I’ve been trying to force myself to find the right major but it is so difficult when you can’t find an overlap between what you like, what is in demand/pays well, and what you can do professionally. I’m doomed to be undecided.
That being said, I want to find a very supportive college, something that will do well in a practical sense. I don’t want big names, I want results. (High percent of students working post-college, good college counselors, internships and working opportunities, amazing professors.)
Every time I try to look for these kinds of colleges they end up having a huge deal breaker. (High assault/rape, too far from New York, is a party-school, is impossible to get into, etc.)
First, try to keep an open mind. There is absolutely nothing wrong with being undecided. College will help you uncover what you are truly interested in.
How close to New York do you have to be? I’m assuming you mean NYC. An hour? Three? It’s a big world.
Take a look at Manhattan College. Small, near the city, results that far outshine its modest admissions stats.
Many students start university undecided wrt major, and those who do start with a major more often than not change their major. Many students change their major more than once. At this point I wouldn’t worry about not knowing what you want to major in.
Regarding which schools to look at: This is going to depend upon a long list of criteria which you haven’t told us. What is your GPA and what are your test scores? What can you afford? Do you prefer small schools (such as LACs)? How far is too far from NYC? I am guessing from your post that STEM is not your area of focus, but is this correct?
GPA (unweighted): 4.08 GPA (weighted): 4.33
SAT: 1330
AP English: 5
AP US History: 5
AP World History: 3
I don't have a preference for school size, but I hear small schools are better.
I can't afford much. I will probably get a lot of financial aid, though. (<$30,000)
I'll go as far as ~300 miles from New York City (as long as the school is great, I don't care.)
I am undecided but my favorite subjects are philosophy, political science, english, and history.
Maybe consider Rice University in Houston? I know it’s far, but Rice doesn’t ask you to declare a major until the end of sophomore year, and it would definitely be possible for you to double major in some of the subjects you’re interested in. In fact, we have a new minor called “Politics, Law, and Social Thought,” which combines philosophy, political science, history, and sociology (you take a few courses in each subject for the minor). I’m an English major at Rice, and I can tell you that all the professors I’ve had are pretty fantastic. As far as results, Rice has a Center for Career Development to help with internships and employment (and also has online platforms for opportunity-searching). We also have an Office of Academic Advising and I think really highly of the advisers there - I’ve gotten to know most of them and found them all really knowledgeable and helpful. It’s also a small school. The only thing, though, is that it’s fairly far from New York. I know that’s important to you, and if that factor is a deal-breaker than maybe consider Amherst or Carnegie Mellon? Those both seem like schools that could appeal to you as well.
Restricted/selective admission to a major will just about never be the case at a LAC or most private universities since typically, no one has to declare a major until the end of sophomore year.
Schools do vary a lot in what is required, for a major and for distribution requirements. At schools with dist reqs students typically take courses that satisfy those in the first year or so, trying out different subjects, then gradually hone in on one or two that interest them most.
CMU, NYU, USC, Penn, Cornell, Columbia are examples of private schools where some majors may require a secondary admission process. Even Harvard has at least one restricted major, visual environmental studies.
@ucbalumnus I’m aware. My kid looked at two of those and rejected them for precisely that reason, that she’d have to choose a “school” within the U to apply to. That’s why I wrote MOST private universities.
Clearly 6 doesn’t mean “most” is incorrect so what is your point, exactly?
re #9:
“My kid looked at two of those and rejected them for precisely that reason, that she’d have to choose a “school” within the U to apply to.”
I don’t get it. If she’s an LAC student then obviously she would apply to the arts & sciences college at those universities, since that college has all the majors a stand-alone LAC has.
Why did your daughter care that Penn also has a separate-admit nursing college, if she did not want to study nursing?
Or that Columbia has a separate admit applied/science/ engineering. college, when its arts & sciences college alone has all the typical arts & sciences majors? Or that Cornell also has a separate-admit college of hotel administration, if she does not plan on studying hotel administration?
I’ve read sometimes people have those issues with a separate engineering college, but that doesn’t apply here when one chooses to apply to, and attend, an LAC that doesn’t even offer engineering at all.
