Wellesley or Dartmouth?

College Search & Selection
1

I was recently accepted to both Wellesley and Dartmouth through RD. I’ve been in love with Wellesley for a really long time, and quite honestly wasn’t thinking about attending Dartmouth at all until I was accepted a few days ago. Now I have a really difficult decision to make. I’ve tried to come up with some pros and cons for each of these schools before I visit them later this month. Any input would be appreciated!

As for social life, I don’t have any issues with Wellesley being a women’s college. A lot of what I’ve read says that in order to party and have a social life, you have to take the Senate bus to MIT or Harvard, but that doesn’t really bother me. I’m not a big drinker and I’m just as happy hanging out with my friends as I am going to parties anyway. And regardless, I really shouldn’t choose a college based on its party scene. And many of the women I’ve spoken to who are Wellesley alumnae told me that it’s really not difficult to meet guys. One of my friends told me that on Saturdays, you wouldn’t be able to tell that Wellesley isn’t coed. As for Dartmouth, I can’t stop picturing Animal House. I’ve heard that over 60% of the student body is in Greek Life, and I can’t help but think that’s because there’s not much else to do in the middle of NH but party. But then again, shouldn’t I be taking Dartmouth’s party scene with a grain of salt, because I’m there to get an education? The two schools feel like polar opposites in terms of the party scene. I just don’t want to end up somewhere that’s not “me” socially. In that regard, I feel like I’m a much better fit at Wellesley, where I can go into Cambridge if I’m the mood but stay on campus when I feel like it.

I also want to say that I love the idea of a women’s college as an academic institution. It would be really cool to see my peers, in traditionally male dominated fields, be incredibly smart, talented women. I’ve heard that Wellesley is a much more collaborative than competitive environment as well, which I like a lot. I don’t know about Dartmouth on that front, so if anyone knows, tell me!

In terms of academics, I’m interested in biology, especially genetics. From what I’ve seen online, Dartmouth has many more classes in the field of genetics, compared to Wellesley with only one. But then again, Wellesley does have the biochemistry interdepartmental major (which seems like SO MANY classes to squeeze into four years) which is kind of related to genetics. I think my interests may be more tailored to Dartmouth. I intend to be premed, but I want to make sure that there are science classes I’m interested in as well, because I know that most students who intend to be premed eventually decide not to apply to medical school at all. I think I can get into a great medical school from either Dartmouth or Wellesley, but I’m not sure if one has a significantly better premed advising than the other.

Size is another factor. Wellesley is less than half the size of Dartmouth if you include graduate students, which I am. I don’t know how class sizes compare, but both tout a 7:1 student-to-faculty ratio. Perhaps my research opportunities would be better at Wellesley without grad students around? There are so many labs in Boston and Cambridge too, between all the colleges and med schools in the area. I got a really nice letter from a Wellesley student who said she works in a HMS affiliated lab in Cambridge during the summers. Then again, Dartmouth does have the Women in Science Project for freshmen women, and I assume other research opportunities will be available throughout my years there. Dartmouth also has the D-plan, which means I could do research in the fall, winter, or spring instead.

I realized I haven’t even touched grade deflation. To be honest, it doesn’t worry me that much. I’m aware that it’s just there to make students work harder and set higher expectations for themselves. I know Wellesley has a policy on it, but I’m not sure about Dartmouth.

The only other thing I can think of when comparing these two schools (which will sound very superficial) is their prestige. Dartmouth is a part of the Ivy League, which almost everyone knows about. Wellesley isn’t, but it is one of the Seven Sisters, women’s colleges created for those not allowed to attend the Ivy League schools. I don’t know if Dartmouth’s academics are significantly better than Wellesley’s, or if both of these schools are so good that it doesn’t make a difference at this point.

I’ve already read this CC thread written by @absentions, whose college options and interests seem eerily similar to my own. She eventually ended up at Wellesley. Here’s the link to her thread:
http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/wellesley-college/1639765-wellesley-vs-dartmouth-p1.html

Thank you so much if you’ve read through this whole thing! Any insight and assistance you’re willing to give me would be greatly appreciated.

2

You are correct that choosing one over the other is a choice of social environment. They are academic peers.

If both are equally affordable, my vote is with Wellesley as that seems to be your personal first choice.

3

Just because Dartmouth is in the Ivy League (an athletic conference) doesn’t mean that its academics are any better than Wellesley’s. I think you would be hard pressed to find academics any better than Wellesley’s. Plus you can supplement with courses at MIT very easily if there are ones that interest you that are not offered at Wellesley. There is also the 12 college exchange, so if you went to either Dartmouth or Wellesley you could do juniot year at the other school.

I think the atmosphere is very different between the two schools. Wellesley is very pro-women while Dartmouth has had a lot of problems with women and fraternities. I believe they are taking many steps to address the situation.
Dartmouth also has that quarter schedule - love it or hate it - think hard about it.

4

I disagree that Dartmouth and Wellesley are academic peers.

Based on what?

