<p>I recently found out that private voice lessons at a certain school don't include belt. During junior year, the students take a contemporary styles class which includes belt. My concern is that students are going to belt anyway, and if they come to the school having years of good foundational classical technique and no vocal issues (bad habits, injuries, etc) they should be able to study both classical and contemporary singing with their voice teacher from day one. It never occurred to me that the voice teachers wouldn't be proficient on both sides of the coin. I figure if I can find such teachers in my city I should expect them at my D's college. Or am I unrealistic to think so? </p>
<p>Many of you here are vocal experts - I'd like to know your thoughts on this. My D has a role this summer where she is belting and I expect she will audition for roles in upcoming summers and also at college where she may belt. I'd feel better if she was getting expert belt training as soon as possible and I'd rather she not wait for years for this training in order to keep her voice "issue free."</p>
<p>Hi - I cannot speak to your specific circumstance, but I will offer this. It is not unusual in college programs that they want their students to undergo a course of study that is of the college’s design. This is, generally, to assure that they would know that the student’s study is thorough, without gaps, and represents the final product that the school represents. It is not only voice, in dance some schools make what would seem to be very advanced dancers begin at their “beginning” level, similarly, acting studies often go the same route. Regarding your daughter’s ability to audition for shows requiring belting during the process - she will still be able to do that - classical training will not “erase” how she can sing now - it might improve it or maybe teach a healthier way to approach what she does (or maybe her belt is just fine the way it is). If she needs to belt out "Worst Things I Can Do’ at a Grease audition - she will still be able to do it at least as well as she does it now.
I wonder, you never posted on the “final decision list” - what school did your D opt for?</p>
<p>mtdog, not to hijack this thread (well…) I wonder about taking an advanced dancer back to a Level 1 class – in my daughter’s research process, if a school had that policy in dance (and we understand some do put all MT’s together in the same dance level), that school got crossed off her list. She will sometimes choose to take a lower level ballet class if it fits her schedule to really be able to concentrate on a particular part of technique, but with years and years of classical training behind her, it is important to her not to lose any of her strength and technique. (In fact, she just put her fall schedule together, and is considering contacting the dance department to see about the possibility of auditing some additional dance classes, to get the number of hours in a studio that makes her feel that she’s keeping her technique strong and clean.)</p>
<p>I guess I’m not as concerned about starting where the school wants all students in acting (figure there’s always something new to learn to improve one’s craft) and in voice, I’d imagine that the student and private teacher will work together to improve the voice, whether it’s a few years of revisiting those arias, (because young adult voices are still forming), but I’d worry about a dancer losing strength and endurance if not placed in an individually correct level. Thoughts?</p>
<p>Mommafrog, you present an interesting subject that requires great tact in order to respond without offending. In forums such as this - what might be well understood in a lengthy face-to-face conversation can easily become misconstrued in an effort to achieve a reasonable brevity. So, I have to ask you, in advance, to only assume my very best intentions.
First, you should find out about dance classes (actually, all classes) – what parameters are there, who can take what courses, what are the dance options for MT majors, is there a philosophical context in which course development is set.
To the meat of the question. Why would a school want a dancer who, perhaps, has danced in Nutcracker, won state or national championship competitions, and stood out in even the highest level classes their studio had to offer be placed at the beginning level in a particular school’s dance tract? This is the touchy part – not all dance training is created equal. There are no legally binding requirements to open a dance studio in most states. Standards are lacking. Dance Masters of America is one group that is attempting to correct this situation – they have developed standard curricula, they have a program of Teachers’ Training School where studio instructors can be certified in various dance styles. There are, of course, some very good studios out there. However, even a good studio may win competitions but lack basic technique, might have students doing great tricks – but might not be aware of anatomical damage that might be a long-term consequence of doing this, that, or the other thing. I am aware of a champion level 13-year-old who visibly ripped her hip right of its socket doing a series of “tricks” on the stage at a regional competition. Okay, so even if you have had the very best training up until college there are still concerns. The three or four programs I am aware of that make virtually all their dancers start a dance sequence at the beginning have an amazingly high level of dancer in there program – their “beginning levels” are like well advanced dancers at other colleges – so, in that case, one need not worry about losing one’s edge. While many studios do adopt a ballet technique, most do not teach technique in jazz. Jazz has technique, history, and style that forms an important core on which great dancers can build. Maddox, Luigi, Fosse, etc are styles that take a great deal of specific study to actually master. The great thing about having solid technique (be it dance, vocals, or acting) is that it then makes everything else so much easier. You can, for example, be very fluid and adaptive, learn combinations far easier – this is great at auditions – helps nail the J-O-B. So, as I stated in my earlier post, some schools have a specific course they want all their students to experience – so they are the performers they want them to be when they graduate.
