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I have the feeling this is more of an attempt to bring the cost of a private school more in line with the cost of the local public schools, which is definitely the case around here. S’s scholarship brought the total COA for him to within speaking distance of the state u.</p>
<p>I wonder how much they’re paying for their D’s Cathollic high school, since the mom says that they want to pay LESS than that. I’m used to Catholic high schools costing about $11k - 17k per year…although I know that some cost less and some cost more. </p>
<p>I’m thinking that the amount that they want to pay is LESS than the cost of "going away’ to an instate public…which is often around $18k-30k per year.</p>
<p>Just an FYI…you are very fortunate that your daughter’s merit award added to your EFC totals the cost of attendance. MANY students find that there is a much higher family contribution than the EFC even with merit and/or need based aid. Getting a private university education for $20,000 a year would be considered a bargain by many.</p>
<p>^^</p>
<p>Thumper is sooo right. Since most schools don’t meet need, most people pay more than EFC.</p>
<p>And, if this is Allegheny, then that school only meets the need of 29% of students!! So they gap a LOT.</p>
<p>And…Collegeboard seems to no longer list the meaningless “average need met”…BUT…now it’s listing average NON-need based loans and avg need-based loans. I’m guess that the non-need loans are Plus loans that parents are using to cover gaps and EFCs.</p>
<p>$13,409 - Avg non-need-based loan</p>
<p>$4,500 - avg need-based loan</p>
<p>Here’s the way it often works: Need of $10K, merit award of $12K. When the merit award is reported to the Financial AId office, the aid award is withdrawn, because with the merit award, there is no more need.</p>
<p>The fact of the matter is that most merit awards are not that large. A lot of them are enticements and sweetners to get the students that the school most wants to come, and only the very top students that are on the very top of the wish list get the big awards. There are often just a handful of full tuition, maybe one or two full ride, and a dozen half tuition type awards at a selective school. So most awards are going to be in the amount of your need if you EFC puts your need in the $10K range.</p>
<p>Can you bargain? Yes, of course. I would not use the words “Bargain” or “negotiate” with the schools. For some reason, they hate those words. You can ask, appeal, give reason why the school should give more. One of mine did get his award increased when he called Admissions and said that a school was his first choice (which it was) but that he had gotten into instate Cornell and also had some more generous merit offers which was causing strife with his parents. He was asked to fax evidence and then was offered more. Not making it the best deal of the bunch, but sweetening the pot, and also an offer for DH and son to come check out the place on Accepted Student day, which came to another $800 in airline tickets paid by the school. We probably would have relented anyways, since he really wanted to go there, but that sealed the deal instantly. I have heard of kids getting additional merit money when a school higher in the pecking order, particularly a prestigious one has offered more money in fin aid or merit, and the student wants to go to the given school whose offer is not as generous. CMU, out and out, says they will deal in such cases. But we are talking Ivy or in that bracket schools, not schools that CMU feels are less selective. </p>
<p>Most of the time the kids I’ve known who have tried to get more, have not. Or they get some loan possibilities laid out for them. It has occasionally panned out, so it does not hurt to ask, but be aware that it is not easy to squeeze money out of these schools.</p>
<p>Unfair, though it is, financial aid is reduced by merit awards. Your need is not there anymore if an award erases it, so under most circumstances, you can’t double dip. Which means those who truly don’t need the money get a nice windfall whereas those who do need it don’t get more than the exact need amount, in many circumstances.</p>
<p>I want to add that I am very familiar with Allegheny, and believe that they do gap, because they are more focused in getting the students they most want, and use funds to try to entice them to the school rather than meeting more of total need. They can get some no need kids by sweetening the pot by $10k or so and they tend to be prety good pick in terms of test scores and grades too. They can get, say 10 kids who can pay the additional $40K in costs and are so happy to get that discount rather than paying out $50K for one kid who needs the full cost. That needy kid had better be hot stuff for the school to lay out that kind of money. It’s called enrollment management.</p>
<p>