In terms of premedical coursework, Dartmouth has an associated medical school, and thus far better research opportunities. There’s more NIH funding and more resources that undergrads can tap into in terms of summer research or finding a mentor. There’s also more recruitment opportunities in other fields if the student feels like premed is the wrong way to go; more firms do campus visits to Dartmouth. Not to say that it’s impossible to succeed from Wellesley, just that the built-in funnel isn’t as present.

If the applicant feels like social fit is important, which it is, there are valid differences between the two schools and that’s important to factor in. But to equate the two academically especially in the sciences is just wrong. And I say this as a med student at a top 5 school who’s been through the process.

5

I read your post and thought “why ask? It’s clear she prefers Wellesley.” Wellesley. It’s just as prestigious, too.

6

And also, yes, you can work at HMS-affiliated labs in the summer. But, the problem is that it’s rare (almost impossible) to get a publication or do a meaningful project that wraps up in that time span in the basic sciences. You have to be very very lucky for that to happen. Clinical research is more easy to be productive in 1 summer.

If you have the ability to stick with the same lab for the academic term as well, it’s useful to getting more done.

I probably seem like a Dartmouth partisan–I’m not. Being happy at school is the most important thing. If you’re not happy you’re less likely to do well. But to equate the two academically in the sciences is a fallacious narrative.

7

Your post reads to me like you prefer Wellesley. Don’t get caught up in that “prestige” “Ivy League” thing. Both schools are recognized as being outstanding, both schools should be able to give you want you need academically, and if you excel both can get you wherever you want to go in life. Attend the school that suits you – keep in mind that people tend do do their best when they are happy and conformable.

8

@happymomof1 I got the same aid from both schools, so it’s coming down to my preference. It probably seems to be my first choice because it WAS my first choice for so long! I’m trying to have an open mind about Dartmouth. :slight_smile:

@stemmmm I’m going to look into the classes that MIT has to offer, as I haven’t really done that yet! Maybe they have the biology courses I don’t see at Wellesley. I feel like I’ll have to reevaluate how I feel about Dartmouth’s problem with fraternities and its quarter system after I visit.

@Lindagaf I did prefer Wellesley for a really long time, but I’m asking because I truthfully don’t know as much about Dartmouth as I do Wellesley and I’m trying to keep an open mind and see if the stereotypes I know about it are founded.

@Arwen1 You have some great points! (Probably because you’ve gone through the whole process.) I have a question for you: do medical schools prefer that you have research experience in the general sciences, or specifically research experience related to the medical field?

@happy1 Thanks for the advice. I know that Wellesley is a place where I would be happy and comfortable, now I need to visit and see if it’s the same for Dartmouth.

9

Dartmouth offers more classes in Genetics, so i’d give them the edge in academic fit. They will also have more research opportunities on campus – you’d probably have to travel to the city (Boston/Cambridge) to do research as a Wellesley student.

In terms of social fit, it sounds like Wellesley is more your thing. Dartmouth is known for its Greek/party scene, which suits some well but not others. Surely you could find some kids to hang with outside of parties, but the party scene sounds like a major part of the Dartmouth experience. (I would have loved it)

At Wellesley, it may be easier to avoid parties and just head to Boston when you felt the urge.

So if Dartmouth has an academic edge for your interests, while Wellesley has the edge in social vibe, what breaks the tie?

Access to culture? Boston is close to Wellesley. Hanover, NH is hours from the city. Advantage, Wellesley.

Access to the great outdoors? Dartmouth.

Cost – Is there a meaningful difference?

Prestige – I think they’re about even here: top-10ish U vs. top-10 LAC. Maaaaaaybe a slight edge to Dartmouth for its Ivy tag, but Wellesley is quite famous for a LAC. Do not decide based on prestige.

Dartmouth offers more majors, so if you changed your mind, it’s more likely that D would offer your new interest.

And calendar: Comparevthe D Plan to Wellesley’s semester system.

So – that’s the breakdown as well as I can figure it. You can’t make a bad choice if you like them both.

10

I wouldn’t say that Dartmouth has a very significant academic edge. As a research institution there may be more of a focus (or at least a divided attention) on graduate students, whereas Wellesley as a liberal arts college is by nature more devoted to the undergraduate experience. Have you researched whether Dartmouth has classes taught by TAs?

My vote is Wellesley. The collaborative environment and intelligent female peers make it hard to beat. Dartmouth’s social scene would likely also bleed into the students’ approaches to academia.

11

Well, if Dartmouth offers more classes she’s interested in, that certainly would be an edge. She might be able to take some Genetics courses in Boston as a Wellesley student, but that would add travel time/hassle and related expenses.

As for TAs leading lectures – highly doubtful. TAs might lead some labs or discussion sections – not sure how Dartmouth works in that respect. At UW if the lecture was large – a survey-level course, for instance – typically it would be split up into multiple smaller discussion sections, which would meet weekly to supplement the lectures. Those were typically led by TAs; certainly not the lectures. But Dartmouth isn’t Wisconsin, so I’ll leave it to the OP to research, or for Dartmouth students or alumni to comment.

