When people don't vaccinate their kids

Parents Forum Parent Cafe
2781

Breastfeeding has many merits, but it isn’t workable for every family and it’s no substitute for vaccination.

I breastfed my two children for a combined total of nearly five years, but I worked from home, part-time, on a flexible schedule. If the only way I could have continued to breastfeed after the end of a maternity leave would have been to spend vast amounts of time pumping, my kids would have been on formula faster than you can say Similac. And the kids would have gotten the same shots regardless.

2782

Might be nice to regulate much more generous maternity leave policies ala most European countries. I agree, based on personal experience, that breastfeeding and working is a very challenging combination.

2783

If you don’t breastfeed, you’re not becoming a conduit to spread dangerous diseases like the anti-vaxxers are.

2784

First off, as a grandparent, I know I have no say-so. What I meant by worried for my grandchildren’s generation is that I am old enough to have met people who succumbed to polio in their childhood because there was no vaccine available to them. Will our grandchildren’s generation and their children fall victim to once preventable disease because of the anti-vaccine hysteria? The state of affairs today, where the mob mentality dictates the law of the land, makes me shudder to think of the backwards steps that could be taken in health care for our children’s and grandchildren’s future.

2785

Breastfeeding has alternatives. Vaccines do not.

There are many, many women who cannot breastfeed for biological and non-biological reasons. And then there are those who simply choose not to. While formula is not a perfect alternative, it is a damn good one especially for those of us who do not have fear that our water is poisoning our children.

The people waging campaigns against women breastfeeding in public are very high up on my crap list along with anti-vaxxers.

2786

How many of us (50 or 60 something) knew people with polio? I had a great uncle and great aunt who had had polio as kids, and had permanent limps as a result. So I was appropriately “scared” of polio. I’m afraid the new generation of mothers don’t have older relatives who were ever in iron lungs or had permanent issues from polio.

2787

How fast do you think anti-vaxers would get an ebola vaccine if there were an ebola outbreak in the U.S.?

2788

^ Very slowly since one doesn’t exist yet.

2789

I know. It was a rhetorical question. But if there were such a vaccine, think they sit it out?

2790

My question is why is it any business of yours? Get the hypothetical vaccine if you want. If it works, you’ll be safe.

2791

After all, if the anti-vaxxers are the plague of society, the idiots, the conspiracy theorists, let 'em all die off. Then you can have 100% vaccinated land to live in and no one will ever be sick again, since only unvaccinated people ever get sick.

2792

“After all, if the anti-vaxxers are the plague of society, the idiots, the conspiracy theorists, let 'em all die off. Then you can have 100% vaccinated land to live in and no one will ever be sick again, since only unvaccinated people ever get sick.”

Do they not have actual science classes at Wichita State, Albert69?

  1. No one said “only unvaccinated people get sick.” Vaccinations don’t work 100% so some vaccinated people will get sick. And of course many unvaccinated people won’t.

  2. Do you not get that some people cannot be vaccinated due to other health issues (such as being immunocompromised from chemotherapy), or have not yet been vaccinated (such as infants) and therefore when people don’t vaccinate and these diseases come back around, those people are at risk? Or do you simply not care?

  3. Do you not understand herd immunity – that if a population is highly vaccinated, the diseases don’t have a foothold, but as soon as freeloaders don’t vax, the disease can gain a foothold? Are you not aware that there have been outbreaks of diseases that were once considered all but eradicated because of the selfish acts of non-vaxers?

I’m done. We can’t have a discussion if you refuse to accept the basics of science. This is like arguing with someone whether the earth is flat.

2793

I have to say that post 2790 was incredibly ignorant. Really? You don’t realize that babies, cancer patients, and many others can’t be vaccinated. Vaccinations aren’t just about one person; they are about society as a whole and that is why it is my business.

2794

Ebola vaccines are in development and trials have progressed to phase III, human testing. They apparently are showing great promise.

http://www.who.int/mediacentre/news/releases/2015/effective-ebola-vaccine/en/

http://www.cdc.gov/vhf/ebola/strive/qa.html

2795

@albert69 you’re truly unbelievable. I can’t get vaccinated because of medical treatments for my RA and Lupus which suppress my immune system.

I have to rely on herd immunity. I don’t have a choice.

2796

(I mean, I’m not “liking” that you have to rely on herd immunity, but you know what I mean.)

Albert69, did the people who filled your head with lies regarding vaccinations seriously not tell you that some people can’t be vaxed - Romani being an example, people receiving chemotherapy another? If not, why do you trust them when they clearly don’t know what they are talking about?

2797

http://www.stopmandatoryvaccination.com/personal-choice/

There are too many reasons in here why vaccination should not be required blindly to quote them, so I will leave you to read the article. But here are a few highlights:

》》 Studies in New Zealand, Germany, and Hong Kong show evidence that unvaccinated children are actually healthier then vaccinated children, yet the United States refuses to do such studies. In September 2011, German researchers carried out a longitudinal study where they surveyed a total of 8000 unvaccinated children from the ages of 0-19 years old. The results showed that vaccinated children were up to five times more likely to suffer from a variety of diseases and disorders than unvaccinated children. According to Vaccine Choice Canada, a nationwide survey of 635 children showed that during the first five years of life, vaccinated children vs unvaccinated children showed at least twice as many incidents of antibiotic use, rheumatic complaints, loss of consciousness, convulsions/collapse, ear infections, febrile convulsions, inflammation, crying spells lasting more then 3 hours, and aggressive behavior that was remarkably higher in the vaccinated group.《《

》》 The polio we see now in 3rd world countries is vaccine induced polio virus. Yes, you heard me right, vaccine induced polio. In the US the oral polio vaccine was dropped because it was causing polio, however it is still used in developing countries. How criminal is that?《《

》》 Recently, you cannot turn on the TV without hearing about the current “Disneyland Measles” scare. Even though this outbreak was relatively small compared to the population as a whole, and no one died, the pharmaceutical companies have used it as a fear campaign to sell more vaccines: Merck’s sales increased by 24% in the few months after the outbreak. The ironic thing to me personally is that my family and I were actually at Disneyland on the exact dates the outbreak spread. None of us contracted the measles, nor was I afraid my children would, and here is why:

The onset of measles in an individual has been attributed to vitamin A deficiency and studies have shown that by boosting vitamin A you can reduce the occurrence of contracting measles, or once infected, supplement with vitamin A to help the body better fight the infection.《《

(There are links intermixed in the article citing the information.)

2798

More holes than Swiss cheese…

OK, what distinguishes the unvaccinated children of Germany, Hong Kong, and New Zealand from other children (in addition to the fact that they’re unvaccinated)? Well, I have no idea and it’s just weird that they combined 3 very different and very distant countries. Looks like “data mining”, where they’re cherry picking for the results that they want.

If it were US children, the unvaccinated children would be more likely to have white parents and to be wealthier. That is generally the anti-vax crowd and that, in and of itself, could lead to the better health outcomes you list. If they are anti-vax because they like everything au naturel, then those children are also more likely to have been breastfed, and breastfed longer. Again, that is a great health boost. Did this study correct for socioeconomic status, diet, breastfeeding, etc.? Those are the great health predictors.

As for vitamin A and measles, that’s just tin foil hat territory.

2799

Vitamin A? that thing is toxic in high doses. Pssst… One word for you all: forsythia. It cures every contagion out there. If the movie said so, it must be true. :wink:

So what that Merck’s sales went up following that outbreak? Better than sales of you-know-what going up after certain you-know-what-they-are events.

2800

I’m waiting to see how you rebut the polio claim.