<p>Thx much for your inputs - sbjdorlo & molliebatmit.<br>
To molliebatmit - I have been reading your insightful CC posts for a while and truly enjoy them. To witness someone with such a strong tie to MIT years after graduation is a very solid statement to the MIT education! Thanks very much for your great service to all of us on CC.</p>
<p>Thank a lot molliebatmit, UMTYMP student and PiperXP!
I’m looking forward to hearing from pgbovine.</p>
<p>BTW, a friend told me that someone she met in a party told her that digital art program at MIT is very good. Do you have details about this program?</p>
<p>I’m not familiar with the digital arts program in particular but I would not surprised if it was very good. MIT is generally very good at the intersection of design, art, and technology. In addition to architecture, comparative media studies and the Media Lab (a super cool place in general too) both do excellent work in these areas. MIT is probably not a great place for more traditional visual arts like painting but for someone with interests in CS and visual arts is probably a good fit. My guess is that the work in the intersection of technology and art is also more valuable in terms of employment than painting as well.</p>
<p>(typing on iPad so please excuse sloppiness)</p>
<p>To angelakk - first off, congrats. At this point, flipping a coin to choose between Stanford and MIT CS will be fine! Both provide ample opportunities for research, programming, job training, intellectual rigor, connections, and social life. I would personally prefer MIT if u don’t mind weather since being in Boston is a wonderful cultural experience for college. At Stanford u need a car to get anywhere and SF is an hour away. It’s an isolated suburban campus without a car. But Boston is wonderful except for weather grossness</p>
<p>re: MIT vs Stanford 5-year CS masters
MITs masters requires a research-based thesis while Stanford is optional. Thus
- MIT students generally don’t pay for their 5th year since they are funded by research grants or TAing, but lots of Stanford students pay for 5th year. That’s a > $50k difference. Of course, some Stanford students still manage to join research labs to get their 5th year paid for, but it’s not as common.</p>
<p>Career paths for masters at both is similar: getting a job at a big company like google, continuing to PhD, going into finance/banking/consulting (MIT does more of that than Stanford due to proximity to NYC), or joining smaller startups (Stanford more than MIT but now more MIT startups too). Similar starting salaries I presume between two schools. </p>
<p>Re working in silicon valley. It’s very easy for MIT CS grads to get jobs in silicon valley, so no worries about that. The Stanford advantage is that you are literally THERE all year so it’s easier for serendipity to arise. U just meet more startup related folks. Immersion in silicon valley has benefits. But lots of MIT startups move out there, most notably Dropbox, founded by my MIT '05 classmate and my former student for a class I TAed during my masters year</p>
<p>Culturally if u feel more comfortable being around geekier types, MIT is heaven. If u want more exposure to non-tech people on campus, then Stanford probably better. But MIT is quite diverse nowadays</p>
<p>Good luck! Seriously you cant go wrong</p>
<p>(still on iPad so typing tough)</p>
<p>Also this is my personal bias, so take with a grain of salt. But I don’t see the benefit of a CS and management double major if u also want a masters too. U have to take wayyyy too many classes, and that time could be better spent on research projects, fun hobby projects with friends, volunteering, sports, socializing, etc. The benefit of taking Econ/management classes is for personal enrichment and also to meet more diverse set of people, but u can just take a few classes as electives without going all-out for a second major.</p>
<p>If I am evaluating job candidates, I’d take a CS major with interesting side projects and hobbies than a CS+management double major who just took more classes</p>
<p>Hi. I’m also looking at the 5 year program in course 6. The problem is I want to major in 6-7 and double major in management. Would it be better just to major in 6-3 and take more biology classes inorder to enroll in the program? What are the prospect for 6-7? I heard a lot of the student major in 6-7 go to grad school right after. On a side note can you tell me more about Senior House?</p>
<p>^ 6-7 is a new major. I don’t think it’s had any graduates yet.</p>
<p>Bumping for more questions! Come on, people, May 1 is coming soon – make us work for it!</p>
<p>Err so I started writing out a question, but then it sort of turned into a rant about MIT and Stanford. I’ll post it in its entirety because it might help someone else who’s in my shoes: someone else who’s trying fitfully to decide between MIT and Stanford.
