@qqq123, You mentioned in your other thread that your parents can pay for you and your brother to attend $60k/year schools out of pocket without scrimping, so I’m not clear why you think you should get need based aid. I understand you think location should matter. But who do you think would pick up the cost of your education if your family got need based grants because your $400k income allows you to live in a high cost area? The government, which is funded by other taxpayers, provides the need based grants to people who qualify (according to FAFSA). So the ~$60k/year family who doesn’t qualify for need based grants (based on income) and also wouldn’t qualify for need based aid according to your formula (where location is taken into account) should help fund your education because your family’s $400k/year income allows you to live in a high cost of living area? Why is that?
@austinmshauri You can calm down now. What makes you think I’m aware of the complexities of FAFSA? I’m only aware of living costs and taxes in different parts of the country because I have family friends from all over the United States. That has very little to do with FAFSA.
You’re very amusing, @qqq123. Just people disagree with you doesn’t mean we’re hysterical.
You don’t need to be aware of the “complexities of FAFSA” to understand that if your parents can pay $120k/year without loans and without scrimping for 2 children to attend college, you don’t require need based aid.
@austinmshauri I was obviously just severely mistaken on the purpose of FAFSA… Since it’s fed. government funded, I just figured that I could get something based on my dad’s employment at the VA or other weird things like that. I knew it was for the needy but I also thought I could get benefits! I mean, the VA pays for its employees’ moving trucks and stuff when they relocate so I just kind of assumed. The last thing I want to be seen as is a spoiled kid that doesn’t understand the importance of money or lack of it…
The huge differences in cost of living and disposable income throughout the country are why I think Financial Aid/EFC calculations used by colleges should take into account geographical locality of the student’s parents, especially for schools that receive students from across the US.
@qqq123, You’re a teenager. Nobody expects you to know everything. It’s hard for adults to imagine what’s out of their realm of experience sometimes. I don’t think people are trying to pick on you. We understand not knowing how financial aid works. Many parents don’t either. I just wish you would try to understand why the colleges and gov’t agencies don’t take where you live into consideration. If they gave need based aid because families live in high cost areas or because they own rentals or have large savings they want to keep intact for retirement, they’re really subsidizing those choices. They can’t afford to do that. It’s actually more complex an issue than you realize. We don’t qualify for aid either, so I feel your pain. 
If you spend some time on the financial aid forum you’ll get a better idea why you got the reaction you did. There are kids whose parents are kicking them out as soon as they turn 18 (not even the end of the school year, but AS SOON as they turn 18), others whose parents may or may not pay for the schools they’ve been pushing the kids to apply to, and students whose parents did intend to pay but who suddenly lost their job as soon as the kid was ready to put in a deposit. You and your brother are really, really fortunate. I’m glad your school worked out for you.
The flip side is that the person living in a high COL area has more choices. The person living in a 2 million dollar house in an area where that’s the median price of a home can usually move two towns away and/or shed a bedroom and instantly have enough cash to pay for 2 or 3 years of college outright. The person living in a $250,000 home in an area where that’s the median doesn’t have that option.
The person with the 2 million dollar home can sell it at retirement and move to a less expensive area, taking the extra proceeds to live on. The person already living in an inexpensive area won’t have that extra money to live off of, so they’d better be saving a little extra.
Should be mentioned that FAFSA calculations take into account the state of residence. CSS schools usually take into account both state/local taxes and real estate taxes paid. So there is some (minor) relief for the high cost of living residents.
The upper end of Middle-Middle Class is a dual income couple, each earning a school teacher’s salary. You still qualify for some FA at a 65k school.
The lower end of Rich begins when you can manage fullpay 65k tuition AND save for retirement at the same time.
Upper-Middle Class is the grey area, in between, where you can “manage” fullpay 65k OR save for retirement.
Wealthy begins when 65k is a rounding error in your income.
@CCDD14, but even then there’s a huge amount of variability. I live in Florida, which has a huge income range. South Florida is practically a different state from North Florida, which is essentially Alabama but with more beaches.
Ah, yes… South Alabama.
Funny, I am not middle class for my county but if I move about 3 miles down the road, I am in the middle of middle class.
