<p>Do any of you worry about providing too much for your children? Are you ever concerned that they won't really appreciate everything that you are giving them? Specifically, do you wonder if your kids would appreciate a college education more if they had to pay for it themselves, or if they had to pay for at least part of it?</p>
<p>I see a great number of incredibly generous parents on this forum who no doubt have only the best of intentions for their kids. But I sometimes wonder if we are doing kids a disservice by providing tuition, fees, room, board, cell phone, car, entertainment, travel, and gosh knows what else.</p>
<p>Fair disclosure: I paid for much of the above for my own two kids, but I now have second thoughts about having done so.</p>
<p>I know some parents who are struggling to provide a college education for their children, and it seems to me that their children could do substantially more to help pay for what is, after all, their own education.</p>
<p>Our son has always known how hard I work to provide for the family and has expressed his appreciation for the things that we provide. He has a part-time job and pays for his incidentals and rather enjoys the work that he does. He also picked a cheap state school even though he was offered a private education. He takes care of his studies and helps around the house when asked. He has a summer internship and is going to try a contracting job next week. I trust him enough with money that he has full access to our checking account.</p>
<p>There are kids that post here that do appreciate what their parents provide. I see the posts where kids are offered private school tuition by their parents but where the students question the wisdom of that and consider public schools to save their parents money.</p>
<p>Our daughter, on the other hand, is more entitled. I have to give speeches to her from time to time on how hard it is in the real world, about the privileges that she has that most others don’t, that she should be thinking about her future and a path to get there, etc. She’s getting pretty good grades (3.5) and doing enough work to keep me happy overall. In a world where people have a lot of things and experiences, it’s hard to feel happy if you don’t get what you think that others have. It is nice to be happy with what you have - it provides you with a lot of peace and maybe allows you to make better financial decisions.</p>
<p>There have been times when I’ve thought we are giving too much too easily. For DH an I, who grew up with very modest household incomes, handling issues as affluent parents is unchartered territory.</p>
<p>I have wondered if a small unsubsidized Stafford would be a good idea and if when we support unpaid internships a second, wage earning job should be in the mix.</p>
<p>So I’m not sure and will enjoy seeing what others parent’s here have to say.</p>
<p>I have a similar situation, and have many of the same questions. Our society is one of instant gratification. I remember what it was like to wait for something, I appreciated it more. I also knew that if I didn’t take care of it , it would not be replaced. I want more for my children than my parents wanted for me. Mostly I have tried to give them opportuniities to make choices. I also have more financially than my parent’s did , so it is easier for me. But I work very hard. Our kids expect more because that is what they are used to. My kids are really good people, but I am not sure they always appreciate everything either. You are very lucky that your son really does, he seems like he has his head on straight.</p>
<p>My parents wished they had more so that they could have done more. We do have more but expect our kids to be productive, too. The had summer jobs beginning at 14, and are expected to take the unsubsidized Stafford loans (we pay accruing interest while in school). We also let them know they will owe us our investment to date if they do not meet our expectation of continuing progression in good standing at their school. Upon graduation, the degree relieves them of debt to us but they still owe their loans.
