WashU worth the money for a pre-med?

Colleges and Universities A-Z Washington University in St. Louis
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<p>I've pretty much limited my college choices to between either WashU or Emory (13K per year i think), but now I'm thinking about my state school as well (University of Oklahoma is giving me a full ride). My parents are in a good income bracket (~200K) so they say they are perfectly willing to pay for me if I decide to go to either of the private schools. However, since I'm probably going to follow a career in medicine, how much of an advantage is it to go to a quality undergrad school? Could you guys fill me in on the pros and cons of selecting a more prestigious school over my full-ride state school, especially since I could just be applying to these medical schools four years later?</p>

<p>I'd deeply appreciate any help guys. Thanks.
I'll probably post this in the emory thread too.</p>

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<p>You will get a lot of different opinions on this, but here’s mine. It is 3 parts essentially.</p>

<p>Part 1 is just about how it affects your chances for med school. I assume you are talking about the honors college at OU, which is pretty decent. As long as you work hard, do well in all your courses, and score high on the MCAT’s, along with the other things med school’s look for these days such as summers with Dr.'s, etc., you will get into a good med school. In fact, you probably will have an easier time aceing courses at OU than at Wash U or Emory. But it is just that competitiveness, especially at Wash U, that will make you work harder and therefore most likely help you both get more out of your courses (after all, we can’t make med school the only purpose of your 4 years, can we?), and do better on the MCAT’s, your essays, etc. In other words, going to the private schools will increase your chances of getting into an elite med school, most likely. But you can certainly accomplish this still going to OU, and certainly get into a very good med school if you do the other things I mentioned.</p>

<p>Part 2 is money. While it is not a direct issue for you undergrad, how about the 4 years of med school after, especially if you get into Harvard or Johns Hopkins or wherever? If that is still covered and your parents don’t mind, great. Forget this paragraph. But if it is an issue and the money they are saving by you going to OU can be salted away for med school, then it should be a pretty big factor.</p>

<p>Finally, again assuming money isn’t an issue, where would you be happier, more challenged, just love being there? None of us know you, so of course only you can answer this. You know the drill. Big/small, Div I vs. Div 3, average students as your peers vs. lots of amazingly smart kids, living someplace pretty different, etc. I can’t say much about Emory, but I don’t think I have ever met a Wash U student that didn’t love it there. I know they exist, but it is a pretty great place. The fact that you got into Wash U says you are pretty smart, I would assume you want to be challenged at college. But again, only you can answer which fits your personality better.</p>

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<p>If you’re lucky enough to have parents willing to pay full tuition where ever, then go where you love!</p>

<p>As the above poster said, it <em>may</em> be easier to do well in pre-med at OU than Wash U or Emory. This is a good thing for some people, but it is also a bad thing for some people who want that extreme challenge. Wash U is generally known as having a most challenging pre-med program that prepares you very well for top-tier research-oriented med schools. Probably because most undergrads do research, and because the pre-med classes are not a cakewalk – just as med school isn’t a cakewalk, so you’re getting prepared from day 1.</p>

<p>The things you need to consider for pre-med programs: how much do you think you may want to research at some point, how much do you want to stretch yourself academically in undergrad, how much advising support do you want, and size of the classes. </p>

<p>The things you need to consider for college in general: importance of athletic culture, size of student body, location, social life, extracurriculars. </p>

<p>If I wanted to go to med school, my decision process here would be about balancing:</p>

<p>1) which school has the best pre-med program (however YOU define best… your criteria for a “best pre-med program” might be different that someone else’s criteria for it)</p>

<p>vs.</p>

<p>2) which university on the whole would i be happiest at – which to me is the more important one.</p>

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<p>Making the same decision here, but with another school thrown in.</p>

<p>Probable major in neuroscience
Emory–full ride as a woodruff scholar
Wash U–about 10K to pay, biomedical summer scholar (anybody have info on this?)
Duke–about 10K to pay</p>

<p>I’ve been to both Emory and Wash U, and they’re both incredible campuses. Going to Wash U again in two weeks, and I guess I’ll decide then. I’ve heard a lot about Wash U (and Duke) being incredible in pre-med and more challenging. Would this be worth the 10K over Emory’s pre-med? I don’t really care about athletics, but student life and research would be big factors.</p>

