Out of curiosity, how many folks here have a GPA methodology that is unique to their system/school? The one my kids are subject to here in NC, while completely wacky (but changing soon), is at least statewide. If nothing else it makes it easier for admissions to have some context.
Yeah, I realize it’s easy to calc a GPA (in simple form anyways), and was probably wasting pixels with that part of my post. And I also realize that you are probably not responsible for your kids’ H.S.'s GPA reporting policies.
It’s just maybe a pet peeve of mine that GPA is sometimes seen as the #1 sorting/selection criteria for highly selective colleges, and yet can be quite non-uniform across (and to some extent, within) H.S.'s.
Just one anecdote @BrewCrew82 from UGA, which we looked at for my daughter. But, I agree with you, I would find it unusual for a who state to go by the same rules. What about the privates? They all do it differently.
http://ugaadmissions.blogspot.com/2013/11/calculating-uga-gpa.html
@OHMom2 Your school is a rebel! I thought the numbers of schools that rank was shrinking fairly rapidly. Interesting.
A study hall, as I understand it, is a class period where kids are free to work on whatever. No class is taught, no grade is given.
My HS had them but I never used one. My kids don’t have them either so I’m no expert.
California (both the UC and CSU system) use a specific weighting system that is well-publicized and clearly understood to be part of the admissions process.
Interesting.
Also, yeah, the study hall thing. Really? Some schools are grading study hall?..and on top of that weighting it??
That’s my understanding of a study hall, yet @mathyone stated
How can that be?
@2muchquan - really just for scholarships/college apps. The rank isn’t made public, a student is privately told if they are 1st and 2nd for app purposes, but they don’t get publicly acknowledged or speak at graduation (there’s a selection process for that which any student can participate in). No one knows who they are unless they say, and in my D’s class, she doesn’t know who they were.
They do have a GPA decile table in the profile so colleges (and student) know where they are.
But the whole “I’m number 8 and Sally is number 7 and if I don’t take AP Euro she’ll beat me” thing is nonexistent.
I am in Florida. The university weighting system is published in my D’s HS curriculum guide.
This is what I could find quickly on the UF web site http://questions.ufl.edu/faq/how-will-uf-compute-my-high-school-gpa/
The calculation method along with weighting details were discussed in detail at a recent Open House I attended. I am sure I can find something with the exact weighting if I dig a little more.
I don’t think its an issue of grading study hall or considering it more rigorous. Most schools do not offer so many AP classes that a student could go through high school taking only AP classes. This means a student’s GPA is based on a mixture of AP classes which are weighted and non-AP classes, which are not. Taking a class like study hall instead of taking a non-AP class increases the ratio of AP to non-AP classes used to calculate one’s GPA. It doesn’t make a huge difference, but it does raise one’s GPA slightly.
@claremontmom, Let’s consider students X and Y. They attend a school where honors and AP classes are both weighted +1, not the only system, but a common one. X and Y are top students, so they both take honors level core classes. Let’s say that means 4 honors classes. They also both take 2 regular classes. Let’s say foreign language and an arts class. Student X additionally takes a second foreign language or other elective, whereas student Y takes a study hall. Being top students they are getting straight A’s. So, X’s GPA is (45+24+4)/7 while Y’s GPA is (45+24)/6. Notice that the extra bonus that student X is receiving for honors/AP rigor is being divided by the total number of credits earned. That’s the problem. So, earning more total credits dilutes the bonus for such courses. The school is saying that AP calc is easier for you if you take more credits so you deserve less extra credit for it, and harder for you if you take fewer credits so you deserve a bigger boost.
OK, so X’s GPA works out to 4.57 Y’s GPA is 4.66, a difference of 0.09. At our school, the GPA difference between valedictorian and not even making the top 10% of the class is a little over .20 GPA. Students who take a study hall rank about 5% higher than those who pursue arts or languages more seriously. In fact, I think it would be difficult to become valedictorian at our schools without taking study halls.
There are some schools which add the weighting bonus after calculating GPA, which makes the weighting for each class independent of how many credits are being earned. As it should be.
