<p>Other than one in-state Flagship school, S2 will probably only apply to private colleges. The reason is that, with his good stats and need for financial aid, we believe he will receive the best aid packages at these schools. However, almost every time we read a review about a good private college we run into the same comments about a "rich, snobby, elitist, stuck-up" mindset of the student body. I realize that you have to take this with a grain of salt, but if in fact this is the predominant demeanor at a school I know S2 would not want to attend nor would he fit in.</p>
<p>So my question is do we ignore these comments altogether or are there going to be some cases where the cautions are warranted?</p>
<p>I think it can depend on the school, but you should keep in mind that what gets posted on CC reflects a very small slice of the overall population and also reflects people’s personal issues. What is “snobby and elitist” to some people might not feel the same way to others. The best thing to do is to really try to make up your own mind as much as possible. One tip is to observe what students are wearing when you’re on college visits. Is there a prevailing campus style or is it really mixed? If there’s a prevailing campus style, is it one your kid either already has adopted or you could see them adopting? Try to envision your child in the environment, mixing with the students you see around you. Yes, appearances is not everything and you don’t have to be a total conformist, but people tend to adhere to certain brands as a way of projecting a certain image to the world. So if you dress primarily in what you see at J. Crew, that’s projecting a certain image. If you don’t care about brands at all and just thrift shop and like assembling cool, eclectic things from all over, that’s projecting a certain image too. A kid that wears primarily death metal t-shirts may not want to go to a college where the kids are all in Lacoste. It’s not a perfect test, but considering how short college visits are, it can give you a quick and dirty means of general evaluation.</p>
<p>That was a real concern for my son when we made our college visits. When he did his final overnight visits to Yale and Columbia he determined that he “fit” and that the fact that we were middle class mid westerners was not going to be an issue. Now that he has finished his second year at Columbia, he notes that it has never been an issue. Your son will be the best judge of whether the school is a “fit” or not.</p>
<p>Using the clothes people wear to determine if they have money, and may or may not be snobby,elitist, could be the dumbest thing i’ve read in months…ridiculous</p>
<p>I don’t think the clothing comments were meant to identify what is or is not “snobby/elitist” but rather to help define “fit”. </p>
<p>The private schools will have their share of students from wealthy families. But as many also offer significant financial aid, they will have their share of students from non-wealthy families.</p>
<p>Visit the schools. Your son will get an idea of where he fits and where he doesn’t. My son applied to a number of schools and I knew after the visits which he liked better and which he didn’t.</p>
<p>I don’t think the suggestion was to determine if the students have money by their clothes. I believe it was to help a student determine if they might be comfortable there. If a kid wears an extreme style of dress and is very aware of what others wear then being the outlier may not be a good fit. If the student wears hoodies, t’s, and jeans, and really doesn’t care much about fashion, they will probably fit in on most campuses.</p>
<p>Maybe I’m wrong, but that’s what I understood.</p>
<p>As to the OPs question, because of the great fin-aid at elite schools you are going to find very little middle ground at the elite schools. You will find families that can afford sticker price, a few families in the middle that have borrowed money to send their kids to school, and kids who are offered fin-aid with great stats like your kid.</p>
<p>As for the attitudes, you are going to find those at the elite schools, but you are also going to find them at certain publics. There’s no way around it. Sadly, it’s a small number of obnoxious people who give that reputation, as well as a small number of people who are very offended by it and complain very loudly. Then there are the large majority of people who just enjoy their school. Your student will have to find the culture of each school as it relates to him personally by visiting as many as is reasonable.</p>
<p>Best of luck.</p>
<p>note: I crossed posts with VAMom2015…GMTA ;)</p>
<p>gdogpa: totally agree with your post (#5)…JCrew has t-shirts for $7.50 at their outlets…so much for wealthy and stuck-up…</p>
<p>I grew up with VERY little money for clothing yet always liked to “get dressed”…does that make me elite and snobby??</p>
<p>I’m all into “fit”, but to judge based on clothing is ridiculous…the same way judging anyone by their outward appearance without meeting/talking to them is…</p>
<p>I will grant you one concession; if you attend a HS where it’s ok to roll out of bed wearing ripped old dirty sweatpants/ PJ’s to school, you may want to reconsider a college where people actually get dressed in the morning (even if that “dress” is from Marshall’s or TJMaxx)…that makes sense…</p>
<p>I wouldn’t just ignore the prevailing culture of a school, your son will want to feel at home at his chosen institution and there are big differences in the personalities of these schools. As a middle-class family from northern California we found visiting the east coast and mid-west colleges to be very interesting, we hadn’t fully realized that there were such differences in the geographic regions. </p>