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<p>metb29 - on the surface, I would say toss a coin. Weather obviously better at Duke and Emory, don’t know about their food or dorms, which are great at Wash U. Probably nothing you can do except go with where your gut tells you, unless the 10K per year is a factor. Remember, that 10K could increase, depending on what kind of aid you are getting, but it probably wouldn’t increase that much. Also, for what it is worth, nationally Duke would have the highest name recognition with the general public not just because of sports, but for quality as well. Med school admissions people know they are all great.</p>

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<p>Hey thanks fallenchemist and keepitcoolidge for the help.</p>

<p>fallenchemist: yeah I have a sister coming up so if my parents pay for undergrad, i’ll probbaly have to take loans for med school like everyone else. I guess I’m willing to do that, since I’m confident I can manage the debt but a that is a big factor in my decisions.</p>

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<p>Thanks fallenchemist. The 10K is a pretty big factor, so Emory’s looking more attractive at the moment. Guess I don’t get to decide until Multicultural Weekend…</p>

<p>To the OP, have you been to both Wash U and Emory?</p>

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<p>i’ve visited wash u but it was partially under reconstruction so i didn’t see everything and it was during the summer, so no classes to sit in on. i still thought it was a really beautiful campus though. I think i’m going to see emory later in april.</p>

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<p>KIN6 - man, tough decision then. Don’t you hate it? You will love having the money later in life, but I know I would have not been nearly as happy at a big State U as I was at Tulane. I think in the end, it is better to have the most challenging and complete education possible, but it is a tough balancing of factors. Not much help, I know. Good luck with it whatever direction you go.</p>

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<p>Agree with most everything the other posters are saying. Just a few points - </p>

<p>My D is a soph at WashU. She was also offered four year free rides to many stateUs due to NMF. She attended a very weak public high school and has to work VERY hard to do well at WashU, but that is ok with her. As FC asked, what type of undergraduate experience are you looking for? Our D didn’t want a repeat of h.s. She didn’t want to go to a college where 85% of the students were from our state and anyone with an ACT 21 or above was likely to be admitted. She has peers at WashU who blow her mind with their out of the box thinking, and that is exactly the environment she was looking for.</p>

<p>D has friends who are in our StateU’s honor program and a couple of other schools around the country. When they visit about courses at home during breaks from college (courses such as chem, orgo, bio, physics, etc.), my D says that she is shocked at how elementary the material they are learning is in comparison to what is covered in those same classes at WashU. </p>

<p>WashU takes the medical school application process very seriously and assists you every step of the way. WashU has special “classes” that provide for physician shadowing experiences, “classes” that include research experiences, TONS of opportunity for research through the medical school, mock medical school interviews, MCAT review courses on campus, compilation of your documents for medical school into a folder with a stunning looking Washington University seal on the front (haven’t seen this personally - just heard tales of its grandeur!), etc. - the list goes on and on.</p>

<p>My husband has a partner who did his undergrad at WashU. He said that medical school seemed “easy” and the administration of the medical school “disorganized” after being around 4 years of WashU’s well-oiled academic machine.</p>

<p>Metb - have you visited Duke? Obviously a fabulous school, but D decided not to apply after visiting. It was the only school she visited where not one student came up on their own and talked to her. She thought it was weird (and vaguely frightening) how the freshmen live on one part of the campus and everyone else on the other, with the one mile stretch of road between the two. We sat on a bench and just watched the dynamics of the students - we never saw any two different races of people talking or walking together. I am sure it happens, but we didn’t see it.</p>

<p>So, K1N6 - You can certainly go to OU for free (which is a great deal), get a good education, get involved in interesting ECs, work your way into some leadership positions, and most probably get more academic honors than at WashU or Emory, AND get into medical school. </p>