I am not saying that every school that does this is automatically great – I am just explaining why a school would have such a requirement.</p>
<p>Thanks, mtdog. That does definitely make sense across the disciplines. (Voice, acting, dance) And definitely have seen examples that time spent in the studio does NOT equal quality of training for a dancer. We plan to put our trust in kiddo’s teachers to make sure she’s getting what she needs…and knowing she can advocate for herself along the way to make sure she’s getting the best experience and safe training. (And don’t worry – I am not offended…just on a learning curve! :-)</p>
<p>This isn’t directly related to this discussion but classicalbk’s question made me think of not only the different areas of vocal training but also about the different types of music that students will be performing in their careers, and for most, this will be varied. A longtime actor friend of ours who is a very successful Broadway actor joined Tisch this year as their head of vocal performance in the New Studio on Broadway. Many years ago he founded the Broadway Inspirational Voices, a gospel choir that is made up of his actor friends. They are a joy to see perform, and to see these actors who are better known for their MT skills is a lot of fun. Although many of them, including Michael, were raised on this type of music, I know that not all of them were and yet, they are making this beautiful music together. Maybe some of the kids here will one day be joining this beautiful choir. If you have a minute, do a google search and have a look at their website, or search them on Facebook. You can listen to some of their music. I was actually supposed to be in the city at one of their concerts last night but, unfortunately, had to cancel at the last minute. Anyway, sorry to digress but I do admit to loving it when kids who primarily do MT, are also able to show the other talents they have up their collective sleeves. :)</p>
<p>I haven’t been able to see Broadway Inspirational Voices. My daughter had the good fortune of having some jobs with Michael this past spring and he has an amazing voice! </p>
<p>I agree that many MT performers will end up singing many styles and genres of music. While my own daughter loves MT and performs that genre, she is simultaneously pursuing singing more contemporary music (rock, pop, folk, etc.) as a singer/songwriter. I think versatility as a performer is a good thing in the current industry. </p>
<p>Back to the OP…every school’s curriculum is a little different. They tend to have a sequential aspect to the coursework and emphasis. It can feel weird when one enters college with all this training and then the BFA program has this sequence they want their students to go through, but you have to just trust that they know what they are doing. For example, in my daughter’s BFA in MT program, the first year of singing was all about legit and no belting or pop/rock, etc. In my D’s case, belting was (still is) her forte. But it is not like she forgot how to belt during that year. She could still belt at auditions. She sang with a belt in her a capella group and so on. She thought it was a good thing to focus solely on legit that year and her range and skills really improved. For other kids, legit was their strength and belting is not. In vocal classes, the curriculum eventually moved onto pop/rock and for some kids, this was their challenge and not so much for my D. I’m mostly talking of the classes, not private lessons. I don’t recall what D worked on in private lessons as much but maybe it started out focusing on legit, but she was also able to bring songs she wanted to work on too. I just know that she worked on both belt and legit while in college. Whether it was all at one time or more sequential, not sure. I think the main thing you want to look for is that your D’s program works on both (over the course of the four years) as both are surely needed in the MT field today. But some programs may start out heavily focused on technique and then branch out. It may feel odd when the kids have already “branched out” prior to college, but colleges have a “beginning” of their curriculum sequence even so. In terms of dance, I am a proponent of dance placement by levels since kids enter college with a wide range of previous dance training.</p>
<p>It’s absolutely true that all dance studios are not alike. So one simply gives a placement class, and then parcels the students out accordingly. Bravo to OCU that has something like a 2-3 hour placement class covering ballet, etc.</p>
<p>And most likely, most students coming into MT are belters, from what I heard at auditions. They may not have concentrated as much as mine has in previous years on classical. She’s a beginner belter, so I don’t feel comfortable at all about her not getting assistance soon in that area, since it is so easy to screw up and hurt yourself. Her classical I’m not worried about, although I’m very happy to see that progress as well. If her voice teacher at this school won’t listen to her belt and can’t advise her in this style, she’ll have to find someone on the side that will do so. Some locations are easier than others to find help on the side. Maybe some training in the summer will do…</p>
<p>Yes, some schools give placement classes, other schools put all the MT kids together, others have all kids go theough a specifically designed course of study. All good policies to be aware of when choosing what program to attend and/or to remain. Many permutations across the various discplines. Caveat emptor.</p>
