<p>Saintfan…that is so true. When they were expanding the Big 10 I heard more than one (educated) person say “well no not Rutgers…it’s private and isn’t it in the Ivy League”…funny, but you are so correct, Rutgers has more brand recognition than people in the east realize.</p>
<p>Many FL kids go happily to UF, espeially if they get into the Honors program. </p>
<p>You have to be careful if you’re considering using an out-of-state state school as a safety. </p>
<p>There are some situations in which it’s OK. For example, Penn State doesn’t discriminate against out-of-staters in admissions (they’re happy to take the extra money). If your stats indicate that Penn State would be an appropriate safety for you and you like the school, go for it. </p>
<p>On the other hand, NOBODY from out of state could consider the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill to be a safety. North Carolina has a strict limit on the percentage of students who can be admitted from out of state, and the competition for that small number of slots is tremendous. </p>
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<p>I’m assuming that “top” students can get accepted to competitive out of state universities/colleges (that are close matches to the students in-state flagship). The schools should also be financial safety, but they don’t have to be academic safeties.</p>
<p>In the southeast, I would list UGA, and GT in Georgia, and UF in Florida. Both states have low in-state tuition and state grants (like Florida’s bright futures). The Yields at UGA (48%) and UF(51%) are fairly high for a state flagship. GT is at 38%, but I think this reflects the large number of OOS students that apply (and then find it too expensive, even if they do get accepted, GT isn’t big on OOS scholarships). </p>
<p>It’s not uncommon for students in Florida to pass on Vanderbilt, Emory, etc. and go to UF due to cost concerns. </p>
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<p>Yes. To add another example, UT Austin is a safety for Texas students who meet the automatic admission threshold, are not trying to enter a major with an additional competitive admissions process, and can afford the costs, but should be considered a reach for non-automatic-admission applicants, including all out-of-state applicants.</p>
<p>So can we put together a list of schools that are always reaches for OOS students, even those with top stats? UNC–just Chapel Hill or any other UNCs? UVA and maybe William and Mary? UCB and UCLA? UT Austin, any other UTs?</p>
<p>Berkeley and UCLA are probably similar in selectivity for in-state and out-of-state students. Berkeley’s engineering and chemistry divisions are probably reach-for-everyone now, though probably not as far a reach as the most super-selective schools. Other divisions are probably at best high match.</p>
<p>The lack of financial aid coverage for the out-of-state additional tuition can put them out of reach financially for many out-of-state students.</p>
<p>ucbalumnus: quick question about Berkeley for Computer Science. OOS kid with excellent scores, 3.7-3.8 GPA, no outstanding ECs, wants Computer Science. Any chance, or should he just set fire to the $60 application fee and move on?</p>
<p>@Cardinal Fang I saw stats worse than that get in but I don’t know if they were out of state. Neither my sons, one of whose stats were better, nor the #4 in their class (very high SATS as well) at a high achieving magnet at a Title I California school got in, however. It isn’t a safety.</p>
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<p>For EECS, probably super-reach. For L&S (in which he can do a CS major after completing the prerequisites with a 3.0 GPA), it would probably be a reach, but possible. See the summary of this year’s results posted on these forums:
<a href=“Berkeley Frosh Class of 2018 decision summary - #5 by ucbalumnus - University of California - Berkeley - College Confidential Forums”>Berkeley Frosh Class of 2018 decision summary - #5 by ucbalumnus - University of California - Berkeley - College Confidential Forums;
<p>However, he should check the net price calculator to see if he can afford to attend before applying. UCs generally do not cover the $23,000 per year out-of-state additional tuition with financial aid. Getting a Regents’ or other merit scholarship that may cover that is even more of a reach for his stats than admission is.</p>
<p>So, reach if he applies to L&S, don’t bother to apply to EECS, then. </p>
<p>This same kid intends to apply to Stanford and Caltech. Sigh.</p>
<p>Stanford and Caltech would probably be super super reach for him.</p>
<p>Does he have safeties that he likes?</p>
<p>This is a kid from a upper middle class suburb on the East Coast. He’s the oldest child in the family so his parents don’t have prior experience with admissions, and seem to think colleges will be as dazzled by their son’s scores as they are. I’m suggesting schools like Santa Clara (as long as he is visiting Stanford and Berkeley), Harvey Mudd (as long as he is visiting Caltech), trying to encourage him to get interested in schools that he has a prayer of being admitted to. He visited and liked Lehigh, which should be at least a match/target if not better.</p>
<p>Be careful with Lehigh, as it considers “level of applicant’s interest”. He should be sure to regularly check the admissions portal if he applies there (see the Philadelphia Inquirer article on how Lehigh does admissions). But Lehigh may be advantageous for him in that it (unusually) considers test scores more important than GPA and rank.</p>
<p>He should read the thread about student in NJ with a 3.7 GPA who applied to Rutgers, Berkeley, and a bunch of super-selective schools, getting admitted only to Rutgers. Now the parent wants him to take a gap year, based on the apparent dislike for Rutgers among NJ residents, even though it is a perfectly fine school for a good student.
