<p>When I started looking to apply to colleges I was pretty much in the dark. No real idea what I was doing. So I came across barnard one day online and it seemed like a school in my range that was in a great location not too far from home. I knew I wanted to go to a small school, which would probably place me at a liberal arts school, and Barnard fit the bill. I read a few things about it, saw some pictures online (and thought to myself, “wow, there are a lot of beautiful women there”), a figured I might want to apply. That is until I found out it was an all girls school. Now that wasn’t really a turn off, because the idea of being surrounded by thousands of women was something I’d dreamed of, but the ***** between my legs kinda made getting accepted difficult.</p>
<p>That is my barnard story. I thought it might be worth a laugh for someone. Don’t worry about me, I ended up at another good LAC, but this one had a few guys in it as well :-(</p>
<p>Actually, I feel kinda sorry for guys who can't go to Barnard and are left with having to go to CC in order to take advantage of the many of the great classes that Barnard has to offer... Not that CC is bad, mind you. Just not Barnard.</p>
<p>Micklerobe, my son attended a different LAC and dropped out after 2 years. When my daughter got accepted at Barnard and I started reading more about it, I realized that Barnard had all the things he had wanted in his LAC, but also had some additional features that would have been more to his liking. So the first thought that crossed my mind was.... "if only my son could have gone to Barnard!"</p>
<p>To say nothing of what the dads, who dropped their daughters off at Barnard and wished they could got to Barnard, thought. "We're old, we're male. We could help them with their diversity. That's the ticket. Barnard needs more geezers."</p>
<p>Sorry, but I always find it ridiculous when a prospective student tells me she doesn't want to apply because Barnard is all-women. If they would do a bit more research and talked to current students, they would realize that Barnard is only all-women in name. Barnard can be anything you want it to be -- an all-women's college or a co-ed college. But I can tell you that if you only want it to be an all-women's college, you're going to have a pretty hard time doing so. Columbia students are everywhere on campus -- they're in our classes, our dining halls, our student center, and our library. In fact, I think Barnard is the least "womanly" of the seven sisters. When you have 100% access to a co-ed, research university and to the most exciting city in the world, you can hardly feel as if you're going to an all-women's college. It's just not possible.</p>
<p>By the way, I have met plenty of Columbia students who wished they could've gone to Barnard instead. A smaller college means better personal attention and a better chance at choosing the courses that you want. Columbia students often feel stifled by the red tape and lost in the number system.</p>
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When you have 100% access to a co-ed, research university and to the most exciting city in the world, you can hardly feel as if you're going to an all-women's college. It's just not possible.
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<p>Which begs the question of why Barnard bothers maintaining itself as an all girls' school to begin with...</p>
<p>I didn't see anyone here asking that particular question. If you search these boards, I think you will find, though, many reasons why the students at Barnard love the fact that DOES exist as a liberal arts college for Women within the structure of Columbia University. Best of both worlds, quite literally, I believe, for many (at least for my daughter).</p>
<p>Churchmusicmom, my question relates to how Barnard can really market itself as an all girls' school while touting its extremely close relationship with Columbia. There are very few classes at Barnard into which Columbia students cannot cross register. Columbia students may live in Barnard housing. Columbia students eat at the Barnard dining hall. Columbia students use the Barnard library. Barnard does not merely "take advantage of Columbia's resources;" it is quite integrated with Columbia. It doesn't seem like anyone who would want to be at an all girls' school would want one that is effectively such in name only. Were its housing, dining, and classes at least somewhat more isolated from Columbia and female-exclusive, this designation would make sense, but it currently seems absurd that anyone who would want to be in an all girls' environment would come to Barnard, where boys (though not earning the same degree) are as pervasive as they are at Amherst or Swarthmore.</p>
<p>Columbia2007, the question you pose is an interesting one in that Barnard is far more integrated into Columbia than Smith is into Amherst or Bryn Mawr is into Haverford. The dorm life is certainly "all women" as are some of the larger classes that are duplicated on both sides of the street such as Biology and Chemistry. In my daughter's Biology class there were two men and 170 women. On the other hand there is a departments, math, where your choice of a Barnard or Columbia professor is dependent on which period you need to attend. For some smaller concentrations the class is given on only one side of Broadway: archetecture and theater at Barnard; less in-demand foreign languages at Columbia. I once accompnied my daughter to her classes, and the feeling was definitely that of going to a women's college with an occasional excursion to the coed college for a class without the inconvenience of a bus ride. I think the students at both schools live in a culture that is as advertized by the school: all women or coed. This culture is enriched by the presence of students from the other school at social events, religious events and sporting events. I was suprised at how the schools, especially Barnard, maintain a separate experience.</p>