With COA running in the $40K+ for most privates these days, it seems to me that only the top few % of earners “truly don’t need the money”, regardless of what they have computed our EFC’s to be. We got a “windfall” as it were, but I would not say that we didn’t “truly” need it, as S would be attending a cheaper state school otherwise. We needed it in order for him to attend the school he is at.</p>
<p>I know that some people resent that those with high EFCs can use Merit to reduce their EFCs, but people need to realize that schools are offering these scholarships to benefit themselves…these schools aren’t doing it out of the goodness of their hearts. They need these high stats kids on campus for a variety of reasons…and the number one reason is that it helps these schools’ rankings.</p>
<p>And for those who don’t have really high EFCs merit still helps them, too. It’s much easier for a school to “meet need” or come close to meeting need if they can throw in a merit scholarship.</p>
<p>I agree that the schools are using merit to lure the students they most want, and those who can more easily pay do fall into that category. I also realize that fairness has nothing to do with it. Colleges really don’t care if can meet your EFC or not. Your EFC is what is Expected whether you can meet it or not. If you can’t meet it, unless there is an outstanding reason to take your child, they are not going to give you a hand out. If there are some issues that have not been addressed on the aid applications that are on the list of considerations a college will make, there is ground for discussion, but that you can’t afford to pay it because your fixed expenses are too high is not grounds for more aid.</p>
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<p>I really hate to read things like this. For the vast majority of full-pay families, college costs hurt a lot, if they’re workable at all. Very few are truly wealthy. A little bit of merit money certainly isn’t “a windfall” when you’re trying to live an otherwise responsible life and you’re being quoted the full bubble price.</p>
<p>Thank you, MisterK. Well put.</p>
<p>The way it works is if your finances are such that you qualify for $5K in need, and get that amount as a merit award, you cannot get a financial aid award in that amount, and if you did, it would likely be withdrawn. your merit goes to your need first. But if you don’t have any need,what the heck to call that $5K other than a windfall in light of so many who get it in lieu of aid? The one less needy gets the money despite not showing demonstrated need for it.</p>
<p>The title of this thread is: What if we can PROVE we can’t really afford our EFC?</p>
<p>When dealing with most schools (especially those that don’t meet need), the simple answer is: Schools won’t care because they don’t have the money to give you.</p>
<p>There are millions of families that can “prove” that they can’t afford their EFCs. They have high mortgages, they have debt, they have extended family that they send money to, they have 4 car payments, they live in expensive areas, they have other kids in private K-12, etc, etc, etc.</p>
<p>Some people seem to think that schools really do have the money to give away, but you just have to show them that you need it. It’s just not true in most cases. A family can have a heartbreaking story, but many schools just don’t have another $10k per year ($40k total) to give that child to become affordable.</p>
<p>And, to most schools, EFC means NOTHING except to see if you qualify for federal aid. I can imagine that most schools look at the idea of EFC as a ridiculous acronym that suggests to families that they (the schools) are going to be giving these families the difference in cash. Schools are probably annoyed the the Fed gov’t has come up with this poorly-named idea that suggests to families that schools are expected to charge a “slliding scale” and fund the difference. </p>
<p>Look at it this way…your child could probably PROVE to you that she can’t afford to buy a certain highly desired car. But, that doesn’t mean that you can afford to give her the money so that she can do so.</p>
<p>Unless your child is applying to a school that guarantees to meet 100% of need, proving your need is useless. The schools, when putting together the packages give you what they can afford to give, with how much they want you and what the aid applications say your need is. Even the schools that meet 100% of need define that need themselves and are not interested in how you have other needs not in their definition. You have to be in a very unusual category in order for them to stretch their definition and that usually involves some catastrophe or medical issue. That your mortgage and taxes are too high and you have other debts does not enter into the picture at all.</p>
<p>Ah, I love Fridays. I worked very hard this week, and my employer just rewarded me with a windfall check!</p>