I just got back this morning from Stanford's Admit Weekend, and I'm torn. I like CS, so Stanford and Silicon Valley has a huge draw for me-- just because I want to get work experience as early as possible, and the Silicon Valley area makes it disgustingly easy to get a job at a startup.</p>
<p>But I love MIT. I know without a doubt that I'll fit in better with the MIT student body. I just love the intensity of the students, and the quirkiness, and the IHTFP culture. Hacking. DTD's Goldfish party. CryoFAC and half-naked girl wearing only a pokeball bra and a cardboard box with suspenders. You'd never get crazy stuff like that at Stanford. MIT wins on just plain crazy fun.</p>
<p>Stanford kids are sun-worshippers. They relish in the warm glow of the sun, but once it goes down, they retreat back to their dorms. There's no nightlife. The Stanford campus dies after sunset, but MIT kids are busy working and playing away into the night. I like that about MIT.</p>
<p>I noticed something about CPW and Admit Weekend. With CPW, the entire campus mobilized to welcome us prefrosh. At Admit Weekend, it was like Stanford life didn't stop for ProFros. Life goes on: after saying hello and some icebreakers, the Stanford kids just left us to fend for ourselves. "Go find your way, little ProFros. You do your own thing. We'll help you if you ask us, but we're not going to hang out with you. You're on your own." </p>
<p>When I was at CPW, when I asked MIT kids what their most favorite thing about MIT was, and their least favorite thing. The overwhelming answers (I'd say >95% of kids said exactly the same thing) were
best about MIT: the students
worst about MIT: the weather
Stanford's definitely got a leg-up on the weather. I didn't get a chance to ask Stanford kids about their most/least fave things about Stanford, but I have a feeling that for fave thing, the California weather would be pretty high up there. (which is a shallow thing to base a decision off of.)</p>
<p>Some kids like Stanford's laid-back culture, but it slightly deters me. I've worked so hard throughout high school, and I don't want to stop. That's my mentality right now. But there's a little voice in the back of my head saying, "What if I go to Stanford, decompress, and destress?" And even worse: "What if I like being relaxed?" (gasp)</p>
<p>Stanford has less of a building-cool-stuff culture, which saddens me. They've got really nice facilities-- a welding lab, sand-casting lab, woodworking, and so many mills and lathes and machines to work on, but I have a feeling that kids just don't use them as much as MIT kids would.</p>
<p>I like MIT's whole counter-cultural feel. Stanford seems like a place full of normal, happy, friendly people. And it's nice. The current Stanford students who I met at Admit Weekend were so welcoming, genuinely nice people.
But not interesting. I'm going to meet so many more interesting people at MIT. If I were to go to MIT, my first choice would be Bexley, and second choice would be East Campus. They've got personality.</p>
<p>--
If I were to go to MIT, I would live in Bexley. I would have friends from East Campus, and I'd build cool stuff: a flamethrower, a motorized longboard, etc. I'd be surrounded by people just like me: people who are excited about engineering and CS. Unlike Stanford, the whole of the campus would be filled with kids just like me. I'd climb the Dome, help with hacking, and go urban exploring. Join rifle and become a skilled marksman. I'd work like a dog on PSETs with my crew of regular psetters in a dorm lounge someplace, and headbang at parties to destress. I'd join Dance Troupe and learn how to dance hip-hop for the first time. Take 2 of my classes through ESG (Experimental Study Group), because I really like the small classes there, and the intimacy and community of it. Hang with TDC and listen to electronic music. Become an honorary frat boy, even though I'm a girl. Cook my meals myself and gradually become full-on vegetarian. (There's grocery stores right nearby, Chinatown, the whole of Boston awaits. Stanford's its own little bubble; I can't cook for myself there because of the lack of grocery stores.) Play Patrol every Saturday night in Building 34, mortally wounding my friends with flimsy red rubber darts. There's no lack of interesting people here, but if I ever want a change of scenery/people, I can always meet other kids from Harvard, Wellesley, BU, etc. You can't do that at Stanford.</p>