In addition to school fees, we provide a family share cell phone, cost of rent plus amount of meal plan, books, transportation home 2x a year. New clothes come only as gifts for Christmas or birthdays. They are free to work or not during the school year, as they see fit and their needs require. So far we provided use of a car to only one, who it needed to travel to a paid co-op/internship.</p>
<p>When S had graduated and had not yet been hired, he earned his keep and some spending money with sweat equity chores.</p>
<p>I liked the feeling of taking care of myself. I hope my kids will get a sense of that satisfaction as well.</p>
<p>I did not come from an affluent background. I had to pay for almost everything, other than food, once I was over 18. Did I learn anything from it? Yes, I knew I didn’t want to be poor and have to worry about if I could learn a music instrument, travel, go to ballet, have a nice dinner out…I grew up worrying about money most of the time, and I don’t think I was a better person for it.</p>
<p>For my children, I want them to have opportunities without having to worry about if we could afford it. We pay for their private education from k-12 and college. We provide them with what we think are the basics - food, clothes, money for movies/dinners, cell phone, a car, vacations - they are what my husband and I have, and I don’t see any reason why they should have less. They have a set allowance to pay for their own stuff. At the same time, we do not have a cleaning lady or other hired helps to pick up after them (us). We clean our bathrooms, rooms, and do our own laundry. The girls are required to set the table and clean up after every meal. When we have parties, they are expected to stay to help out.</p>
<p>Our D1 is borrowing 10,000/year from us for her college education. I feel she needs to contribute to her very expensive tuition. She is also expected to work while in school and during breaks.</p>
<p>Both of our kids know that once they are out of college, all funds will be cut off. If they enjoy their current life style now then they better make sure they could support it themselves later. For our D1 it is a great incentive to go into a profession that could continue to support her life style. Our D2, it is not as big of deal with her. She would be happy with room full of books in a Victorian house.</p>
<p>Though we paid for tuition, room, board gladly, this was a break from normal operating procedure at our house. We paid minimally for any kind of travel/entertainment. We live in an unaffluent neighborhood. We did not pay for expensive camps, trips, etc. Our kids had jobs and covered their own books and incidental expenses. Didn’t have cell phones till much later than most of their friends; didn’t/don’t have cars, TVs, and little other electronic gear. We were generous with computers, sports equipment, and musical instruments. They had/have tiny bedrooms and used furniture. Their clothes were/are always discount.</p>
<p>They have always appreciated what we have done and what they have, and both feel, I think, that they are pretty fortunate. Both know how to make a dime cry. I’m not worried about entitlement with either.</p>
<p>I had to work a lot in high school and college, and I graduated with significant student loans. I was always envious of my many friends and colleagues who did not have these burdens.</p>
<p>While I was ringing a cash register at Costco, my future colleagues were traveling abroad.</p>
<p>While I was paying back student loans, my future colleagues were saving for a downpayment on a mortgage.</p>
<p>I feel like I missed out on quite a lot by working so much, and I wanted my kids not to have that burden. I also feel like I started my professional life one lap behind financially. </p>
<p>None of these things was fatal to me, of course. But I can’t help but note that my colleagues who had an easier road turned out to be financially responsible, decent people, and the advantages they had seemed not to have ruined them in any way.</p>
<p>I grew up a lot like Cindysphinx, and I agree with her observations. When I went to college, most of my classmates, including those who were on financial aid as I was, seemed to be kids whose parents really gave them a lot. They did not have the jobs I had held, and it seemed like their family incomes and spotlight were on them. It didn’t hurt most of them. In fact it was the kids who had more of a hardscrabble life that often did not make it through college. </p>
<p>Some of the most spoiled and indulged kids I know and knew have turned out just fine, even really well. I think that kids who are surrounded by the right messages and are rewarded for being successful tend to end up that way even if they are “spoiled”. However, there are some kids who do need more structure and giving them everything and anything can really be turning them into monsters. </p>
<p>We’ve been over indulgent even while we have been careful not to be.</p>
<p>We’re like Garland’s family, too. No electronic equipment in the bedrooms, got their furniture at yard sales, etc. We have set financial priorities in our house over the years and have talked about them with the guys. They are pretty low-maintenance themselves. Too much so, sometimes – DH and I have both worried that because the guys tend not to ask for much and have fairly simple tastes, they don’t have a lot of experience actually managing money. S1 is particularly spartan – if he doesn’t have the money, he goes without. Not a lot of “urge” to go work for it (except for his share of school expenses).</p>
<p>DH and I grew up working class and on the edge financially. Both of us put ourselves through UG through work, loans and scholarships – no family support.</p>
