<p>You said “no” the first time college application round and you should continue to say “no” to loans for yourself or loans for your D. I agree with Osprey that she needs to take ownership of her impulsive decision to leave the original college. Let her figure out what “next” and learn that you can’t always get what you want without sacrifice and hard work. I can’t even believe you are asking about loans for her.</p>
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<p>@Hanna - not to nitpick, but CC does cost something, as opposed to being free. So the discount would be less than 20%, but your point is still correct.</p>
<p>@lmkh70 - Despite the various points in the last paragraph of post #32, it is unrealistic to expect a full time 4 year school to work out given all your constraints. As @thumper1 said, why in the world would you be looking to saddle your D with huge debt when it has basically taken over your life? It might not be her (or your) ideal, but working part time while going to school part time seems the best solution. So it takes her 6-8 years to graduate. So what? It beats any of the alternatives mentioned so far.</p>
<p>OP - when did you buy your house? What’s your mortgage rate now? If the equity in your house is above 30% and your current mortgage rate is a lot higher than the current rate, you may want to refinance your mortgage and cash out. I would only do it if you are able to keep your monthly payment the same. Another word, because the current rate is a lot lower than the rate you are paying, you could afford a bigger loan, but the bank would only let you refinance 70%LTV. If you are able to do that then I would take the cash out to pay off your own student loans. It would give you more monthly cashflow.</p>
<p>Actually, it does make total sense to pay off the mortgage first. We already refinanced the student loans with direct loan. Problem is, we consolidated it in to married student consolidation. We were told we could still defer if need be. I qualified for deferment. My loans were the bigger one. But they could not be deferred because I qualified and he did not. We tried to get them split back out, but they would not do that. And NOW…I am not even listed on the student loans! No clue why. But Direct Loan seems to have some issues with accuracy on their paperwork. Doesn’t matter.</p>
<p>The house was paid off years ago. IF something were to happen to my husband, even a lay off, student loan payments can be at least forebeared. We do not lose our home over it. On the other hand, if we put our money in to paying off the student loans first, and something happened, it would be the mortgage we could not pay. The interest rate on the mortgage was higher than the student loans, so, it all works out. </p>
<p>I am not looking to saddle my daughter with a big huge debt. She knows the drawbacks, she is an adult. She has the right to make her own mistakes.</p>
<p>And on having 7 children while not 100% debt free, if everyone waits until they are 100% debt free, they will all have dead eggs before they can have children. And child #7 was a complete shock, in menopause, baby. Also, my husband took a 30% pay cut recently. AND…I really had no idea that not even our state schools gave financial aid. Nor did I know that our government was going to spend far more money on illegals than our own kids to go to college.</p>
<p>AND…the ONLY question I asked…was not SHOULD she take out these loans…it was HOW can she take out these loans. Because SHE is an adult, and I have spoken to her about the downfalls of these loans and she still wants to. And I happen to believe she is an adult, and I am not a helicopter mom who is going to stand over her and tell her what she will and will not do.</p>
<p>Oh, and one side small issue, that is not even worth mentioning, but might as well throw it in there. She had an additional college fund. Father-in-law, who was the CEO of a company set it up. However, FIL had a stroke a few years ago and MIL, who is not my husband’s biomom, has power of attorney. She has not handed over the college fund. There is no probate because he is disabled, not dead. And I doubt there is a legal right for her to claim a college fund that was not an irrevocable trust. Not that any of that matters, because I really thought that all these years of saving and doing without and making sure we had at least the EFC was good enough. </p>
<p>So I am not ignoring anyone’s advice. I just never asked what I should order my adult daughter to do. I am simply not a helicopter parent and since she is not talking about doing something deadly, it is not my place to prevent her from doing an adult thing that she wants to do. I am not paying for her to go this route, that decision was made long ago. However, she has the right to do what she can do on her own. This is the route she wants.</p>
<p>Interesting tidbit about the college fund - would your daughter consider writing a letter to her grandfather’s wife asking about the college fund? A letter from your daughter asking about the fund may go over better than a phone call or letter from you or your husband. (It worked for my kids). She can include information about all her achievements, GPA, extracurriculars; and her college and career plans - and that she wants to be responsible about the cost and understands that her grandfather put aside a college fund for her.</p>
<p>Grandfather’s wife does not want to give the money. She pays for stuff for her side of the family, the ones that are her own biofamily. But she always was hostile toward my husband and our kids. So, daughter says she would rather have her dignity than beg someone like that. Her choice. To be honest, THAT choice is one my husband and I agree with. I admit, I have had my moments of thinking she should just ask. But I know that woman. She is not a nice woman at all. When my husband was in college, father-in-law left it up to her to send the tuition checks, and she stopped. That is how he ended up with student loans. In my husband’s case, that was before the stroke obviously. I think he should have spoken to his father about that issue back then.</p>
