<p>I wasn't talking about you. I was talking about my friend</p>
<p>BTW, "Hispanic" is an ethnicity,not a race. Hispanics can be of any race. I know Hispanics who are of Asian, African, Native American or European descent or are of some combination of those races. This includes a friend whose ancestors were Chinese, but she grew up in a Spanish-speaking family in Panama.</p>
<p>Fujimoro, the former president of Peru, was of Japanese descent.</p>
<p>well i guess if you wanted to be really conniving then you could say they were mixed. But then you lose the right to complain about AA for the rest of your life.....</p>
<p>I'm surprised by the vehemence here. I know several people from Algeria and they are visually, and consider themselves black.</p>
<p>Then you are considered BLACK not African American.....</p>
<p>The point was that it's often more complicated than a definitive statement would seem.</p>
<p>lol, I'll define it, The US Government recognizes North African people as White. If you are black then you check off your skin color, not because you are African American, but because you are black.</p>
<p>Case closed..........</p>
<p>"lol, I'll define it, The US Government recognizes North African people as White. If you are black then you check off your skin color, not because you are African American, but because you are black.</p>
<p>Case closed.........."</p>
<p>Isn't it wonderful for everyone else that the forum has you to make pronouncements and end discussions?</p>
<p>Yea, I think it's wonderful. Why wouldn't the case be closed? I'm stupid please explain it to me. Why exactly would anyone need to keep posting on this forum if the question the OP asked was answered?</p>
<p>Riddle me this....</p>
<p>You do realize that you fill out all of this information when your child first enrolls in school in kindergarten (I would advise seeing your GC and looking at your child's permanent record). Your child has spent 12/13 years listed as on race then senior year decides to identify with another race just because you/they think it will give them a leg up in the college admissions process?</p>
<p>What is the bigger lesson that you are teaching your child especially when it comes to ethics, character and just being a stand up person? Remember character is who you are when no one is watching.</p>
<p>When you are having the friends or other family members over for dinner will
you feel comfortable or be forthcoming and say, "oh, we're having little eggbert check that s/he is african american on the college application?"</p>
<p>You be comfortable telling your friends at the supermarket or the other parents at the PTA meeting that your child is applying to college as an african american, where you have never mentioned that you were african american?</p>
<p>When your kid gets mail from the BLack student association asking him/her to be a member, or inviting him/her to live in the african american house,will you be ok with it?</p>
<p>Will your child be ok talking about and sharing hs/her experience as an african american student on campus or will the experience leave them on move in day?</p>
<p>zoosermom, </p>
<p>It's completely fine if those kids are Black Algerians. But they are not, they're great grandfather was French Algerian (who knows if he was black), so this kids probably do not have "visual" signs of blackness.</p>
<p>I think what everyone is trying to say is that if her kids have identified themselves as black their entire lives, then they should go ahead and check that box on their apps. But if they haven't (and it's most likely that they haven't), then they can't just go around changing their race so it will benefit them in the admissions game.</p>
<p>morally its wrong but my sister did something like that and got into an ivy </p>
<p>i say do it</p>
<p>fencersmother:
"I was wondering about racial groups that one sees on some of the college apps. Sometimes, they ask for heritage, and my childrens' French greatgrandfather was born in Algeria. Does/Can that make my children "African American?" Does anyone know the guidelines? Some of the apps actually say "Black African" or "Middle Eastern." How far back on the family tree can one go?"</p>
<p>collegekid100: "Is this a serious question? An Algerian ggfather making one African American? I think this thread may be insulting to our friends of color."</p>
<p>fencersmother: "NO! Please, I don't mean to insult anyone, and apologize if anyone was insulted by my question. I guess racial questions are off-limits. Again, my apologies for insulting anyone."</p>
<p>Fencersmom, apparently in this generation (after years and years of liberal brainwashing) you are no longer allowed even to ask polite questions. Nothing personal against your post, collegekid100, but in general today it blows my mind how overly sensitive everyone is to the point of there being almost a "Thought Police". I'm all for caution and respect, but when it gets to the point where there is constant finger pointing, accusations, and claims of insult or injury every time someone tries to speak freely, we are heading for a nightmarish dystopia.</p>
<p>Regarding the original question, if the great grandfather was of French descent and living in Algeria, than no he would not be considered African (at least in terms of the intention of the question). His race is Caucasian, and so your family is of that descent (and not of African descent). I also think that if you are from Africa, and came here recently or were not a descendant of slaves, then you are not really considered "African-American" (at least according to the usage of that term, particularly in the context of a college application). For example, recent immigrants from Africa are not really "African-American", they are (if they have become citizens) Americans of African descent. That is my understanding. Does anyone else have an opinion on this difference?</p>