<p>Of course I’m generalizing, but the east coast felt more overtly conscious of status and academic pedigree. The midwestern privates were more welcoming overall, with a few exceptions, at least they were friendlier. The west coast schools were a mixed bag, but the prevailing feeling was more relaxed. Several of the most highly selective privates we visited seemed self-satisfied and somewhat pretentious, this was true of east coast, mid-west and west coast.</p>
<p>In the end, my S was accepted to schools all over the country and went to quite a few admitted students days. He decided against several schools because of the sense that the student body was too competitive and judgmental for his taste. Snobby and elitist exists, but not at every highly selective school. Be sure to visit, have your S spend the night and go to a few classes. Good luck with your search, you’re embarking on quite an adventure.</p>
<p>This is true, but everyone’s interpretation and tolerance for what they feel is snobby and elitist is different…largely based on where they feel comfortable. Visits are important whenever possible as you may rule out someone else’s version of snobby when it may be a perfect fit for you.</p>
<p>Maybe schools should post the family income of families whose children attend the school,lol…they post test scores,ethnicity,home states of students,etc…this way you will know for certain… ;)</p>
<p>^ No, not necessarily. I’ve known extremely wealthy families who were not the least bit pretentious, while I’ve met people who were exceptionally elitist whose bank account was quite middle class.</p>
<p>I think the “snobby and elitist” thing is very over rated. All of my sons have graduated college and not one of them felt that their respective schools were snobby, elitist or in any way difficult to navigate because they had less money than some other students. At MIT my son said there were people with more, and people with less, but no one ever knew who exactly they were or cared. My two son’s at Cornell said the same thing, yet they did feel what you are talking about when they visited Harvard and Princeton. My feeling is that once you attend a school you find people that are most like yourself or who at least are more like your core values, and once you have those people in your social circle you don’t really notice or care about the attitude of others. The other thing to think about is that once your son attends a particular school he is on equal ground with all other students and it is up to him to make his future and the career. Rich snobby or any other attitude should not be a determining factor for where your kid decides to attend. He will be very comfortable in any of the selective schools and will find his own group of people.</p>
<p>You must investigate each school. I do think that lower cost is a factor for many people choosing state schools, but not for all. </p>
<p>I think at schools with the highest sticker prices, there will always be some students who look down upon those with less $. This is perhaps unavoidable. This is a personal thing however, and not indicative of the general student at the school or the school itself. However, if you look at the common data set for schools that your son is interested in you can see the percentage of students who receive financial aid, and the average award. At many places, a large percentage receive aid, and the aid is substantial. These students will be in the same boat as your son, presumably. Some places even have data as to percentage of students receiving aid that is by income bracket.</p>
<p>I think there is a lot more that goes into what will make someone feel left out or within the mainstream of a college or university than their finances. Find out about the schools first hand, not just from reviews. Also, it is my personal belief that if you need substantial financial aid, even with great stats, you should take a great deal of care to see that your child’s safety school will be safe from the financial perspective, as well as academically.</p>
<p>Another issue you may want to consider is whether your son would have enough spending money to be able to join his classmates in social activities.</p>
<p>Students at big-city colleges tend to need more spending money because they like to do things in the city, which often cost more than campus activities. Your son may want to think about whether he would feel left out if he could not go with friends to off-campus events in a city environment.</p>
<p>Another thing that can increase costs is joining a fraternity. If the social scene at a particular campus is Greek-dominated, your son might feel left out if he could not afford to become a fraternity member.</p>
<p>My personal, highly subjective impression is that students are most likely to run into an elitist attitude (and lots of rich people) at private colleges that rank no higher than your state university. In my experience, families on tight budgets do not send their kids to colleges that rank no higher than State U but cost more than State U. Wealthier families sometimes do.</p>
<p>Two Ds at Harvard after graduating from a non-distinctive public HS in the rural South. D1 was initially concerned abut the snobby and elitist stereotype, but didn’t pick up on it at all when she visited. She went to Harvard five years ago, then D2 did two years later. Neither report it as a major or common aspect of the campus culture. On the contrary, they’ve both noted that going there with such highly accomplished peers is for 99% of students as humbling an experience as they’ll ever have.</p>
<p>Be careful not to assume that “snotty and elitist” are synonymous with wealthy. Also, think about people in general at 18. Aren’t they all a little full of themselves? As others have said, you have to go see a school to determine “fit”.</p>