<h2>If I were to go to Stanford, I'd never leave the house without a pair of sunglasses. I'd be one of the first to start a building culture at Stanford. I'd build a MIT-esque go-cart to ride around Stanford's sprawling campus. Whizz around campus on it. Go rock climbing. Join the Outdoors Club and go hiking and backpacking. Join one of Stanford's many, many dance groups. Probably Common Origins, the hip-hop dance group for all skill levels. Hang with the Product Design lab peeps, the artsy-fartsy people who like to make sleek, sexy products. (I'd like that. I love engineering, and I love art, too. Stanford's Product Design lab reminded me so much of MIT's Media Lab, which enraptured me the first time I visited it.) I'd live in Okada, the Asian-American dorm (just because Stanford freshmen live in basically randomly assigned freshman housing, which seems not-so-fun to me. The freshman dorms don't have personality, unlike Bexley or EC.) I'd get a job at a startup freshman year and get some work experience under my belt. I can always come back to NYC or Cambridge (I have roots in both areas/places to stay if I so choose) for a job, but that initial job experience I get with Silicon Valley and appeal of telling recruiters that "I'm a /CS/ major at /Stanford/" might kickstart my career and help me immensely.</h2>
<p>--
If I were to choose MIT, I'd feel like I'd be missing out on Silicon Valley, an opportunity to kick-start my job experience and career. I'd also be missing out on a chance to broaden my horizons and get exposed to the mysterious culture of the West Coast (ooh). I've lived on the East Coast all my life. Stanford is a chance to shake the foundations of what I think of as generally-accepted social tenets. It's a chance to be like "Whoa. I never would've thought of it /that/ way. I've lived my entire life thinking everyone just thought about it the same way I did-- because where I grew up, everyone /did/ think of it that way..." and my brain proceeds to liquefy.</p>
<h2>If I were to choose Stanford, I'd be missing out on the insanely awesome people who I'd meet at MIT. I'd miss out on the vision I conjured up 6 years ago when I first came to MIT as a middle-schooler attending Splash and I was like "Holymotherofgod MIT is frickin' awesome The people here are amazing I want to come here." I can't emphasize this enough: I've loved MIT for over half a decade. I'd miss out on miscellanous mischievous undertakings, especially hacking. (I didn't get a chance to take a Tangerine Tour at CPW. And now if I go to Stanford, I'LL NEVER GET TO CLIMB THE DOME. Sadfaces ): ) </h2>
<p>Given all that I've verbally-vomited here about my thought process between the two schools, I'm hoping for some guidance for which to pick.</p>
<p>At so many points during my Admit Weekend, I flip-flopped between MIT and Stanford. The first night I said to myself, "Hey. Stanford sucks. The people here are white and mainstream and athletic and you're none of that."
Then the second night I thought, "I'm definitely gonna come here. I can have the best of both worlds-- roots on the East Coast but going to school in Cali near Silicon Valley. Not to mention the weather. It's so sunny and warm. Their welding lab and sand-casting lab have great ventilation because they leave the doors and windows open because it's always so beautiful outside. MIT can't do that. The CS class that I sat in on had an amazing teacher (Schwarz) and the academic expo (thingy that Admit Weekend puts on for ProFros that's supposed to give you a "taste of Stanford academics," aka a non-legit class) about sociology was so surprisingly and utterly fascinating. I'd never have thought I'd care so much about a humanities discipline (sorry to break it to ya, English majors)."
And then at the closing event of Admit Weekend, the founder of Change.org spoke to us. It might've been the uncomfortable amount of food that I had just consumed at brunch and the post-meal drowsiness, but I started to stop listening. And while I was sitting there, way up high in the auditorium balcony, watching this Ben dude talk about his startup and how you have to go for what you love and your passion and blahblahblah-- suddenly I realized:
"Stanford's an awesome place and all, but my heart lies with MIT."