<p>lilprettipaki: that's really too bad. i don't know how i'd react if i knew i got in not because i deserved it, but because i lied. how stupid and morally wrong is that?</p>
<p>I actually agree with spideygirl.</p>
<p>Many africans in america come from wealthy and upper-middle-class backgrounds, and were in no way discriminated against (although many weren't).</p>
<p>i also agree with spideygirl. I consider recent African immigrants or children of African immigrants black but not African American.</p>
<p>I think that fencersmother was trying to say that her childrens great-grandfather was a French Algerian being a white Algerian of French descent.</p>
<p>Anyway, it doesnt really matter since the vast majority of Algerians are Arabs or Berbers both are classified as Caucasians.</p>
<p>
[quote]
"one guy I know is 1/4 hispanic (looks like he is irish - red hair, pale face) and he put himself as hispanic just to better his chances, it did. "</p>
<p>Hispancis can be of any race. One of my former students was the daughter of immigrants from Cuba. Looked like the guy you described: bright red hair, pale skin, green eyes. She definitely was Hispanic, was fluent in Spanish (which was spoken in her home), and clearly identified with her Cuban heritage, and since graduating has been a national officer of a Hispanic professional association. You can't judge people's race by how they look unless you're in a country like Brazil which racially categorizes people strictly by how they look.</p>
<p>One can consider oneself Hispanic for things like the National Hispanic Scholarship program if one is 1/4 Hispanic.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Right but that doesnt mean a person who only has ¼ of Hispanic heritage should take advantage of the URM preference (Im afraid that this type of re-classification is fairly common).</p>
<p>Plus, I highly doubt that the URM preference for Hispanics was set up to help the historically advantaged white Hispanic upperclass (but in reality, this seems to be the practice).</p>
<p>This thread points out the ridiculousness of the term "African American." If African American MEANS Black, then SAY "Black." Africa is a continent, not a skin color.</p>
<p>Also, who says only Blacks can be African? Just because you are from NORTH Africa doesn't mean you are any less "African" than somebody from the more southern countries.</p>
<p>But the most ridiculous aspect of the term "African American" to denote race is that it also presumes the person is American. If you see a Black man and don't know who he is and where he's from, why would you presume he's African AMERICAN?</p>
<p>"Right – but that doesn’t mean a person who only has ¼ of Hispanic heritage should take advantage of the URM preference (I’m afraid that this type of “re-classification” is fairly common)."</p>
<p>Actually, the National Hispanic scholarship competition allows just that, and since I assume that's run by Hispanics, seems like they should be able to figure out what's appropriate.</p>
<p>There are many people who are only 1/4 of an ethnicity yet that ethnicity is what they consider their identity.</p>
<p>"Plus, I highly doubt that the URM preference for Hispanics was set up to help the historically advantaged white Hispanic upperclass "</p>
<p>It's true that there's a good chance that white Hispanics were in traditionally advantaged groups. However, that's not true of all. My student who was 100% Hispanic (immigrant parents from Cuba) and had red hair, green eyes, and white skin, also had parents who were not college educated, and operated a small laundry. She was completely funding her way through college, mainly with loans. She also was working 30 hours a week while carrying a full courseload and doing major work in an EC that was related to her major (and that she virtually had to participate in in order to be employable after graduation).</p>
<p>As an undergrad, she was very active in educating people about Hispanic cultures. After graduation, she served on a national committee for Hispanics in her profession.</p>
<p>Just because a Hispanic person is white doesn't mea</p>
<p>n that they are wealthy or are disconnected from Hispanics as a group. </p>
<p>"This thread points out the ridiculousness of the term "African American." If African American MEANS Black, then SAY "Black." Africa is a continent, not a skin color."</p>
<p>But African American doesn't mean that a person has to have black skin color. "African American" is a term used by the U.S. government's census bureau to refer to U.S. citizens whose ancestors were black and came from Africa. Just because a person had some black ancestors doesn't mean the person themselves has a lot of melanin in their skin or the kind of features that many associate with black Africans.</p>
<p>If one is using "African American" in a way that's not the official U.S. census designation, a person could be of black African heritage yet be from Canada, the Caribbean, Central America or South America. All are considered part of the Americas, and the black population in all of them is primarily descendants of enslaved black Africans.</p>
<p>"If you see a Black man and don't know who he is and where he's from, why would you presume he's African AMERICAN?"</p>
<p>If you saw that black man in the U.S., since there are relatively few African immigrants in this country, one would have a good chance of correctly assuming that he is African American by the census classification.</p>
<p>Now, if you saw the black man on a college campus like HPYS, you'd have a higher chance of being wrong if you assumed he was a U.S. citizen who was the descendant of black Africans who had been enslaved in the U.S.</p>
<p>My son is 1/2 Chinese and 1/2 Mexican. We are involved in both sides of the family. Does this hurt his chances by being mixed?</p>