Clearly I am missing something. Please elaborate.
Re#8, by “secondary admission process” did you mean just a different primary admission process within the same university, as #9 would indicate? If so, there are a lot more than six such universities. OR did you mean that one had to apply for the major only after already attending the university for a while, and admission to the major was restrictive, ie certain standards had to be met to be admitted to the major? (Probably also not so uncommon). Because I assumed you meant the latter, but #8 assumes you meant the former.
“Secondary admission process” means that enrolled undeclared students at the school must apply to the major, which has admission criteria more selective than passing its prerequisites with C grades and/or 2.0 GPA. This may exist whether or not frosh applicants may be directly admitted to the major.
If frosh admission is such that some majors are more selective, it is very likely that students who enroll in the school outside of these majors but want to declare or change into them will face a selective secondary admission process.
Consider Northeastern. They have this AMAZING program for undecided students where you can explore a bunch of majors, get special academic advising, and get mentoring from students who went through the program. Plus, no major is off-limits. You can join the engineering or business school in addition to the arts and sciences after the explore program is done.
In the case of Columbia and CMU (both schools she visited and decided not to apply to), the A&S schools did NOT offer all the majors her LAC did. That was part of the reason she dropped them, though not the only reason.
She was on the fence between a couple of pure sciences, a possible pre-med track and wanted to try things. Two years later has happily declared a major in something she wasn’t even considering when she started. That major would have been outside the arts and sciences college at those two schools.
This one made the final three, even though she was accepted to the direct entry PharmD program (a major she thought she’d like throughout most of HS but even by May of senior year had decided against), she knew she could easily switch to any science or CS or math or whatever if she changed her mind as the first year or so was all math/science heavy pre-req stuff. No need to apply to transfer, just declare a change and go.
Columbia would have meant a transfer app and CMU would have meant an entire application to that very selective school with in the U. CMU even breaks things up to the point that she’d have been interested in 5 out of the 7 schools there. They have this application where you rank your choices of school…just too much for an undecided college senior.
For her, keeping as many options open as long as she needed to was critical. And it has worked out very well for her.
Ironically she doing paid research in her field at Columbia this summer. She may well go to grad school there.
Re#11, that’s what I thought you meant, thanks.
That has nothing to do with choosing a “school” within the university.
It has to do with being accepted to a major at the school.
Re #13, I’m still a little vague on the specifics.
But in terms of general guidance, in the cases I’m familiar with (admittedly not CMU), multi-college universities are, IMO, often better than many stand-alone liberal arts colleges for an undecided student
Because the arts & sciences colleges at the universities I’m familiar with offer more majors and fields of study than the stand-alone liberal arts colleges do. While at the same time, the presence of the specialty colleges provides offerings above and beyond what an arts & sciences college offers. And if a student gets interested in a specialty area outside of arts & sciences he/she may be able to pursue that interest without changing universities. Whereas at a standalone arts & sciences college without those specialty programs he/she would have to transfer out altogether.
also, re#11, I know of at least two liberal arts colleges that have so-called “secondary admissions processes” of this type for certain majors (specifically creative writing). I don’t think the practice is that unusual, actually, I agree that potentially impacted parties should investigate.
@monydad it’s true that Columbia isn’t as segmented as CMU with 7 schools, it has only the 2 and one has almost everything. But D was, at the time, more interested in SEAS which had somewhat fewer CU Core requirements. So would have had to switch to The College if she wanted to do a science or straight math.
Amherst has fewer majors than Columbia (35 vs 85 more or less). If an important criteria for an undecided student is the # of specific majors then CU might be a better fit.
But in addition to number of possible majors offered, I think an undecided student should look for a school with strong advising. Amherst requires a meeting with an adviser and a sign-off on the schedule every semester. That helps keep a student on track to finish in four years with the major they want. If I can say anything about Columbia, it’s that it isn’t known for its advising and guidance at the undergrad level.
So IMO there’s more than the # of classes and the difficulty of switching to consider.