<p>nicsagenius notes,“There is a major difference between those who get a tutor to do well on a test and those who lie about there position to gain admissions-”</p>
<p>Response: Maybe we should define “gaming the system.” To me, it is taking an advantage of unanticipated loopholes in a way that was not foreseen and/or not wanted by those that established the rules" in order to achieve an advantage not available or affordable to the average person.</p>
<p>Taking a two year study course for the SAT is certainly “gaming the system” in my mind. Transferring a parents wealth to “life insurance cash value” one day before they file their FASFA, which then shows no assets for FASFA purposes, is gaming the system, even though it is allowable. There will always be those that perceive inequitable treatment. Thus, they will look for ways around the normal rules. </p>
<p>The average kid certainly doesn’t have the ability or wherewithall to take a long-term ACT couching course. The average kid certainly doesn’t have the wherewithall to afford readers, and sadly, in some cases, writers of their essays. The average parent can’t afford college consulting in order to beef up the resume of their kids. The average parent can’t afford scholarship consulting whereby they can increase their chances for scholarships by “hiding assets in certain legal maneuvers.” The same can be said for many things.</p>
<p>Are these approaches wrong? Maybe. However , where there is inequity, folks will try to get around the rules.This has been going on for centuries, and I am sure it will continue.</p>
<p>The key problem is that if someone does try to “game the system” and gets caught, they may well be penalized. For example, asking for no aid when they apply for college can result in termination of their admission if they suddenly ask for aid. They certainly take a risk in not asking for aid at the onset of admission.</p>
<p>While a few wealthy schools may give a few aid this way, at most schools this would bite a gamer in the butt. I aked a Dir of Aid what they do at her 100% need met school and she said they would have to document a major change in circumstances between when they applied and the present. And because aid is based on the prior year, it would have to be disasterous.</p>
<p>When DS applied for college, I filled out a FAFSA and knew, based on our EFC, that we were not going to qualify for aid. So when he applied to colleges, when the Common App asked, “Will you need FA?” DS checked “no.” I did not expect him to qualify for his first 3 years. However, his 4th year, his younger sister will also be in college. At that point, even though our financial circumstances would not have changed much, I figured he would qualify for aid since we’d have 2 in college. So I called a couple of colleges and asked what it meant if we checked “no” on his application. I distinctly remember Colby telling me that DS would be unable to apply for any aid from Colby for the first 2 years of his enrollment, unless we had a substantial change in circumstances (layoff, death, medical issues, etc). So we were honestly able to put “no” on his apps, knowing that he didn’t need or expect aid until his 4th year.</p>
<p>DS will enter his 3rd year of college next year, and as I expected our FAFSA still gives us an EFC above his cost of attendance (but just barely!). So when DD applies to colleges next fall, we will be checking “Yes” on her apps, because the following year when they are both in school we WILL qualify for aid. I wish there were a way to indicate “Yes, for the first year only” on her apps, because after DS graduates I doubt we’ll qualify again. DH has suggested that we check “no” on her applications and just suck it up and borrow the money from a HELOC or something, because he thinks it will improve her chances of acceptance at her dream (slightly reach) school. But I say no, we can’t leave money on the table. If she qualifies, and I think she will for the first year, then we need to take the money.</p>
<p>So it would really irritate me if people lied on the application, said they didn’t need aid, then asked for it afterward and received it. To me that is almost as deceptive as altering a transcript or a rec, or lying about an EC. It’s one thing if your circumstances legitimately change after you apply, but otherwise there’s no excuse.</p>
<p>Well said, Lafalum, one has to to wonder where the integrity is among these kids. If beginning the college process in this way is an indication of things to come, they’re already in trouble!</p>
<p>Since requests for financial aid usually involve the federal government in some way, I wonder if freedom of information act requests could be used to determine the real extent of this sort of scam? An individual’s data would not be available but it should be possible to get some sort of summary as to how many “no aid” applicants requested, and got, aid.</p>
<p>It surely sounds like some enterprising attorney could make a buck with a class action lawsuit on behalf of honest kids who were tramautized and harmed emotionally by rejection/waitlisting due to the dishonesty of some admittees.</p>
<p>This would also be a good way to examine the possibly fradulant claims of “need blindness” on the part of many institutions.</p>
<p>Lafalum – You raise a question I’ve wondered about, too. S1 had to indicate the names/ages/schools of any siblings. Wouldn’t FA folks, in processing applications, realize that given a family’s EFC and # in college, FA may only be needed for one or two years? We will have two in college for two years, and I would hate to think that S2 may get turned down for having need when a) the amount of FA is not likely to be huge (from the school’s perspective, since S1’s school would presumably also have to fork out some FA $) and b) he would be essentially full-pay the other years?</p>
<p>True case: What about someone whose financial aid documents got lost in the mail and didn’t reach a college? Amazingly, the college later accepts the student without any aid, although the student needed quite a bit. So the student can either give up or try to reapply for aid, explaining the reason for not applying before. Will the reason be considered legitimate, esp. since the Guidance Counselor himself admits that it’s his fault?</p>