<p>While we are willing to pay for an excellent education, our kids have also known since middle school that they would be helping in this regard. S1 has unsub Staffords (and is paying accrued interest), busted his tail for merit $$ and works during the year/over the summer. He knows we could have pushed the flagship option a lot harder and is appreciative that he had his choice of schools. S2 will have the same expectation. </p>
<p>After graduation they are expected to be self-supporting and living independently. Grad school is on their dime. S1 expects he’ll be applying for funded PhD spots, and S2 expects to start working and take advantage of employer-sponsored benefits for further education a few years into his career.</p>
<p>I hope we are in the position to help with some start-up costs (i.e., IKEA furniture, car down payment), but would probably do something along the lines of “matching funds” to supplement their own savings efforts. (We have used this concept succesfully for many years with the guys. Sometimes we tell them we’ll match X% of what they save towards something; other times when they have saved a substantial chunk towards a goal, we’ll say, “OK, we’ll throw in $ to top off what you need to get/do this.”) </p>
<p>There is no “family” money coming our way, so whatever DH and I accumulate for retirement and college expenses will be through our own efforts.</p>
<p>You can usually tell when you are giving too much. When the cell phones get lost and things start getting taken for granted that should not be, is when many parents should start taking a long,hard look at the expectations that have been created. The problems are when there are expectations that should not be.</p>
<p>That is good to know. my kids know that we are pushovers if they want something educationally, but do not tend to ask or expect expensive things. Like designer clothes etc… My older one tends to think money grows on trees and my younger does not. I don’t want them to be entitled, they don’t seem to be, but do not have a true appreciation for how lucky they are. This is not just a financial standpoint, but also a home standpoint. They come from an intact family, supportive home etc… Recently my daughter has mentioned some of the obstacles her classmates have had to overcome, broken homes. addictions etc… and I think she is getting a perspective. As they grow older I think they will realize, I sure did. also they know that we ask them to do well in school, and they have/do. Grad school is on them as we have paid private their whole lives.</p>
<p>to clarify, what I mean by broken homes is abusive situations where kids have to become emancipated minors etc… I am not implying that divorce should be considered an awful home environment or anything like that.</p>
<p>I don’t think that kids will really appreciate how much you’ve done for them until they try to provide the same to THEIR kids. “How did Mom and Dad ever get us through college without debt, when we find it so difficult?”</p>
<p>My daughter is a freshman in college and I don’t pretend to have any answers. I know what is working for us right now on this issue. She earned a scholarship that pays 1/3-1/2 of her college, she took out about 1/3 in loans and I’m paying about 1/3. One thing that makes her very grateful for the fact that I’m paying quite a bit is she has several friends on 100% financial aid and a lot of that is loans. So she is very thankful that she doesn’t have that burden. Oh, one more thing I do that makes her appreciate the cost of her education, is that I transfer my portion into her checking account and make her write that big check at the start of each semester. That was a big epiphany for her at the start of her freshman year and she really understands the cost that way. She also worked for three summers so she learned to manage money and make money.</p>
<p>Or “Why did Mom and Dad do so little?”
I think there is “When is it too little.”</p>
<p>My parents weren’t exactly poor, they just made us believe we were a lot worse off than we really were. Everything we asked for, other than the most basic, was considered wasteful. After a while it was easier to ask for nothing.</p>
<p>My mother’s family came from a fair amount of money, my Dad not at all. I think much of one’s attitude about money is just a part of your personality. I never was much of a spender, one of my brother’s always spent every penny he was given, (for as long as I can remember and still does), my youngest brother is somewhere between us. My education was paid for by my parents and they expected to give me spending money in college as well, but I felt better about myself if I earned my owned fun money and worked ten hours a week most of the time I was in college. Having had my college education paid for, I expect to pay for my kids. This is helped because some of my mother’s money is still around to pay for my kids. We certainly haven’t saved it. I feel very blessed to be able to give my kids a debt free start on life, but I do expect them to pay for their fun money in college either by working part time during the school year or earning enough in the summer to cover expenses.</p>
<p>My D, only child, is a freshman in college. We have a sliding scale agreement as to % pay based on grade expectations. She does work on campus 10 hrs a week. She also plays private musical gigs for pay as they are available. We give her spending and book money at the start of each semester, but at end of each semester, we review grades and expenses- she pays her portion to us for the past semester. </p>
<p>I think she sometimes does feel a bit too entitled. We are working on this issue.</p>