools she applied to that were good with funding for masters
@Smeaper I was hoping someone else would respond as my D went through auditions for an MM a few years ago. I will say that for grad school I don’t know of any list or school recommendations that could be counted on for funding. Others may have suggestions however.
From my experience, getting funding may have a lot to do with connections (from summer programs etc) and/or the needs of the school. Where there is a need, there is money. And that can change from year to year. So for grad school, it may be best to work with the UG teacher, any connections from summer programs and PEERS! My D watched carefully as older kids went through the process (when she was a jr) and their results.