Middle class varies based on regions. Unfortunate, because colleges don’t take this into account. For example 100K income in Cleveland will be a lot more then a 100K income in San Francisco. The Economist had a great article about this in their recent print addition. New York, London, Boston, ect. all where its booming cost a LOT to live in.
^^ True! As @austinmshauri said, if the government did consider location they would basically be subsidizing the choice to live in the high cost areas via FA.
@oneexciteddude, Not everyone who lives in New York and Boston earns a 6 figure income. Why should colleges give their money to the children from high income families when there are plenty of children from low income families in those cities who need it more?
People with high incomes can always move to the neighborhoods where the low income families live and use the money they save on housing for college. They choose not to because the housing isn’t as nice, the areas aren’t as safe, and the schools aren’t as good as where they did choose to settle. They’re welcome to make that choice, but taxpayers shouldn’t have to subsidize it.
@austinmshauri what I’m saying is Middle Class varies on where you live. Colleges don’t take this into account though. In my opinion, it could be even harder to get into a top college when you have a Middle Class income than if you have a Working Class income. (This is all relative to location) In the end the Middle Class probably pays the most percentage of their paycheck to colleges. The Upper Class can afford college and can afford to pay without FA. The Working Class gets a good bit more of Financial Aid than the Middle Class does.
Hope this made sense.
@oneexciteddude, I understand your theory, but I think your assumption is wrong. Most low income students don’t get admitted to top colleges and most colleges don’t give hefty financial aid to low income students. The majority of low income families don’t get enough federal aid to make going away to school affordable either. The $5000 Pell grant + the $5500 student loan are less than half of what our in state publics cost. To get the full Pell, a family’s income has to be around $40k. That family isn’t going to be able to dredge up $10k/year per kid for college. A student from a middle income family has a much better chance of being able to go away to school.
Part of the problem is that middle income families want the $60k/year education that higher income families are buying. Most low income families aren’t able to buy that even with aid from the gov’t and school grants. The children of low income families go to community college or commute to a 4-year school. Middle income families tend not to want to use cc’s; they seem to want to give their kids the “full” college experience which, to them, means dorming. There’s nothing wrong with those choices. But at the end of the day if they can’t afford to write a check for whatever the going rate is, it’s not because their income is too high for them to get enough aid, it’s because they can’t afford it any more than low income families can.
well reasoned.
We didn’t look at $60k a year schools because we couldn’t afford them. We saved. We could afford our EFC when our oldest started school. We can afford the EFC now for each with 2 in school. No way will we be able to afford the EFC for one when the oldest graduates because that savings account will be depleted, so we shopped for affordable options. No way, no how should anybody be thinking “colleges” or “the government” should be covering a big chunk of the bill. As a society, we don’t like to be taxed, and most individual colleges don’t have the money. So, we’re left to seek out what we can afford. And if we’re middle class, or even extremely wealthy by county standards (over $55k for us), it might mean community college, regional state college, state flagship, or casting a wide net and hoping somebody comes through with merit.
I love the fin aid forum. There is a wealth of information here and the long-time posters are knowledgeable and practical. But I get pretty tired of the arguments that people are “screwed” for being middle class (because being low income is so much fun), that they were punished for saving (yep, expecting 5.6% of a contribution from savings is HUGE), and that they live frugally because they drive 10 year old cars and never take vacations. I wish I could remember the poster (one of the regulars) who explained so well how it wasn’t the choice of what to drive but what to live in that sucked away the income one could have saved for college. Man, that was genius.
No matter how much your parents have saved for you. If you are bright and are good in academics, you should go to whereever you get full ride. If you do not get a full ride than go to a reasonable good school that does not cost you too much. These days anyone can become doctor or engineer if they have money. The question is what value the degree would have. If that was the case than why would they be giving so many H1s. They will hire labor at a cheaper rates from outside countries. The fact is you need a degree as your family has good degrees. You will not be paid enough to cover your debt. The only option that is available to the current generation is minimise the debt. You can only afford job at lower cost if you have less debt and you would be able to compete with the other youngs form outside countries who can accept the job at lower salaries.
There was a story today on NPR, on Here and Now I think, about really poor kids at Columbia who skip meals or have their friends swipe them through. Hopefully someone will link to it.
But I don’t get how kids are going to Columbia but complain about having to miss diabetes medications and follow-up - aren’t they eligible for Medicaid?