<a href=“Near shut out - Gap year or transfer? - Parents Forum - College Confidential Forums”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/parents-forum/1635875-near-shut-out-gap-year-or-transfer.html</a></p>
<p>For CS, here are some schools he may want to consider as low match or safety, and with list prices that are not super-high:</p>
<p>Rutgers (if NJ resident)
UMass - Amherst (if MA resident)
Stony Brook
Virginia Tech
North Carolina State
Minnesota
Iowa State
Cal Poly SLO
San Jose State</p>
<p>If small techy schools are desired, consider the “mines” schools in NM and SD, as they can probably be safeties with low cost.</p>
<p>If money is a big problem, there is also this list for potential safeties:
<a href=“Automatic Full Tuition / Full Ride Scholarships - #300 by BobWallace - Financial Aid and Scholarships - College Confidential Forums”>Automatic Full Tuition / Full Ride Scholarships - #300 by BobWallace - Financial Aid and Scholarships - College Confidential Forums;
<p>San Jose State? Really? I live in Silicon Valley and I don’t normally see San Jose State and Cal Poly thought of as about the same selectiveness. I can’t imagine a kid coming from the east coast to go to San Jose State unless they were a recruited athlete.</p>
<p>^Heh, my CS kid applied to Stanford and Caltech and MIT and got rejected from all of them, but he had great choices anyway. He didn’t apply to Berkeley, because while it’s a great school, it seemed pricey for out of state, the CS major was impacted (no guarantee of getting in), and there’s no housing guarantee for four years.</p>
<p>What I’m worrying about for this kid is that he is coming out here, from the East Coast, specifically to visit Stanford and Berkeley and Caltech. I’d rather see him spend his college-looking time looking at realistic alternatives. There are tons of schools that would love him, where he’d fit right in. There are many schools that would offer him merit money.</p>
<p>My nephew, 4.0/2250, was rejected by Berkeley CS despite being a legacy.</p>
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<p>CPSLO is actually quite selective, if the student and parents see their self-worth in terms of selectivity-based prestige of the college. However, it is not that well known outside the region.</p>
<p>SJSU is only moderately selective, but is significantly more selective for the CS major. Its location is great for recruiting and interviewing in Silicon Valley (the same reason that private SCU is sometimes attractive). However, its prestige level is relatively low, so if the student and parents are prestige-conscious enough to turn their noses up at Rutgers, Stony Brook, UMass - Amherst, etc., then they probably won’t be interested in SJSU for prestige reasons.</p>
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<p>Legacy is not considered in Berkeley admissions. Note that EECS is more selective than L&S at Berkeley (an L&S student can major in CS after getting a 3.0 GPA in the prerequisites).</p>
<p>Cal Poly, yes. San Jose State for a kid from the East, no. I think the parents have the ability to pay for Santa Clara, which would be better (other than money) and probably a low match for the kid.</p>