That phrase just popped into my head from god knows where. (I mean, how cliche is that?) But it felt real, man. It felt like a real realization, if that makes any sense.
And as I was leaving Stanford, I thought I was heading for MIT.</p>
<p>But on the flight home, I wavered and gravitated back to the draw of Silicon Valley, California weather, the outdoors and rock climbing, the relaxation and decompression, the chance to become someone completely different.</p>
<p>MIT fits who I am right now: it fits my personality, my interests. Stanford fits who I might want to become in the future.</p>
<h2>MIT is for me as I am. Stanford is for me to grow into.</h2>
<p>Who wins according to me?
Dorms: MIT
Food: MIT
Personality: MIT
Fun: MIT
Greek life/Frats (sororities in general ain't worth mentioning): MIT
Teachers: Stanford
Students: MIT
CS jobs/better for my career: Stanford
Networking: Stanford
Asian Community: Stanford (they have an Asian American Activities Center)
Friendliness: Stanford
Happiness of Students: Stanford
Grade Inflation (which can be a plus or a minus): Stanford
Feeling like I fit with the Student Body: MIT
Feeling Stressed (which I romanticize): MIT</p>
<h2>Feeling Accomplished after Graduating: MIT</h2>
<p>I just got back from Stanford's Admit Weekend this morning, and
<em>THREE DAYS TO DECIDE</em>
So yeah. Tips? Guidance? How did you decide: coin-flip, or something more substantial?</p>
<p>Also some questions:
1. How easy is it for MIT CS students to get software development jobs at companies as freshmen?
2. Does MIT have a welding lab? Sand-casting (pouring molten metal) lab? Are those labs open to students to come in and work on personal projects?
3. Stanford has that whole entrepreneurial, business-y culture to it. How easy is it to double major in management science and CS at MIT, and how easy would it be to do something similar at Stanford? (I say similar because I don't think Stanford has a management science major)
4. If I don't go to Stanford, am I giving up Silicon Valley? How easy is it to get a summer job in Silicon Valley as student enrolled at MIT? A post-graduation job?</p>
<p>Feel free to respond to only a specific portion of what I wrote; don't feel like you have to deepbreath-inhale-tellmeeverything-abouteverythingthatIsaid.</p><p>Just for the specific questions (because I think you’re doing a pretty good job working through the big issues on your own, long post notwithstanding :)):
- (I can’t really speak to this one specifically.)
- In addition to any access to machines that you can get through departments/classes/UROPs, there’s a [hobby</a> shop](<a href=“http://studentlife.mit.edu/hobbyshop]hobby”>Hobby Shop | Division of Student Life) that’s open to students exclusively for personal use.
- It’s easy to double in CS and management at MIT in the sense that the double is open to anybody, and you don’t need anyone’s approval to pursue it. It’s difficult in the sense that there aren’t many classes that overlap between the two majors, so completing the double requires taking more classes than would be required for a double in two more similar fields. But it’s a fairly popular double major combination.
- No, absolutely not. Did you see post #24 by pgbovine, above? (Phil did his bachelor’s and master’s degrees in EECS at MIT and his PhD at Stanford.) Most of my course 6 friends did summer internships in Silicon Valley, no problem. And, actually, now that everybody’s through grad school, most of them are out there working now.</p>
<p>pgbovine, Thanks so much for your info!