Right. Study hall isn’t graded. But it will not bring your GPA down. An A in an unweighted class can, if your GPA is above 4.0 Or a B in a weighted class.
Item C10 of the Common Data Set is “Percent of all degree-seeking, first-time, first-year (freshman) students who had high school class rank within each of the following ranges (report information for those students from whom you collected high school rank information).” There are entries for top tenth, top quarter, top half, bottom half, and bottom quarter. Schools like to have high percentages in the top tenth, even the top quarter, if need be. They tout these numbers in their own promotional literature. And GPA (which is item C11 on the CDS) is what determines class rank. So these aren’t things that are "ema
Unweighted class rankings produce a different cohort in the top tenth than weighted rankings. If a school ranks using unweighted GPA, it’s a disservice to the student taking harder classes who is gunning for highly selective colleges.
There is of course a way for high schools to dodge this: just don’t rank at all. Don’t weight the coursework. For high schools with a strong academic reputation, it’s the best way to make sure that strong students don’t suffer just because they attend a rigorous high school. Which is why Item C10 also notes “Percent of total first-time, first-year (freshmen) students who submitted high school class rank”. At Harvard, that number is 50%. Half of the freshman class comes from schools that don’t rank.
So why not just give up weighting (and ranking)? As others have said, scholarships and the admissions policies of different state universities. UTexas-Austin, for instance, has auto-admit if you’re in the top 7% of your high school class.
What high schools choose to do depends a great deal on what benefits most of the student body. A private nationally-known high school that sends most graduates to private highly selective colleges will choose differently than a public high school that’s a feeder to the state flagship.
Again, most of this is moot for those colleges that re-calculate GPA. It is also why many schools no longer rank or have valedictorians…or have more than 1(!).
LOL! @mathyone - I thought you meant it literally when you said they thought study hall was more rigorous. As in, they weighted it or something (which would be crazy!).
But they do. If you take a study hall they hand you free extra weight for your honors/AP classes. It’s right there in the formula. And they do this while saying with a straight face that their weighting system is designed to reward students for challenging themselves.
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I’ve heard this tune so many times! Let’s do the math. Our State University receives, approximately, 70,000 applications per year. It has 7 full-time admission officers. In addition, they hire, approximately, 70 readers (temps, $20/hour) with approximately 10-20 hours of training. It means, approximately, 10,000 applications per full time employee. each application is processed by 2 temps, thus 2000 applications per temp. 40 hours per week, 10 weeks. 12 minutes per application! 12 minutes per all application, including essays, GPAs, school profile, etc.
I think they colleges mainly looking at the rank (even if school is not ranking, rank is apparent if computer program compares different students from the same school).
@BrewCrew82 My son is taking five AP classes this year. They are quite difficult. He has a couple of B’s that he absolutely would not have if he were taking “easy” courses. In fact, he’s only had one other B his entire school career. So the purpose of the gpa bonus is to encourage students to take these difficult classes, knowing that it will be much more difficult to make an A.
I definitely agree that weighting schemes that hurt students with multiple art or music classes are poorly conceived. I also agree in general that study hall could be used to game the weighted GPA.
Occasionally, having a study hall can actually be connected to a more rigorous schedule, though: QMP took 2 classes per semester at the local university, during both junior and senior years of high school. These classes were distinctly post-AP. Given the high school schedule of available courses, the university time schedule, and the demands of the courses that were being taken, one year a study hall had to be thrown in to the mix at the high school.
The school did not weight grades, however.
Weighted GPAs in part help serve a real purpose in that schools love to publish in their glossy brochures the most recent stats of their new incoming freshman. (Note that the stats published may tend to mislead as these stats may reflect the larger pool of students with higher weighted GPAs who applied but had other choices and chose to go elsewhere v those who actually matriculated). So published stats including weighted GPAs help in part imply the school’s competiveness, sell the school’s potential to eager young minds and naïve parents, and in part justify their COAs.
Cynical point of view, probably. But schools are in the business of selling a product (ie educaton) and businesses tend to put the best spin possible when they market their product.