<p>My daughter wants to go to this school really bad. She is working on additional scholarships, so in the end, she might not need additional loans. But, even on the UT Austin board, when she turned down Ut Austin over finances, a lot of people said they felt the education was worth the extra loans. At the time, we said no way. We had made a huge deal of no student loans. Our situation was different in that I paid 100% of college with student loans. And we had a child in the NICU so we took years off from paying when the interest rate was much higher. Her situation is different in that even with the additional loans, and it being more than 20 years later, she still will take out less than us and her interest rate is way lower. I was not aware of the consequences of loans when I went to college and I did not compare packages at various schools. I applied one place and went there. Married student consolidation made it worse. Also, married student consolidation is not available anymore, which is a good thing.</p>
<p>Lmkh70, you sure do seem to have a lot of bad luck. Nothing ever seems to go right for you. I hope that 2015 is the year this all turns around.</p>
<p>"She knows the drawbacks, she is an adult’ - There are probably some mature college freshman that would understand the long term impact of the loans. Perhaps your D is one of them. But turning 18 does not automatically endow our kids with wisdom… typically they are more focused on near term. </p>
<p>You wrote:</p>
<p>“Nor did I know that our government was going to spend far more money on illegals than our own kids to go to college.”</p>
<p>I just lost my interest in this thread.</p>
<p>Just a month ago, OP was worried that D was too immature to go to college. Now, suddenly same D (I’m assuming) is mature enough to take on several thousand dollars worth of loans to go to different college? I don’t get it. Sounds like same immature, very spoiled child who is not able to understand the long-term consequences of her decisions. And I’m still curious to find out if this D will be able to find loans without a parents’ co-signature. IMO, if parent’s co-sign for this child, they are super-enablers. </p>
<p>^^^</p>
<p>excellent point. The OP can’t have it both ways…too immature a short-time ago, now suddenly “an adult” who knows what she’s doing. Hello!!! She’s an 18 year old following her sex drive.</p>
<p>Not that my opinion matters, but this is what I think. The OP has a houseful of people, including a high-drama D. Deep down she wants that D out of the home so she’s rationalizing and down-playing the impact of those loans.</p>
<p>OP…be careful what you wish for. Those loans may get her out NOW, but those burdensome loans may bring her back home in her 20s when she can no longer afford rent and payments. </p>
<p>Anyway, this may all be for naught…who is going to loan this girl a bunch of money w/o co-signers? Or is the OP so desperate to get a bed empty at her home that she’ll fold and co-sign? </p>
<p>“she has the right to do what she can do on her own. This is the route she wants.”</p>
<p>Of course she has the right to do what she wants on her own. But she isn’t doing it on her own. You’re on the internet doing research to find out how to make it happen. Even if you don’t co-sign, just finding the path for her is encouraging and enabling the choice to take out significant loans. If you think, as I do, that that is an awful, short-sighted, teenage decision that’s going to cripple her in the long run, you shouldn’t be helping her do it.</p>
<p>I can’t stop an 18-year-old child from smoking, but I’ll be darned if I’ll help him find a place to buy cigarettes.</p>
<p>The OP doesn’t seem to have learned any lessons from her own college debt. She has been out of college for heaven knows how long. Her own college loans are not yet paid off. I can’t imagine why anyone would want to perpetuate debt generation after generation. </p>
<p>A better plan would be to teach the daughter how to live within her means. Or how to save for high costing expenditures. Or how to get a job. I could go on and on.</p>
<p>I’m sorry, but encouraging a kid to get loans to pay the full cost of college is not responsible financial planning…unless it’s the direct loan to pay the tuition at a community college. </p>
<p>Maybe posters on OP’s threads are enablers, myself included. We seem to be giving the same advice over and over again.</p>
<p>OP has a tough situation. I think it’s good she has a place to type out her thoughts. Maybe she will find value in our advise, maybe not. But I’m hoping she benefits by the opportunity to sort through it all. </p>
<p>@lmkh70 I looked through some of your other threads to try to reacquaint myself with the situation. As far as I can figure, your D took 6 APs either junior or senior year. You more or less forced her to give up playing the cello, something that she was devoted to, because she had an injury and an obnoxious orchestra conductor,and then you sold her instrument. She may or may not have been able to keepplaying long enough to go to all state orchestra. She seems to have been admitted to UT Austin, TAMU, Baylor, and presumably other schools, including the LAC she attended for a couple of weeks. Some university, probably one other than the three I’ve named, that at one point was her top choice, came through with enough money to make it as affordable, roughly, as the LAC. The school the BF attended may have been one of these, or yet another. Is all this correct?</p>
<p>Can she go to the other school that gave her money next semester, or reapply for next year? Are her stats good enough for her to be accepted at a true meets-need school, possible outside your area, that would actually give her the FA she needs to go to college without major debt?</p>
<p>OP has made a series of decisions along the way. Terrible about H’s father stroke and step-mother holding the purse strings tightly and perhaps against her H’s wishes on the college account.</p>
