<p>Thump I have a friend who went to a regular state school & he regrets not having bragging rights to a top tier. That never sat right w/ me & you just helped me clarify why.</p>
<p>“College is 4 years of your life for undergrad work usually undertaken between the ages of 18-23. The notion that these four years are going to define your success is absurd.”</p>
<p>Well curm, I’m 58 and I made it 135 miles non-stop this weekend. Unfortunately, doing so required skipping coffee, so I almost dozed off. </p>
<p>nychomie, you are confusing being educated with purchasing a formal education. If Abe Lincoln could manage it with borrowed books and a good supply of candles, we modern types should be able to take advantage of libraries, the internet, educational programs that can be downloaded onto portable devices, and so on. </p>
<p>Of course, if you are really stuck on the idea that you can only learn if you are surrounded by other superior types, then I guess the idea of life-time learning does not impress you.</p>
<p>And excuse me if I sound rude here, but the suggestion that figuring out how to get your term papers done on time is the epitome of learning how to “handle responsibilities” is a bit…naive.</p>
<p>I think it is fine to stop & go pee. I have to drink something & snack to stay awake ,driving for at least three hours at a time, & chat with those nice retired folks w coffeecake at the rest stops.
( of course some weekends- three hours might mean 200 miles or 60 miles)</p>
<p>And excuse me if I sound rude here, but the suggestion that figuring out how to get your term papers done on time is the epitome of learning how to “handle responsibilities” is a bit…naive.</p>
<p>if only it was…</p>
<p>The problem with parents is we digress, it not about peeing or not about not able to drive long distance, it’s just we can’t stick to a point. On the other hand, if we had gone to better schools then maybe we could drive longer distance without having to go pee.</p>
<p>What I have a problem with is when parents (usually out of jealousy) become highly critical of graduates of elite universities when they end up in jobs that deviate from where graduates of such universities are expected to end up (e.g. English major working at Starbucks). They then point to these graduates as “bad apples” and use them to illustrate the point that not everybody who graduates from an elite college is “successful.” While that may be true, the criteria for “success” should be more comprehensive. I believe people can graduate from Princeton, become a garbage man and still live a very enriched life. I actually think that’s a very interesting and viable life path. But others would automatically assume the state school grad who became an accountant for Deloitte is more successful.</p>
<p>I’m not saying if you aspire to be wealthy that you automatically preclude yourself from living an enriched life- just that success should be based more on the latter than the former.</p>
<p>nychomie, what I have a problem with is when students (usually out of ignorance or prejudice) assume that state school grads can’t live enriched intellectual lives.</p>
<p>I happen to have a pretty broad definition of ‘successful’. I suspect it is broader than yours.</p>
<p>Because I do really believe that any intelligent person can become educated even without studying at elite colleges–although it might require more personal initiative–I think it is foolish not to expect some kind of tangible return on educational investments. If the Princeton graduate who serves up coffee at Starbucks comes from a wealthy family, or has spent trust funds dedicated to her/his education or has been granted generous financial aid by the university, then the ‘return’ doesn’t matter so much. But if that graduate put her/his family through significant sacrifice to attend an expensive school rather than a more affordable one, that is another matter. (Speaking theoretically, only. I really don’t care what other people do with their money.) </p>
<p>As someone pointed out above, the coffee server may have to rethink things once she/he has children.</p>
<p>If all you are saying is that there is more to life than money, I doubt that anyone here has an argument with that.</p>
<p>Ahh,gee, and here I thought I had to go every 60 miles because of those 2 pregnancies and childbirth events. how disappointing to learn I could have prevented this misery simply by attending that OTHER university!</p>
<p>
Or, perhaps the grad of the ‘state school’ (is that the college equivalent of a ‘regular’ HS to you?) will lead a more intellectual life than the grad of Princeton who might end up the accountant for Deloitte or in any other position. Can you imagine that might be possible? </p>
<p>Who are the ‘others’ you’re referring to? So far not a single parent has posted on this thread defining ‘success’ as being financially driven. You seem to be presenting the most narrow view of ‘success’ with your implication that it’s defined as having attended P or a few other USNWR highly ranked colleges.</p>
<p>Here you go again defining success with “return” on the money. I personally don’t care if I get in 100k of debt if it means I got to experience a topflight education. And yes, even if I ended up working at Starbucks in the end, I will consider myself successful-- just as much, if not more, than that guy working at Deloitte after graduating from a no-name college.</p>
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<p>Well, yes, but imagine if that same kid attended a different university that afforded him 10x more opportunities and 10x greater exposure to diverse life perspectives and backgrounds.</p>
<p>
I’ve know many state school accounting majors have Deloitte in mind when they started at the state school. They’ve achieved their goals and so they are successful.
