Weak undergraduate -----> Ivy Grad School

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Sakky, what happens if you were the last ranked in your class but compared to other students in other schools you actually did better even though you were the last in your class. Basically what I'm saying is, say there's a top student from like a CUNY would they take that CUNY student over a Harvard student who was the last graduate in his class even though the Harvard student actually had the better grades? Hopefully my question makes some sense.

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<p>It really depends on what kind of graduate school you're talking about, and specifically how GPA intensive the admissions process are. Med school and law school admissions are notoriously numbers-oriented. In those cases, it is almost always better to have top grades at a no-name school and/or in an easy major than it is to have bad grades at a very difficult school and/or in a very difficult major. </p>

<p>To give you an example, I would argue that somebody who got a 2.5/4 in chemical engineering at MIT is almost certainly harder working and more intelligent than a guy who got a 3.5/4 in "Leisure Studies" at a no-name school. {In case anybody's wondering, yes, some schools really do have a major called Leisure Studies}. But, presuming all the other factors like test scores are the same, the latter guy will almost certainly have an easier time getting into med/law school than the former guy. </p>

<p>Basically, the med/law schools just want to see high grades, and don't really seem to care very much that some schools and some majors are harder than others. To them, you either got high grades, or you didn't. To them, it's better to get an A in an easy, do-nothing class than to get a C in an extremely difficult class. . Hence, academic cowardice is actually rewarded. The natural response by many successful law/med applicants is to avoid difficult classes whenever possible, and to take classes on things that they already know whenever possible. For example, I've known people who were completely fluent in a foreign language but decided to take all the intro classes for that language anyway, just so that they could get a long string of easy A's. They learned nothing because they already knew the stuff, but they didn't care, they just wanted the easy A's. It worked - they got into some top law schools. Sad but true.</p>

<p>However, as far as other graduate schools are concerned, things can be different. For example, like I said before, B-school admissions mostly hinges on your work and leadership experience. B-schools reject plenty of people with stellar numbers but poor experience. Academic graduate programs (i.e. MA/MS, PhD) generally tend to hinge mostly on your prof recs and your research experience. If you have top numbers but you don't have strong recs or strong research experience, you probably won't get into a top academic graduate program. </p>

<p>Nevertheless, graduating last from any school, even a place like Harvard, is still quite difficult to overcome. It would mean that you have a GPA that is close to a 2.0. That basically makes you dead in getting into any decent law/med school and even the other graduate schools would have some serious questions. In that situation, you probably are better off going to some no-name school and getting better grades. </p>

<p>Of course that presumes that you would have actually gotten better grades at that no-name school. In reality, you might have actually ended up with WORSE grades at the no-name school. This is because Harvard practices a form of grade inflation such that it is almost impossible to flunk out. Basically, as long as you put in some reasonable effort, you're going to pass. Maybe not with good grades, but you're going to pass. Lots of no-name schools, on the other hand, just don't care if you flunk out and will merrily hand out reams of failing grades and will coldly expel lots of students. A strong social factor is also at play. Most Harvard students are highly studious and responsible students, whereas many students at the no-name schools are, to be honest, rather lazy and unmotivated. When you're surrouded by hard-working people, you will tend to want to work hard, but when you're surrounded by lazy people, you will tend to want to be lazy. </p>

<p>Hence, by turning down an elite school for a no-name school, you might end up actually doing WORSE. Happened to a guy I knew. He had the opportunity to go to an elite school like Harvard, Stanford or MIT. Instead he chose a state school, mostly to save money, as not only could he get in-state tuition, but more importantly he also got himself a full ride there. Sadly, he promptly flunked right out of that state school because he became lazy and immature. He saw lots of other lazy and immature students at that state school so he became lazy himself. He saw other kids not studying, not going to class, and not doing any work, so he got tempted to also not study, not go to class, and not do any work. The truth is, if he had chosen to go to one of those elite schools, he probably would have his college degree. Maybe not with top grades, but at least he would have his degree. That's a lot better than what he has now, which is no degree at all.</p>

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Have myself 2-3 years of work experience and then go to a top business school like Wharton School of Business. I know I have to still be a good student but after a college admissions officer told me that generally it doesn't matter where you go to when you apply to undergrad school because it's the grad school that will really give you a name and to the grad school a gpa is a gpa no matter where you went.

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<p>Of course the presumption here is that you really will be able to get into a top graduate program later. The truth is, graduate admissions are quite fickle and unpredictable. Especially B-school admissions. You might have great numbers, great work experience, great rec's, a great interview, and STILL not get into a decent B-school. </p>

<p>For example, I knew a guy who had a highly successful career as an engineer, and so applied to a number of top B-schools. He didn't get in anywhere. However, with the money he made, he was able to afford to bum around for a couple of years, so that's exactly what he did - he basically bummed around the country on his motorcycle for 2 years. After that, he applied to those same B-schools again, and this time he got into a few. But why did he get in now instead of 2 years ago? It's not like those 2 years of riding his bike made him a more qualified applicant. His numbers were the same. His rec's and essays were the same. So what's changed? The point is that B-school admissions can be highly perplexing and seemingly random. Sometimes you just really can't fathom why somebody got rejected and why somebody else got admitted. You can have excellent qualifications and still find out that, by luck of the draw, that you don't get in anywhere. </p>

<p>If you go to a top undergrad program, at least you've locked in a top program, as opposed to waiting for admission to a top graduate program which may never happen. A bird in the hand vs. 2 in the bush. </p>

<p>Don't get me wrong. I'm not saying that everybody should always choose to go to a top undergrad program over a lesser one. This is a decision that every individual has to make for himself. What I am saying is that nobody can presume that admission to a top grad school is guaranteed. It might happen. It might not happen. Who knows?</p>