<p>One of my professors said what it was in class and I don't believe it.</p>
<p>could you share it?</p>
<p>I heard from advisors that it's 2.9-3.0. (2002)</p>
<p>She said it was a 2.7</p>
<p>Consider that most classes are curved to a B-...it doesn't seem that far off-base.</p>
<p>Know someone who got accepted with a 3.6, but quick to mention they applied to their engineering school.</p>
<p>Not high school GPA, college GPA. The engineering school is actually like 10 times smarter than the LSA school. Trust me, I know this from experience.</p>
<p>The way the student at my school, who actually decided not to attend University of Michigan-Ann Arbor and went to Michigan State University instead.... made it seem like UofM-Ann Arbor engineering school was a little easier to get into, maybe it was suppose to be the opposite.</p>
<p>"The engineering school is actually like 10 times smarter than the LSA school."</p>
<p>rkbgt, do you have evidence to support this? Not all Engineering students are smarter than LSA students and the same can be said the other way around. I agree that the CoE deserves to ranked within top 10 in the nation and is indeed full of bright students, but to say that Engineering students are 10x smarter than LSA students is purely exaggerated. LSA students are at least as qualified as Engin students.</p>
<p>
[quote]
made it seem like UofM-Ann Arbor engineering school was a little easier to get into
[/quote]
The numbers speak for themselves: </p>
<p>Profiles of the engineering freshman - admitted class of 2007
median HS GPA: 3.9
median ACT: 30
median SAT (CR+M): 1,390</p>
<p>You may draw your own conclusions.</p>
<p>
[quote]
"The engineering school is actually like 10 times smarter than the LSA school."</p>
<p>rkbgt, do you have evidence to support this? Not all Engineering students are smarter than LSA students and the same can be said the other way around. I agree that the CoE deserves to ranked within top 10 in the nation and is indeed full of bright students, but to say that Engineering students are 10x smarter than LSA students is purely exaggerated. LSA students are at least as qualified as Engin students.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Engineering vs. liberal arts discussion with regard to their difficulty level, has been conducted on the engineering board ad nauseum. One thing you cannot dispute :</p>
<p>The bachelor of science in engineering degree is harder to obtain than a BA in Sociology/Psychology/History, provided that the person is a well rounded student.</p>
<p>LSA is much bigger than Engineering. There maybe lots of dumb undecided people in LSA to balance out the geniuses who are majoring in mathematics at LSA like me. :D</p>
<p>about 15% of LSA is Superstar students the rest are probably average and could be found across the nation at any top 40 school, however the majority of U of M Engineering probably 65% of UMich Engineering students are above and beyond so I'm going to have to agree with the above post that UMich engineering is far superior to LSA as a whole</p>
<p>Hey, I know lots of math people as I'm...technically...a math major, and while most of them are brilliant, stop bashing the people in the other fields. Maybe it's just the group of people I get to meet through classes and activities, but I've found that most people at U of M are good at whatever they do.</p>
<p>"about 15% of LSA is Superstar students the rest are probably average and could be found across the nation at any top 40 school, however the majority of U of M Engineering probably 65% of UMich Engineering students are above and beyond so I'm going to have to agree with the above post that UMich engineering is far superior to LSA as a whole"</p>
<p>Not sure how you found those numbers there.</p>
<p>People are smart at different things. There's no point in comparing a 4.0 philosophy student with a 4.0 engineering student. Maybe you can say engineering students, ON AVERAGE, tend to put in more hours for their work than their LSA counterparts, but that's about it. Even within LSA, you have things like math and science, which are not easy. I know engineers who themselves admit they would not be able to handle the abstract concepts of pure mathematics, especially the Honors concentration. And then there are pure math people who say they wouldn't be able to handle the actuarial sequence AND vice versa. People are just good at different things.</p>
<p>I'm in both honors math and honors physics. The classes consist of engineers and honors college LSA kids. All of the engineers I talked to got A's on their exams, yet all of the LSA kids I talked to got Bs or worse (the lowest grade in the class on the physics exam was actually an honors LSA kid). I'm assuming the honors college is the best of the LSA. The college of engineering is ten times smarter than LSA. You guys are only denying the truth.</p>
<p>
[quote]
I know engineers who themselves admit they would not be able to handle the abstract concepts of pure mathematics, especially the Honors concentration.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>No matter how good or bad you are at the honors sequence classes and their content, the worst grade you can possibly get is an A- or a B+. With the same understanding of the material that gets you an A- in such a class, you'd get in the C range in an engineering class. That makes a big difference - it makes math majors seem really smart, as they all have grades in the 3.5 range, while tons of engineers are in the 2.9-3.1 range.</p>
<p>haha, i've gotta jump in now. if you read anything, read the last several lines.</p>
<ol>
<li><p>math
most of the honors math kids will be in 285, 295, or 417 (sometimes 185). god forbid you're in a 155 or 256 ('honors applied calc', aka calculus for engineers, aka math dumbed down) class. if you are, i guarantee you won't find the best math students from lsa.</p></li>
<li><p>physics
the best physics students will be in 240/260 (E&M) or higher starting as freshman (as a very very very general statement. i know one guy who started w/ 160 then skipped the whole undergrad curriculum!!). 160 is for premeds or people who got 4's or lower on the ap exam. again, you won't find the best lsa physics students here.</p></li>
<li><p>general
furthermore, i'm an lsa honors freshman and i proctor the physics exams up till 260. when i start physics i'll be taking high undergrad or low grad courses. also keep in mind that in these lower-level classes (math185/155 and phys160), you get a lot of honors kids who don't intend to major in math/physics and are just taking it for the QR requirement or for fun (or worse, premeds who are doing prereqs). lastly, all honors really means in the beginning is that you take great books and live in south quad. honors only reallllllly means something your junior/senior years.</p></li>
</ol>
<p>if you really are in 155 and 160, you can't judge.</p>
<p>that's like a college-level USA soccer player going to a European kids' soccer team and saying "Europe sucks at soccer!! USA players are 10x better!!!"</p>
<p>but i'm also considering transferring to engin... oh well.</p>
<p>most people know that engin gives a very rigorous courseload and is hard to get great great grades in. however, there are lsa majors that are very difficult as well.</p>
<p>honors curves are designed with the intent to make a student do more work and get a higher grade (but think about it-- no matter what type of class you are in, if you do more work you'll probably get a higher grade). whether the intent => reality is another matter.</p>
<p>sorry about being kind of rude... i just think this discussion has turned into something bad. it doesn't really benefit anyone to argue about this, so i'm not going to (who's smarter? i don't care anymore). i also can't delete my above post. oh well.</p>
<p>"No matter how good or bad you are at the honors sequence classes and their content, the worst grade you can possibly get is an A- or a B+. With the same understanding of the material that gets you an A- in such a class, you'd get in the C range in an engineering class."</p>
<p>It must have been different in your years. For my year, even though the worst you could get in 295 was a B+ (assuming you did the homework), you were also told that you needed to drop the sequence if you got a B+ (and maybe you had to discuss things with him if you got an A-). We also had somebody that was falling behind on hw in 395/396 drop the class, and I think they may have been told by the professor that they needed to drop. So even though you're guaranteed a good grade, you still had to do enough work to demonstrate that you belonged in the class.</p>