I’ve never known or heard any elite college students have their mind set to be a garbage man or even in Starbucks when they started their elite education. Yes, college students do change their majors, but …</p>
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<p>Meanwhile the truck driver without a degree can go 500 miles without having to stop.</p>
<p>[Urine-filled</a> Bottles. Roadside America](<a href=“http://www.roadsideamerica.com/rant/pee.html]Urine-filled”>Jugs of Pee)</p>
<p>
I didn’t. You’re the only poster on this thread who even mentioned ‘success’ as being defined in terms of money albeit by some undefined (by you) ‘others’.</p>
<p>
I’m very happy that you have such a positive view of your school but I think it’s quite arguable whether it’s 10x in the attributes you mentioned over, for example, UCLA or UCSD (those would be ‘state schools’).</p>
<p>You’re so focused on your own experience in your education and particular schools it’s blinding you.</p>
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<p>What is the definition of a “well rounded liberal arts education” in this context?</p>
<p>In some universities, STEM majors take many more humanities and social studies courses than humanities and social studies majors take math and science courses, so if the STEM majors are not getting a “well rounded” education, the humanities and social studies majors are getting an even less “well rounded” education.</p>
<p>As far as the money / career aspect goes, poverty tends to make one unhappy, but once out of poverty, additional money tends to give diminishing returns in terms of happiness. When choosing a major, it is important to have an idea of what type of career opportunities are available. A student may accept not-so-great career opportunities in order to study what s/he is passionate about, but it is best to know that beforehand (and lay the groundwork early for a post-graduation job and career) rather than be surprised at graduation in that respect.</p>
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<p>Oh, please. I loved my elite college experience to the max and I’m thrilled to be able to pass it on to my children, but I think you’d be pretty surprised that you could find some quite intellectual life-of-the-mind folks in any setting if you look hard enough.</p>
<p>And as for handling responsibilities – frankly, the working adult who never got to go to traditional sleep-away residential college, who is working full time, raising a family and maybe taking classes in the evening at the local community college or directional state university, is likely doing a far superior job of handling responsibilities than the 18, 19, 20 year old who has no household to manage, kids to raise, job to do, or bills to pay and can just spend his time taking classes and being with friends. </p>
<p>I loved the first part of your post about intellectual and personal enrichment, but then I was quite disappointed to hear that you think that those things are apparently restricted to the top 20 or so universities and LAC’s. You were onto something when you said … “In that sense, the student who is ready to take advantage of everything a college has to offer will probably benefit the most …” but then you had to go and ruin it by linking it to the school, as opposed to the person.</p>
<p>Wait a minute - aren’t you the OP who started the thread on ugly people wearing HYP tee-shirts?</p>
<p><a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/parent-cafe/1074547-most-elitist-people-when-they-finally-reach-ranks-elite.html?highlight=nychomie[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/parent-cafe/1074547-most-elitist-people-when-they-finally-reach-ranks-elite.html?highlight=nychomie</a></p>
<p>After that thread, I was kind of hoping this one would die without response…</p>
<p>… and I think that life success should be measured by how many people miss you when you’re gone (and by how deeply they miss you).</p>
<p>I agree with midmo (post 27). Apparently some attendees of top schools skipped the courses on humility and diplomacy. Maybe they should make them mandatory.</p>
<p>“Life’s most persistent and urgent question is: What are you doing for others?”</p>
<p>Martin Luther King</p>