<p>We’ve had a good experience with our charter school. It does have its issues, for sure, but nothing like Exie described, thank God. It was formed by teachers and was the first in our county, so yes it was definitely self-selecting. My biggest gripe with it is they set up to the school to use GA’s standards for accountability. Why not pick a more successful state’s standards. It boiled down to receiving state money. All in all, after hearing Exie’s experience, I am very grateful for what we have!</p>
<p>Yeah neato, they do. I had very little opportunity myself, went to a regular middle of the road public school, but was motivated and bright enough to study my father’s college physics and math books and teach myself on my own time.</p>
<p>You don’t need fancy-shmansy anything.</p>
<p>It hit home when our son’s headmaster said at a recent gathering for parents, if your child only does the work asked of him or her and nothing else, nothing on their own…they will have missed a tremendous opportunity. Growth comes when you learn to take responsibility for your own education, and you’re in it to learn.</p>
<p>It really resonated. You don’t need BS, elite day schools, magnet/charter. Good or bad anything, gifted and talented people find their way in life and find a way to enjoy their talents and to contribute. Look at Bill Gates, he didn’t need any schooling, let alone Harvard to make his contribution to the world.</p>
<p>redbluegoldgreen, You couldn’t have said it better. Right on the money. There are numerous examples of hard working, motivated, successful people that didn’t go to top schools, public or private. 
That’s why I am saying BS people are in a bubble. They have this urge that BS is the only ticket to success. Facts show that reality is far from it.</p>
<p>Your father HAD college physics and math books! That is itself an advantage.</p>
<p>But I think you misunderstand. I am not saying that a child needs fancy anything even remotely like that. You’re talking to a mother who taught her children at home for goodness sakes! Nobody knows more than I do that opportunities can be found everywhere! I have told my own children and many other children that if they wait around for someone to teach them, they’ll be stupid forever. So, you and I are in accord on that aspect.</p>
<p>My point is not that one needs the RIGHT school to do well, but that the WRONG school can DAMAGE a child: STIFLE that desire to know, PUNISH divergent thinkers and those who DO as your son’s headmaster suggested, and in general, DEMORALIZE kids to the point of dropping out.</p>
<p>That kid will NOT “do well” no matter how many physics books he reads in the closet. There is a human soul involved, after all. That is what I am referring to.</p>
<p>Just take a look at the number of gifted adults who go through life thinking they’re stupid because they could never manage to fill out a worksheet the way their teachers wanted them to or “show their work” using the “proper” math procedure.</p>
<p>The learning environment makes a difference. If the home environment is nurturing enough, these kids in horrid schools WILL do well. It’s the incredibly bright kids who are in schools that ignore them because they can (and do) actually read, and are in families that ridicule them for “acting all smart” that don’t “do well.”</p>
<p>I’ve seen it so many times. I have assured many of them that there was nothing wrong with them, that their gifts did not make them freaks, and that all those ideas that were not welcomed in school or at home were worth writing down because they were GOOD and they needn’t be afraid of them.</p>
<p>Bad schools can (and DO) damage children.</p>
<p>redbluegoldgreen, you don’t seem to value the BS experience (e.g. “You don’t need fancy-shmansy anything”). Can I ask why you bother to send your child to BS? I’m sure they could just study your college books. Perhaps I’ve misunderstood your views on the value of BS.</p>
<p>Have you all ever noticed how pulsar and redbluegoldgreen always seem to be on the same page, supporting each others arguments (Right on the money). Its almost as though they are the same person…</p>
<p>Just like Exeter123 and Exeter321 are the same people inverted.</p>
<p>If you use C’Sense, it may not have to be JUST RBGG’s decision to send kids to BS or whatever. It could be a family decision and others are involved in it.</p>
<p>pulsar, I’m having difficulty understanding what you mean. Are you saying you and RBGG are related (It’s a family decision and others are involved in it) ??</p>
<p>Pay attention to the words like “may” and you’ll all be set.</p>
<p>Doesn’t make any sense. So are you related to RBGG or one and the same??</p>
<p>Exeter123, Your posts are turning sort of delusional. We are all one CC family. That’s the only relation I can think of.</p>
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<p>Exeter, I was wondering the same thing myself. I’ve been reading RGB2’s posts for months and there does seem an obvious ambivalance over spending $50K a year for something he/she doesn’t seem to think will make a difference.</p>
<p>Neato said:
</p>
<p>Yes - the state set up the charter laws in a thinly veiled attempt to let well-heeled parents who lacked funds for private school to flee the district. But by allowing schools to operate with little oversight, and giving sponsors no funding to supervise, then requiring an assessment every 5 years (with no safety net for children during that time) we had a proliferation of for-profit and non-profit schools that saw it as a cash cow. The district has committees of people from both sides now arguing about shutting many of the schools down because it’s draining resources and producing worse results.</p>
<p>Worse - charter schools don’t operate with the same requirements for having certified teachers. Nor is there a requirement that the school produce a curriculum. So in my case, we discovered that the school was only teaching whatever content was required for the state exam. Hence, the third grade class got no math instruction because the state didn’t test for math that year, then went on to fourth grade where the state does test unprepared. The teacher was tearing her hair out and the proficiency rate on the state exam that year dropped 60 points. But because the state only required 10% of the students to pass the test in order to make AYP, and 16% passed the test (compared to 76% the year the school converted) the school bragged that it exceeded state standards and parents flocked to the school believing they were going to get a great education. Both the school and the local paper neglected to include the relevant data - easily available on the state website if you know where to look. But most parents don’t or won’t.</p>