S actually wanted to use a random number generator to decide which school to attend, even Stanford, odd MIT. But, he changed his mind and decided to ask more people. He received a lot of help from current MIT students and his interviewer. He is still waiting for more replies.</p>
<p>Stanford’s CS would have the advantage of residing in the Silicon Valley and its strong and dynamic focus on interdisciplinary programs such as symbolic system. More freedom and time to explore - if for some reasons, S decides to convert to a non-STEM major, Stanford will support him better with more choices and stronger programs in humanities/arts. I wonder how likely someone would change his/her major in college. </p>
<p>However, S feels MIT students are smarter (and he has most friends there) - though someone said the number of people you know at a school should not be a reason to choose where to go. Is that really true? </p>
<p>Some people suggests that he goes to one for undergrad and another one for graduate school. However, firstly, he is not sure if he wants to go to PhD program, and secondly, if that is true, which one is a better choice for undergrad study?</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>Honestly, you shouldn’t be thinking that far ahead. Most CS majors don’t benefit from getting a PhD, anyway.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>I guess being in the heart of things is nice in Silicon Valley, but getting a job as a sumer intern or after graduation won’t be any harder from MIT. Most people don’t actually work at companies during the school year, from either MIT or Stanford.</p>
<p>Stanford is a more relaxed atmosphere, and students might have more time for experimenting with startups due to less requirements. You should check out the CS curriculum; in the past, CS majors at MIT took a significant amount of electrical engineering classes as part of its core. The core was Intro to Comp. sci, circuits and electronics, signals and systems, and computational structures. </p>
<p>It’s true that the Stanford environment is more conducive to the study of humanities, even though MIT has good classes too.</p>
<p>The media lab is a major advantage for MIT if son is interested in digital arts. It is unique about MIT. </p>
<p>MIT has smarter people overall, if you “integrate” over the student body, but Stanford CS especially will have its fair share of geniuses. Don’t worry about that.</p>
<p>Probably the best advice is to go with your gut, though.</p>
<p>Also the weather at MIT is not that bad so I’m surprised that it’s what most people said was the worst part about MIT. Stanford’s weather is obviously better but the weather at MIT is hardly bad.</p>
<p>a226263: I just randomly looked at this thread today. None of my children applied or went to MIT. I’ve had several friends whose kids went to MIT. Niece went to Stanford.</p>
<p>I was compelled to read your entry for some reason. I did not regret it. What a posting! Tremendously entertaining. I think you’re going to do great things in life, regardless.</p>
<p>Okay, so here’s the definite feeling I’m getting from your posting: you want to go to MIT. Somebody else is whispering Stanford in your ear. My opinion (for what its worth which aint much)? Go to MIT.</p>
<p>D is trying to decide between Caltech ChemE and MIT ChemE (maybe material science), both are excellent, can anyone give some insight about strength and weakness of both programs regarding to job market, pursuing Ph.D? She went to both CPW and Prefrosh events, had her own judgement about food and dorm.
yes, Caltech gives excellent finaid which is very attractive. MIT finaid officers are nice, but won’t be able be to match. Tonight is the night, she is going to click the decision button in last 20 minutes.</p>
<p>The graduate ChemE programs are ranked 1 and 2, so not much difference. I would go for the cheaper school. Or, does D know where she would like to work? If west coast, then CalTech, if east coast, then MIT. Easier to get internships/jobs the closer you are.</p>
<p>Academics aside (because they both are such really wonderful programs and she can’t go wrong), CalTech and MIT are VERY different in approach and feel. I think if she’s visited both, one or the other must definitely be drawing her. She should go with her instinct and heart.</p>
<p>
False. Plenty of MIT students do internships on the west coast, especially in course 6. Many wonderful west coast companies recruit on campus. Some companies will fly you out for interviews and the rest do Skype or phone interviews. Many companies will pay for your relocation for the summer. Being in Boston does not put you at a disadvantage.</p>
<p>Any advice/comments?</p>
<p>Thank you.</p>
<p>I’m currently a pure math major at MIT. I didn’t apply to Princeton because I didn’t the culture would fit me. MIT has considerably more math majors and really strong math students although Princeton is no slouch either. Both departments have excellent faculty and graduate programs. There is definitely a big cultural difference between the schools though that is probably more important than small differences between them in math. I think there are some cultural differences between the math departments as well. At MIT top math students usually start off in some upper division math class and transition reasonably quickly to graduate classes. At Princeton my impression is that the grad classes (most seem to be topics courses on pretty advanced stuff) are much less accessible to undergraduates. I’m not sure how much this matters though.</p>