<p>What are the top 3-5 colleges in California for out of state students? (especially for students from east coast/south east) </p>
<p>It is difficult to answer the original question without knowing the OP’s financial status. If money is no object, then the UC’s are certainly to be considered. However, if the OP qualfies for substantial financial aid, then the cost to attend a private school can be much, much lower than paying OOS fees at a UC school. OOS costs at a UC school are nearly $50K/year, but with financial aid (grants and scholarships) the cost to attend a private school in CA can be half that.</p>
<p>Not completely true. If you’re talking solely about HMC, yes. But only 40% of Pomona’s enrolling class lists math or science as their intended major, and I think Pitzer and Scripps have lower percentages than that (Pitzer is better known for the social sciences).</p>
<p>My top five colleges in CA for OOS would be: (in no order)</p>
<p>if you’re OOS and you can’t afford to attend a top UC, don’t go, or you’ll just suffer once you’re there with very limited budget. But if you come from a rich family, you’re going to enjoy Berkeley or UCLA a lot. </p>
<p>If you’ll pay the full fees at Berkeley or UCLA, you’ll just be fine. You won’t be in a bad situation at either school because of the State’s financial crises. That has very little effect to your stay at either Berkeley or UCLA. </p>
<p>But if you’re going to spend a lot of money for your education, might as well spend if for a prestigious qualification. Something that will be respected even outside of California especially if we’re talking about OOS or International students. Sadly, with th exception of Mudd, none of the Claremont colleges has the prestige equal to UCLA, more so, Berkeley.</p>
<p>funk, there seems to be a widespread notion on this forum that somehow, academic reputation and quality are unrelated. That cannot be. If a school has a good reputation, it must, by definition, be good. Of course, the opposite is not necessarily true. Some universities/colleges are brilliant and do not have a strong reputation. But if a school has a storng academic reputation, then it must be good.</p>
<p>Alex, I agree. My comment was mostly aimed at RML, who prefers the prestige of Berkeley over Pomona. Obviously both Berkeley and Pomona are highly regarded, and other schools deserve their prestige too, but I just wanted to make a point. I like a school for the school, not for the prestige. To me, when people compare the prestige of schools, it’s like comparing the packaging of two toys. I want the toy. Some people prefer flashy packaging. </p>
<p>I don’t blame RML. There are so many people on CC, and in this thread, who claim that instruction and the facilities at Cal and somehow inferior and not worth paying for. Those same people, many of whom are adults, try to convince impressionable 17 year olds that attending USC or Occidental over Cal is totally worth it.</p>
<p>But to answer your question, I am not at NYU Dubai. In fact, there is no NYU Dubai. NYU is in Abu Dhabi. I am not there either. I was done with college 13 years ago. I grew up and now work in the UAE.</p>
For some people it is. Berkeley is not manna from heaven. It is not well-suited for everyone. No school is.</p>
<p>To insinuate that someone would be foolish for selecting such excellent options as the Claremont colleges over Berkeley is more harmful than productive. (RML, I’m looking at you.)</p>
<p>The thing is, prestigious schools offer top-quality education. Berkeley is prestigious and offer top-notched academic quality. Pomona offers top-notched education but it’s not prestigious outside of California. Pomona is not also prestigious in the sight of top employers. The average salary of their graduates is significantly lower than that of Berkeley’s. So why would one pay the full pay of 50k/year at Pomona when their graduates don’t earn as much in the end? [Best</a> Schools in California By Salary Potential](<a href=“http://www.payscale.com/best-colleges/best-schools-in-california.asp]Best”>Best Colleges in California | Payscale)</p>
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<p>When it comes to academic prestige, there’s no such thing as apples and oranges. It’s not Berkeley’s fault that it’s a powerhouse in research and employs some of the best minds to educated their students. If Pomona wants to become prestigious, they should do the same.</p>
<p>You need to be specific which LAC you are talking about. If you were referring to Pomona, then I guess it’s not that worth it to go there for a full fee when you have an offer from Berkeley for the same price. Pomona can’t beat Berkeley. Berkeley has more prestige overall. Berkeley has more access to top employers. Berkeley grads earn more. Berkeley’s reputation travels across America and the globe. Such things can’t be said for Pomona. But if prestige isn’t an issue for you, then going to Pomona would just be fine. But to advise OOS students to rather go for Pomona than Berkeley because Pomona is a top-notched LAC and Berkeley is just a State U, is absolutely wrong advice. </p>
<p>If you’re talking about Amherst and Williams, then I guess that’s another story since their different locations give them distinct advantages over the other.</p>
<p>RML, it turns out that Pomona is much more affordable. They eliminated student loans a couple of years ago and now have some kind of grant system. On top of that, I don’t care what salary I make out of college as long as I enjoy my career. I really don’t want to talk about prestige with you. It isn’t important to me.</p>
<p>And thanks for reminding me, does anyone know how an education at Santa Clara U compares to one at Madison Wisconsin?</p>
<p>Like I said, if you can’t afford a Berkeley education (because you’re not that rich) and prestige isn’t that important to you, then Pomona wouldn’t be a bad alternative. I just don’t agree with some CC posters saying that Berkeley is just an alternative to Pomona. I can understand when people say that vs Stanford or Caltech. But Pomona? What is Pomona compared to Berkeley???</p>
The PayScale data suggests that the differences are mostly negligible, and any minor differences are easily explained by Berkeley’s engineering and business programs. </p>
<p>For engineering, I have posted before (as you well know) that Mudd graduates perform extremely favorably compared to their Berkeley counterparts. </p>
<p>I have always found it troubling that Berkeley and UCLA perform extremely poorly in awards production. Pomona has produced more Rhodes than UCLA, despite UCLA being more than 17 times Pomona’s size. You claim that the UCs are as prestigious as Pomona. You claim that the academics are superior. You claim that the students are as strong. </p>
<p>Why, then, has Berkeley has Berkeley produced a pathetic 4 Rhodes in the last 40 years? Why do math and science students at Pomona earn more Goldwater scholarships than those at Berkeley? </p>
<p>Answer: It’s because unlike the elite privates, Berkeley has extremely poor advising and support services. Why pay the same amount of money for less service? And you wonder why OOS students aren’t flocking to the UCs. :rolleyes:</p>
<p>In terms of billionaires per capita, by the way, USC outperforms both Berkeley and UCLA.</p>
<p>IBClass, the Mudd data are misleading. It’s not as detailed as Berkeley’s. Berkeley’s data isn’t that reliable either as salary data are incomplete. But at least, it’s more detailed. I would say that Berkeley engineers earn as much as Mudd’s engineers do. For example, the EECS grads of Berkeley earn just as much as Mudd grads do, if not even more so. </p>
<p>You’ll be “out of tune” when you’re discussing prestigious schools and you’re using Rhodes as you basis. </p>
<p>Berkeley is > USC. Not everyone is meant to be billionaires. </p>
<p>IBClass, there are issues that I don’t agree with sakky. But, Of course, you can’t argue with sakky on CC. You can’t win in an argument with him. That’s not to say I don’t respect his opinion. All I’m saying is his points of view aren’t always right. </p>
<p>second, I was contesting to the Berkeley vs Pomona argument. Why are you bringing up Mudd all of a sudden? Is Mudd Pomona? No. They’re different institutions.</p>