<p>Hence, our district continues to pump out legions of students destined to work minimum wage jobs because they graduate reading at the third grade level and can’t do basic math.</p>
<p>A lot of public and charter school officials are driving in a luxury vehicles including the principal of the aforementioned charter school. Her board gave her a raise for her wonderful contributions one year before a state court found her (and her Board) guilty of human rights violations and called the school despicable. Other charter schools locally have rates are so close to zero they’re almost a negative number.</p>
<p>There are two that do not - one has an average ACT of 19 and was built with major “old” money. We all know 19 is a joke - it’s only 3 points better than the district average. The other takes at risk kids and has a 100% college matriculation rate (mostly to small regional schools).</p>
<p>The producer of WAITING FOR SUPERMAN said on his interview today that an earlier study attacked charters as well. Only 1 in five is operating well. Here in my city it’s more like 1 in 15-20.</p>
<p>and Exie is steering us back to the original topic in the first post … Waiting for Superman… I heard an interview yesterday on NPR with the fellow that made the movie… He said that charter schools are not really the ultimate solution… the solution is for parents and community members to get involved in the local public school and make it better, rather than run away to the charter school. </p>
<p>Is it possible though for parents to fix a crummy school? I think the ultimate way is for parents to get elected to the school board and steer the policies and the budgets of the school(s) in the direction they desire. But volunteering, joining PTO and being the squeaky wheel in the principal’s office can go far when enough parents are doing it. It’s the better long term solution. But when it comes time to walk the talk, I can understand perfectly that noble intentions get tossed aside and parents will do whatever they can to ensure that their own kids get the best they can find for them.</p>
<p>Which is why a lot of us parents are here on CC. Fixing the public schools sounds great, but what an undertaking.</p>
<p>You’ll have to work on your rhetoric pulsar. A simple denial would have been enough. Places your past and future comments along with RBGG in a particular context.</p>
<p>My sympathies go out to you and RBGG – the prep school experience doesn’t seem to be all you expected based on RBGG’s earlier postings.</p>
<p>Glad to see this movie being discussed. I saw the director, Guggenheim (An Inconvenient Truth) interviewed on GMA this morning & I’m really looking forward to seeing the movie. I hope it generates a lot more discussion.</p>
<p>Guggenheim said when this topic was first suggested to him he wasn’t enthusiastic, but one day as he was driving his children to their private school he passed several public schools and the inequity of the situation hit him. He decided to approach the documentary by asking himself how he could get people interested in the plights of children who were not their own.</p>
<p>From an interview: "Guggenheim argues that his films do have impact, even if it’s not measurable in, say, a reduction in global warming. “There is this immeasurable thing, which is that people’s behavior changed,” he says. “Movies do not write policy, but they have a very potent ability to inspire and inform, and I know Inconvenient Truth inspired and informed millions.”</p>
<p>Exeter123, Many people here agree with other posters, but they are not the same people with different ids. What makes you think that? Do you want us to think that you and ExieMITAlum are one and the same just because you both agree with each other on a certain post?</p>
<p>If I understand RBGGs posts correctly, you don’t need a BS to get good education which is true. RBGG didn’t say BS is a bad thing. So what’s your point?</p>
<p>You still haven’t denied that you are related to RBGG.</p>
<p>Looks like you are not getting many of these messages!</p>
<p>I’m sorry, what post # was it were you denied your relation to RBGG?</p>
<p>okay, now the two “Ex…'s” are getting paranoid.</p>
<p>No, not related to anyone on this board.</p>
<p>@neato: Let’s not villainize public schools. They’re filled with very good people who go into teaching to make a difference in a young person’s life. They don’t “do damage.”</p>
<p>@the 2 “Ex’s”: of course I will remain a critical thinker when it comes to BS. I’ve dished out $50,000 in cash. Just like any investment, I want to see dividends on my returns, but I don’t think I won a lottery just because my kid got into one of the most elite schools.
I haven’t drunk that kool-aid yet. </p>
<p>And I do take exception with the idea that just because my father HAD Physics and Math books, that I was privileged. He put himself thru a state college and yes, ended up happy and fulfilled and very successful in life by anyone’s measure. And no, I didn’t read them in a closet. My point was I didn’t get frills, I used dusty and very old, moldy texts, but I was a self-starter and whether kids are in BS or public school they will need to be self-starters and take responsibility for their education in order to reach their potential. And you can without a BS education.</p>
<p>Smart people use the opportunities they are given to excel. That’s what I am trying to do with BS, give my kid more opportunities to excel then what I had, but even if I didn’t I know he will do fine.</p>
<p>BTW, Ex’s you can’t have it both ways. You cite that I “don’t seem to value the BS experience, it’s not everything you expected.” At least one of you is always tauting it’s not the school that makes the kid, it’s the kid that gives the school such great matriculation stats. I am stating the same thing. Smart kids do well. And BTW, don’t try to project anything on to me. I am actually very happy with how the BS experience is turning out…so far. My son loves classes and his teacher, has already become more independent…is playing his sport and has made lots of friends. I am just saying he likely didn’t need BS to do just as well.</p>
<p>BTW, it’s a compliment to me pulsar that they think you and me are one and the same. A little paranoid, but a compliment just the same.</p>