<p>Yes…you do need to do the research, to beware (as a buyer) and be AWARE of the course of study that resonates with your kid…but in the end, after you’ve done your research, talked to the program and discovered their policies/plans/syllabi…then it’s time to step back and let the teaching begin! It’s been quite a year of evaluating fit, weighing acceptances/program philosophies, emails and phone calls and meetings with the “finalist” schools…but now kiddo and I have to trust that these folks know what they’re doing and she, as a young adult, has the preparation that got her there, and the ability to learn and evaluate and grow. No school will guarantee that my kid will EVER work in this field…various paths (educational philosophies, etc) can be valid. If she’s challenged and learning from her peers, her profs, is able to continue to advocate for herself and discuss with her mentors there the best course of action…then go forth, kid – learn lots in the program! If, after all that, some re-evaluation is necessary, that’s one of those bridges for later…</p>
<p>classicalbk, this is something that can often be discussed with the professor in the voice lessons as auditions approach. DD was in a completely classical program, but the studio professor knew she also had some students preparing for MT. While belting was not part of their regular instruction, when getting ready for auditions she made sure they had the right material and proper technique. It is not that foreign for good teachers and just because it is not part of the regular voice lessons does not mean they can’t do it. They most likely want everyone in classical to ensure good foundations.</p>
<p>At Boco, belting is not encouraged for first year students during voice lessons. In addition, we were not aware of additional costs incurred if you prefer one hour lessons (as opposed to 1/2 hr.)</p>
<p>If everyone is giving their two-cents, I may as well chime in about CCU!</p>
<p>As far as I know, there is no policy on belting at Coastal Carolina. We currently have 5 voice instructors who each have their own studio and their own way of teaching students. I have only heard of girls who are not “belting” because they have unhealthy habits that the teachers are trying to get them to stay away from that they developed before attending CCU. Healthy belting as well as classical singing (all MT Majors are required at least one aria be learned for their juries), and the relatively new concept of mixing are all taught freshman year and up. </p>
<p>Honestly, the vocal training here varies from studio to studio and from student to student. I did not focused as much on my belt freshman year because I had a healthy, fairly standard belt (up to a D) when I came in and less of a head voice, so that’s what we concentrated on in my voice lessons. I have a much stronger legit/soprano voice than I did when I came in, and it has only helped my belt. My particular voice teacher subscribes to the theory that the voice is all one instrument (which most teachers do), and strengthening one part of the voice will only help all of the other areas. On the other hand, I know of girls who were “only” legit sopranos when they came in, who are diving into the world of belting slowly but surely- doing low, brassy Cole Porter standards for their recital classes. Individual attention is key, as well as making sure HEALTHY belting is taught, as well as healthy mixing and not pushing when singing legit. It all comes from the same place. That is number one.</p>
<p>In addition, voice lessons are all one hour a week. Freshman year first semester we have a “bootcamp” style where students are split up into small groups and trained before being assigned private voice teachers. In December, you have a vocal “jury” and then are assigned to a studio from there where your hour a week lessons begin.</p>
<p>This is a fascinating conversation! I don’t know how I feel about the belt/no belt controversy, but it’s at least great to see all of these post about the voice programs at MT schools. Very interesting for students who are considering where to apply.</p>
<p>Thank you! I’m not intentionally trying to promote CCU, just putting our policies out there in case it helps someone make a decision one day. :)</p>
<p>When it comes to dance (which I saw posted on the previous page), we do not have a placement class. The majority of MT majors begin in “Ballet 1” together, but I believe we would fall under the “individualized” method, because people who have had the basics and TRULY do not need the technique work will be allowed to pass out of the level 1 classes and move up. But most people start in the lower level 1 classes to guarantee a foundation with true technique (a lot of people come in from studios that only taught tricks and not healthy dancing) so they can grow from a strong base. This all determined by our department chair and dance faculty and varies from student to student.</p>
<p>Just throwing in my two cents on CCPA/Roosevelt. :-)</p>
<p>Here, Private lessons don’t start until second semester freshman year. However, there is reasoning behind it. First semester, all Freshman MTs take a group voice class. The woman who teaches this class is also one of the full time voice faculty. Through this class, she gets to know our voices (strengths, weaknesses, range, etc) as well as our personalities. Then she, along with the head of our program, assigns us each to a voice teacher who will help us with our specific needs. Starting second semester, we have one hour lessons once a week. We have 7 voice teachers who are all very different, which is good because there is always a teacher that works for someone. I am glad they took the time to really get to know us before placing us with a teacher. I could not be happier with my voice teacher and the quality of vocal instruction I am receiving.</p>
<p>And regarding the belt/no belt conversation, it is definitely handled on a case by case basis depending on a persons voice and the level of training they came in with. I did both legit and belt styles my first year, but I know some that focused on more legit singing. I think it really depends on the teacher and the student!</p>
<p>As many Seniors are refining their lists, I thought it would be helpful to get input regarding more schools! Anyone want to weigh in about their school’s private voice policies?
When lessons start?
Length of lessons?
Extra costs involved?
Belt/no belt policy?
Anything else?</p>