<p>P.s. The applicant is my friend and she is really nervous about it whole fracas. Please help!!!</p>
<p>I agree with you taxguy (#21) that other people should feel bad about gaming the system and never do it. Paying attention to the rules and finding ways to use them to your advantage is a terrible thing.</p>
<p>theGame, FAFSA is filed online. There are codes to enter for what college should get the info. Unless there were additional docs needed, there’s no need for anything to get “lost in the mail.” And even if there are papers lost in the mail, the college should still have received the FAFSA info electronically, so copies of the docs could just be re-sent.</p>
<p>Regardless of the reason, if the school is out of money, the student is out of luck. That is the chance a person takes when he applies for admissions without making the financial aid timelines. If a school has some money left or funds become available, such a student is in luck. Many of the need aware schools have specific policies addressing this issue so that kids do not pull this sort of thing.</p>
<p>Very rarely is it “kids pulling things” to get into colleges, and more often it is probably a change in circumstance/financial assets.</p>
<p>Anyway, kids re-fill out financial aid forms every year, so when you apply to a college you are technically only applying for financial aid your freshman year, anyway.</p>
<p>I think the student is not necessarily “trying something” but they are also not asking for FA based on a change in circumstances. I think they get the offer, realize the amount they have to come up with, and reconsider. If they had done their homework in the first place (meeting full need or not) they would be better prepared.</p>
<p>The OP was about people who applied without asking for any aid, thereby gaining a competitive advantage in these strapped times.</p>
<p>It is not about cases where the student tried to re-negotiate a request for aid. It is a case of misrepresentation of whether any aid was/is needed or not.</p>
<p>If a student claimed certain EC’s and that turned out to be false, they could be rescinded.</p>
<p>If you represented yourself as an URM and, in fact, were not, shouldn’t you be rescinded?</p>
<p>The bare and brutal fact is that a student with financial need is not as attractive to an adcom as one who does not need aid.</p>
<p>I have known parents who have felt very strongly that applying for financial aid is going to negatively impact their kids’ chances. They feel that just checking the little box on the app saying that you are applying for aid, is going to make a difference.</p>
<p>Most colleges are need blind. They also don’t meet full need except possibly through loans. The schools that I know that admit that they are need aware, go further than just looking at whether the little box was checked or not. THey look to see how much aid a student needs. How much the anticipation of financial aid factors into the decision at colleges is unknown, but every admissions person I have seen addressed with this question stresses that only the border line candidates (usually 5-10%) of the applicant pool are affected by needing aid. </p>
<p>How it actually works, I don’t know. I have some suspicions that it may count more heavily at those schools where fin aid and admissions are in the same office. But I don’t know if colleges separate their apps into “requesting aid”, and “not requesting aid”. Does anyone have any insights here?</p>
<p>What the hell is the “applying for aid” box for? If colleges want people to believe that they are really need-blind (and stop screwing with aid in this way), they shouldn’t put an indication of need right there on the application. The budget and admissions offices should be in different rooms. The FAFSA and all other paperwork is surely how need-aware schools really make their decisions, not just based on this little box.</p>
<p>No, it immediately links the acceptance to financial aid so that they can start putting together a package and update their budget. By having that box marked, FA starts your file, sends you info and reminders, looks for your FAFSA and PROFILE.</p>
<p>Erin’s Dad, most schools are need blind. Few schools meet 100% of need, and of those that do and come close, many are not need blind. But that is a small category of schools. The vast majority of over 2000 colleges in the US are need blind. They simply do not meet the need in most of their students. It’s the more select private schools that tend to be need aware.</p>
<p>I am in a similar situation and decided to read the article. The article talks about Midd, which says they will accept fin aid applications after acceptance. This is not true. I applied to Midd and got in, but I accidentally forgot to apply for fin aid (after 10 college applications, 40 scholarship applications, 40 hours of school, sports, extracurriculars, volunteering etc, it is easier to forget than you might think). I got admitted to Midd, but received no aid. My second choice, a similar school, will cost me 120k less because they gave me financial aid. I called Midd and asked for finaid, but they said the Feb 1 deadline is absolute, with no exceptions. This came from the director of fin aid, who got this straight from the president of the school. The article says they accept fin aid after acceptance and treat it the same way, but they are not with me. There are three logical possibilities. Either the article is old and recycled, the circumstances have changed in six days, or Midd is “playing the game.” Has anybody had success asking for aid ex post facto? Especially at Midd? I am 90% sure I am going to my second choice. Unless they contact me very shortly, I will commit to my second choice, because I simply cannot afford to be 120k in debt. At any rate, Midd’s “no exceptions” policy is vastly different than this article. This mixed message turns me away from the school.</p>