<p>what do you guys think wake forest's future usnews ranking will be? up or down? what have they historically been ranked in the past? are they making an upward or downward trend? with the new act/sat decision how serious will this affect their ranking?</p>
<p>It will go up surely. Acceptance rate will go down, SAT's will go up. Hatch knows what he is doing. I'm excited because although it doesn't mean anything for me directly, all of this will make Wake a more prestigious institution and also make my degree more valuable.</p>
<p>that's what i was thinking, especially if he used to be the president of notre dame.</p>
<p>Now that Wake is essentially an open-enrollment school, its reputation is in the tank even though its rankings will likely go up because of the fudged numbers.</p>
<p>how is it an open enrollment school? it isn't even close to that...</p>
<p>Because of O'Hatch the senseless sympathizer, Wake has pursued an open enrollment policy to let anyone and everyone in based on diversity. It is never a good decision to become a school that lets less qualified kids in based on skin color. Who else in the top 30 sphere does this, its looking like a bottom 100 school right now.</p>
<p>Here are some articles that were posted today about Wake Forest, in case anyone wants to read:</p>
<p>Wake</a> Forest runs risk with no-SAT option | ajc.com</p>
<p>I don't think the SAT scores will necessarily go up. Look at the post about if my friend had a chance. If they get accepted, based on the rest of their record, after they decide to matriculate they'll have to submit their SATs for statistical purposes...which aren't even 50th percentile. I'm not saying my friend is going to get in, I'm just saying there might be numerous cases where Wake accepts students with good or better profiles (sans SAT) and when those students matriculate there, and have to submit their SAT scores, they might be much lower than the usual percentile of an admitted Wake student.</p>
<p>OK . . . UNC fan - here are the other schools in the Top 30 that do that:</p>
<p>Princeton
Harvard
Yale
Stanford
Penn
Cal Tech
MIT
Duke
Columbia
U. of Chicago
Dartmouth
Wash U. in St. Louis
Cornell
Brown
Northwestern
Johns Hopkins
Rice
Emory
Vanderbilt
Notre Dame
UC-Berkeley
Carnegie Mellon
U. of Virginia
Georgetown
UCLA
U. of Michigan
Southern Cal
UNC-Chapel Hill
Tufts</p>
<p>interesting. i never looked at it that way. are you thinking that with an optional SAT, more kids will apply, but the same number will be accepted, making the percent go down? and then the sat scores will go up, because the kids with low sat scores won't submit them? am i following your logic?</p>
<p>i'm interested to see if that actually happens.</p>
<p>and uncfan, you are opening up a whole new can of worms with your discussion on affirmative action, which is not what this thread is about.</p>
<p>Penguin - I'm betting that that's exactly what the plan is. And when the SAT averages go up and the acceptance rate goes down, the peer assessors will take note and a couple years later, the peer assessment scores will rise. And, if in the process, Wake is able to attract and admit a more diverse entering class, they'll add something of value to campus life and gain even more national attention. Brilliant if it works out.</p>
<p>I still don't think the SAT average will rise because of this policy and am not sure why everyone else thinks it will. See my previous post in this thread on how matriculating students who did not submit their SAT scores during the application process will have to submit them once they matriculate, for statistical purposes, such as the U.S. News ranking. Here's a quote from the FAQ on Wake's website about the new policy:</p>
<p>Q: Will our average SAT scores be artificially inflated, since presumably only those students with high SATs will admit them?</p>
<p>A: Any students who chose not to submit their SAT scores as part of their admissions application will be asked to submit the scores after they have received their acceptance letter. Therefore, our SAT scores should accurately reflect our incoming class. </p>
<p>Presumably, the major reason a student would apply and not submit their SAT/ACT score is because it is below Wake's mean, since if it was at or above it, they'd have a great score they'd probably just include along in the application since it could only help them. Because of that, most likely any student Wake accepts (who decides to matriculate) will have a score below Wake's usual mean. When these students matriculate THEY WILL report their scores, and those will then be averaged in for U.S. News, etc. Unless Wake accepts a disproportionately small number of people who don't submit their SAT/ACT scores (which is also a possibility), then it should have slightly adverse effect on Wake's average SAT score. Most likely, Wake's SAT average will be about the same, or, if it rises in a few years, it'll be because all the SAT scores at comparably ranked competitive schools are rising across the board (as they have throughout the history of admissions). </p>
<p>Agreed that their acceptance rate will go down, as it's obvious there will be more applications and the same number of acceptances.</p>
<p>Just saw on a thread that US News & World Report 2009 ranked Wake Forest at #28...#30 last year. Go Wake!</p>
<p>^^moved ahead of UNC!</p>
<p>ellebee: there is nothing in Wake's pronouncement that says students MUST submit scores after matriculation. It just says that Wake will ASK for the scores. (There maybe plenty of kids who don't wish to send another $9 to CB....)</p>
<p>Wake Forest's website on their SAT policy (WFU</a> | Admissions | SAT/ACT Policy ) says the following:</p>
<p>
[quote]
Because we will gather scores from all admitted students, even those who did not want them considered in the admissions process, we do know we will provide data to U.S. News and World Report that reflects the true range of scores represented in the entering class.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>^^Ginny:</p>
<p>Yeah, I read what they wrote, but in this business, there is a LOT of spin. Until Wake comes out and says that they will withhold matriculation from anyone that does not submit an SAT/ACT score, there is absolutly no reason to assume that they will recieve 100% reporting -- it's just not logical, and does not happen at any other test-optional college.</p>