<p>Hindsight is 20-20, as having 100K in student debt paid down to 80 but at interest rate so much higher than if it was a house payment - but I do understand the fears with home paid off, and H drop in income. The loan warnings were not out there years ago - nor was the risk considered, and now people have experienced the consequences student loans and interest rates, and of the married loan consolidation (I just wonder how many married couples have divorced, as financial issues is named the #1 cause of divorce).</p>
<p>A lot of good intentions but decisions that are biting. Realizes they cannot sign for more student loans for kids - and to be fair to all, not do it for this youngest - and absolutely not in the position anyway to take on the debt. No need to feel bad about what is in the past other than move forward in a positive way - however how advising daughter should be against the debt and not trying to find sources for her to take out loans…</p>
<p>Sounds like mom is willing to make many personal sacrifices that may not be appreciated by this student.</p>
<p>From what has been said, I am not keen on this student taking any amount of loans. It is too burdensome and may create even more family tension. Not sure what all the education options are, what the least costly options are.</p>
<p>Most of us would not be happy never being able to retire due to debt, but maybe having the large family was a decision that makes the sacrifices bearable.</p>
<p>How likely is it your children will ever see daylight on the college fund set up by grandfather? If MIL dies first, may have better chance. Sounds like should not consider in decisions - if money comes through from it, obviously would be helpful.</p>
<p>I cannot fathom the financial and other stress you are feeling OP. Just be careful and helpful to daughter - I consider an adult under 25 that relies on me in any way to not be totally independent adult. Be careful not to enable bad financial decisions.</p>
<p>IF she somehow gets a private loan to start back, then next year, when she applies for more private money, she will show as $X already in debt. This will affect subsequent loans. I can’t see how this is a feasible idea. She will be in a pickle and it will again fall on Mom to sort. Many private loans also have a sooner payback start date- it’s not deferred, like student loans.</p>
<p>We all want things to be great. Wanting isn’t enough.</p>
<p>For the record, when D2 wanted to drop out of a good college and go to some local no-name near her S.O., we didn’t say “Fine, our EFC is $X and it’s yours.” We wanted her to learn a) the consequences, b) figure out how she’d pay for living, as well as school- and c) be fair to ourselves. And d) see reality for what it is.</p>
<p>You have 7 kids, challenges with some, a DH, debt- and I do not mean to be harsh, but this D is Demanding more from you than you have, emotionally, financially and in your time. </p>
<p>I wish there were a way for you to say, “Honey, my cup is already running over. I love you, but if this is your direction, despite our efforts, despite our advice, despite what we already did for you, you will have to make it happen yourself or find Plan B.” </p>
<p>Your family needs you and you need you. Try to get back to where you can breathe a bit better and not always be dealing with her upset apple carts. Reclaim what strength you can. We can try to support you in that. But we can’t wave a magic wand.</p>
<p>Either you take Parent PLUS loans or your daughter needs a cosigner. No one’s going to lend money to an 18 year old - they may be legal adults but they have ZERO understanding of what long-term debt means. In addition, with so much debt yourself, you can’t really be a co-signer since, as you said, you’d mortgage her siblings’ future and everyone’s home.
I know you more or less made your daughter attend this small college, believing that since an older sibling had done well there, she’d do well there too. But she had lots of bad luck - horrible roommate, then meth roommate, problems with parties, etc. Obviously the school was a poor fit so she left on time to keep her freshman status, right? So she’s still a freshman and can re-apply as a freshman.
Can she call the schools she was admitted to and see if her original financial aid offer is still on the table?
On that account, I totally agree she shouldn’t attend community college. She should work and set the money aside, taking continuing education classes (like CPR, etc., intro to a foreign language…) that don’t carry college credit, if she wants to keep learning stuff. But attending community college will mean merit scholarships for freshmen will no longer be availabe.
What are her stats (GPA, ACT/SAT scores)? We already know she is a talented musician and has 6 APs, meaning she’s a strong student.
You said your daughter was admitted to other colleges with scholarships - can she apply there again?
Can she apply to schools that meet 100% need?
Texas is stingy with State Aid and somehow replaced state grants with state loans :s at some point but she could try and apply to schools outside of Texas, if her test scores are high enough she could get an OOS tuition waiver. She sounds like she was a great student, so what about checking out University of Oklahoma (Honors), Ole Miss (Honors), Louisiana Tech (Honors), not to forget Loyola NO and Tulane, Rice (meets 100% need). There are some nice scholarships to be had at University of Minnesota-Twin Cities (sure, it’s far and cold, but I know some Texans who go there with discounted tuition and nice scholarships. Plus, the Twin Cities are great for music). What about Eckerd, Flagler, Millsaps? Good scholarships there, too. </p>
<p>BTW, the government isn’t interested in just ONE thing at a time, fortunately for us. They’re interested in untangling the total mess that is legal and illegal immigration in this country AND they’re trying to keep college costs in check as well as accountable for quality AND a bunch of other things. Governments are supreme multitaskers, that’s why they exist and are a defining feature of modern states. 
So don’t worry about that part.</p>