<p>Another little side story. Our older daughter (not a NMF) decided to attend the honors program of our stateU. She looked at WashU, but decided not to apply. She did VERY well at stateU - 4.0 gpa, Phi Beta Kappa, name one of 10 Chancellor’s Scholars (out of 3,700+ seniors graduating), short study abroad experience, alternative break public service trips, great internships every summer, president of her major’s honor society, president of her scholarship hall, etc. etc. I have NO doubt younger D would have received these very same honors if she had chosen to attend StateU, but I also feel like she would not have been happy in the academic environment of the school. </p>

<p>It comes down to what you want your undergraduate experience to be and what type of peers you want to surround yourself with. There is a night and day difference between StateUs and schools such as WashU and Emory. There is no right or wrong choice here - just which one is right for you?</p>

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<p>fallenchemist: Yeah, its pretty rough…thanks for your help though.</p>

<p>mwparent: Hey, i really appreciate your insight on this subject (although the washu seal was kind of superficial hahaha :D</p>

<p>I guess after my personal preference of campuses, my most important determining factor is still medical school admission. I’ll admit the one thing i’m afraid of is going to a school like washu for undergrad and then ending up at OU for med school. Not that there’s anything wrong with ou, but if i end up going there for med school, i probably should have just gone to OU undergrad too and saved my parents some money. (i guess maybe a guilty factor). But i’ve done pretty well in high school (4.0, 2300, etc) and i’m extremely competitive so it sounds like washU is a little more fitting for me…</p>

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<p>One big thing for OU in particular is that, if I’m not mistaken, the main undergraduate campus is in Norman, whereas the medical campus is in OKC. On the other hand WashU’s undergraduate and medical campus are only a 5 minute rail commute apart. So would expect there to be a pretty big difference in terms of ease of access to medical research labs, as well as shadowing access.</p>

<p>I think that it will be easier to get into a med school from OU, just because a high GPA will be easier to maintain. However, I think that it will be easier to be competitive for a top-tier med school if you go to WashU. And, in terms of available resources and pre-med training, I think WashU may just be worth the money.</p>

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<p>K1N6 - The WashU seal superficial? As I said, haven’t actually seen the packet the school puts together, but I would say the seal is put on the front to represent the impressiveness of the institution it represents. Doesn’t have anything to do with being superficial. In the scheme of things it is very minor - just trying to convey the great lengths WashU goes to in assisting their med school applicants.</p>

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<p>Worth the $? No. Go to OU. Get a 4.0. Invest $ that would have been spent on tuition at WU or Emory. Graduate with no debt, a big nest egg, a beautiful OU girlfriend, and head off to med school and a high paying, secure career as an orthopedic surgeon.</p>

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<p>So many students seem to make the decision about which school to attend based on something they may or may not do 4 years down the road. I read over on the premed thread that only 10% of student who enter college on the premed track finish that way. Not just in the area of premed, but a large percentage of students change their major once exposed to an array of college classes.</p>

<p>My older D started as a biology major on the premed track. Sophomore year did a 180 and headed a completely different direction.</p>

<p>My nephew is a soph at Northwestern. Brilliant kid - 2390 SAT (one and only sitting), Val, NMF, Pres Scholar semi, IB, amazing writer, etc. etc. Started in an area of science and now is a history major. Although he is incredibly gifted in math and science, he LOVES history.</p>

<p>Finances always have to be part of the equation, but students should chose their school based on which school they think will provide them with the undergraduate experience they desire.</p>

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<p>Midwest Parent - echoing what you are saying bigtime. I have said similar on the Tulane thread about kids always changing their minds, and it is so true. If there are only a few real core truths about going on from high school to college, one of them is that there is no other time in your life when you can really find your passion without the kind of disruption that would occur, for example, 10 years down the road. Think of all the things you have never even been exposed to coming out of high school!</p>

<p>While I stand by what I said previously, your post causes me to slant my advice towards being around challenging peers in a challenging atmosphere, since compared to most families, his can afford it. And as KIN6 said, if in 4 years he still wants med school, there are ways for him to pay for it, as so many do.</p>

<p>Good post, Midwest.</p>

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<p>OP, you might want to look at this from another angle. If you go to OU, you will have $160,000+ more in the bank after 4 years compare to going to the other schools.</p>