12

I will suggest Wellesley over Dartmouth for two reasons: 1) it sounds from your post that you are in love with Wellesley 2) Wellesley with its cross-registration with MIT will offer you more on the academic front than Dartmouth - including classes in genetics plus a ton of research opportunities especially during Independent Activity Period (winter) and summer.

13

Wellesley has smaller class sizes; average 17 to 20 - At Dartmouth half of classes are 30+ and a quarter of them are 50+

14

FWIW My D at Wellesley procured a research opportunity at the McGovern Institute for Brain Research the summer after her first year and she isn’t fetching coffee. She’s working in a Parkinson’s research lab, worked there all year and will soon be starting her second summer there. She did mouse brain surgery recently. She was also offered a 4 year research opportunity at New England Biolabs in Ipswich (google it, you might be very interested in working there). This was set up by her Intro to Bio professor who simply called up an old friend. Her story is not unusual. My D was also offered a TA-like job as her work study, for an Intro class in one of the major sciences (you need to make A’s in these classes to be considered for this). All of her professors have been extremely supportive.

The claim that Wellesley can’t set you up with a significant research opportunity is poppycock. You have all of Boston at your fingertips.

I’m sure Dartmouth is great too. I’m just pointing out Arwen1 really doesn’t know the opportunities available to Wellesley students and what he/she’s saying isn’t adequate to base a decision on.

Visit both and you will know. Good luck!

15

it looks like the medical school placement rates for the two schools are identical - hovering in the low 70% of applicants getting into medical schools.

16

This may be of interest to you. Read through the whole thing. There are many labs in Boston besides this opportunity, and there are also a lot of on-campus opportunities for Wellesley students in professorial labs! My D gets emails all the time telling her of opportunities. She loves going to the MIT campus. A bus runs hourly and it’s free. It does take time out of your day. It’s zone out time for the most part. You are also entitled to a meal in the MIT cafeteria (etc.) depending on the number of hours you are on the campus.

http://web.mit.edu/urop/apply/elig.html

Another thing you’ll want to do as a pre-med is to volunteer in a hospital or something, actually working with patients. That can be harder to set up than a research position!! So look at that as well.

17

wow @redpoodles that’s amazing for your daughter!

18

I just remembered another thing. There is a research opportunity for first year and second year students that is sponsored by Harvard Medical School. (I think they pick 15 or 20 Wellesley students.–I could be wrong, but that’s my recollection.) This program is specifically for those without experience, so it helps you get that next job! You have to apply, but your professors/department heads will reach out and tell you when to do it. It’s pretty competitive–not everyone gets in (my D didn’t). Also, if you are a URM, there are TONS of opportunities for you, all over the place. So don’t let this deter you from either school–opportunites are great at both schools.

Also, to clarify, when I say my D is a TA at Wellesley (they call it an SI)-- what this means at Wellesley is that you have to attend the class and run two study sessions apart from the class. STUDY SESSIONS. TA’s do not exist at Wellesley. All classes, even labs, are run by people with Ph.D.'s or are industry experts (such as the costume design class–that teacher doesn’t have a Ph.D., however, she is a working professional in the costume design industry.)

19

Ugh lol. Embarrassing. I’m at home this weekend and the computer was autologged into my sibling’s CC account. Fail.

Reposting:

As someone who’s worked on medical school admissions and interviewed and evaluated premeds, I actually do think I have a better sense of what schools are looking for…because it was my job to?

@kajame, it’s less important what specific science your research is in (bio, chem, clinical, public health, whatever), than what your impact is and how good your letter is from your PI. Pubs and PI letter outweigh any specific content. All things being equal, a more senior / established professor has more pull, but often assistant professors have more energy and are more eager to mentor, and a better letter trumps a title any day.

@redpoodles: Your examples of your daughter working in a great lab during the summers doesn’t invalidate my assertion that you’d be harder pressed to find a great year-round lab + summer position at Wellesley.

It depends what your life goals are. You can obviously get into medical school from Wellesley or UMASS or almost anywhere. Heck I know people who went to community college, excelled, transferred to state school and are at med school. But if you look at class composites from top med schools and where matriculants come from, there’s a huge imbalance and favorability toward applicants from more “prestigious” schools, and there are way people at my school and at peer schools who are from places like Dartmouth than places like Wellesley.

20

@arwen1 Of course there are more people from Dartmouth in your circles than from Wellesley. Dartmouth UG population is almost twice as big, and there are many more places like Dartmouth than there are like Wellesley. As someone already point out, the success rate for med school admissions from each school is the same number, and this number is much more relevant than how many students at Medical School X are from Wellesley College in particular this year? I have no idea why you don’t consider Wellesley to be a “prestigious” school. If you want to talk “prestige,” Wellesley is number 3 to Dartmouth’s number 11; W is also the “top” college in the world in its class (what is Dartmouth?). This is kind of ridiculous. My point is that it isn’t that hard at all to get year round research experience at or around Wellesley. You don’t seem to know anything about it. I did say you can also do this at Dartmouth. Or at UMass for that matter.

OP, you have two fantastic places to choose from! I hope you have great visits at each b/c that will bring clarity for you. The social atmospheres are very different. Go with the one that resonates with your gut in real life. Congrats!