<p>Well, I suppose it depends on the reasons why a student wants an all-female school. </p>
<p>I think there are a lot of students at Barnard and at other women's colleges like Smith or Wellesley who really want the top quality academic experience along with other benefits their respective colleges provide them, and it just happens that they found it in a college that only admits women. The women's colleges tend to be smaller than the Ivy League or equivalent colleges; they tend to integrate study of the arts well within study of other disciplines; they tend to be stastistically easier to get admitted to than co-ed colleges, so it makes a lot of sense to include them in a college list. Barnard's big draw may be the fact that the men are plentiful for any woman willing to walk across the street -- the only other college that I can think of that would be similar would be Scripps. </p>
<p>As a parent, I think my daughter would prefer a co-ed environment and would be perfectly happy if Barnard accepted men. But I think Barnard would have to work to define and maintain its distinctive nature before doing it. The Claremont Colleges are a good model of a partnership of undergraduate institutions that have managed to do that while at the same time some previously single-sex colleges (CMC and Pitzer) went co-ed.</p>
<p>But obviously that is not going to happen unless the Barnard administration wants it to. I have no clue what the vote would be if students were surveyed on their preferences, nor whether such a student survey has ever been done.</p>
<p>I am a parent of a student and have never attended myself, and would love to see/hear a student comment on this.</p>
<p>My own daughter would never have considered a typical all-women’s school environment. It just was not on her radar. She stumbled upon Barnard while attending a dance intensive at NYU during the summer before her senior year and loved it. The idea of attending a small women’s college was one she, at first, had a bit of trouble getting her head around I think. Both of her brothers attended large public colleges and her other primary school of choice was UMich…BIG difference!</p>
<p>However, as I understand it, Barnard's primary focus as a women's institution is experienced through attitudes and values, perhaps, more than through the absence or presence or men in classes (or dorms or whatever). One gets a definite sense that women are more encouraged as individuals to stretch themselves personally as well as intellectually in this environment. I don't know...maybe it's Doris... </p>
<p>Any current students out there want to comment???</p>
<p>On another note entirely, & maybe this is a dumb question, but.... I don't get the "Doris" reference, but I've seen it several places. Can you enlighten me?</p>
<p>Doris is actually the assistant director of the college activities office, I believe, and she leaves voice mail messages on the phones of the Barnard students that have become, apparently, legend. And she always begins them with the salutation (please forgive me if I get this wrong...I am relaying this second hand, but I do love it!) "Hello my strong, beautiful Barnard women!". The messages will be about acitivities and such, but the opening, I gather, is consistent. </p>
<p>And I think that attitude is prevalent at Barnard. You will see when you get the chance to visit your daughter. The sense of pride at being among the strong, beautiful Barnard women that have gone before you and will come after... All I can say is, I just sat down with my daughter who, this time last year would NEVER have considered any kind of a science major. She has finished "mapping" her four year course for a neuroscience degree (with a dance minor). And is so excited she can't stand to wait to take some of the courses ahead of her.</p>
<p>That is the effect of that school....at least on my kid.</p>
<p>churchmusicmom, I know exactly how your daughter feels. :) Barnard not only makes you want to learn, it makes you want to do EVERYTHING there is to do in this world. I know that when I first came to Barnard, I wanted to be an Econ major, like my brother, then end up at some white collar job after graduation, and hopefully be able to both pay off my student loans and drive a decent Mercedes by the time I was 30. Idealistic and unrealistic maybe, but that was my "dream". After spending two years at Barnard, I've completely disowned that dream and just want to focus on what I love and want to do for the sake of doing it and not for any financial reasons. I've considered every possible career path and have played with tons of different ideas as to what kind of life I want to lead. I have now narrowed it down to the Peace Corps after graduation, and beyond that, anything goes -- maybe law school, maybe not.</p>
<p>Barnard gives its students the confidence they need to go out and kick ass in a male-oriented world. It's not that we are constantly marching down Broadway burning bras or insulting men; it's more of an intangible force that manifests itself through how professors treat and guide us and how the school's values project themselves on to all aspects of campus life. There are tons of lectures and programs hosted by various departments during the academic year that focus on women's issues and how women can help. I especially like it when they bring alumnae to speak because that's how you can see Barnard women in action and kicking major butt in the world. </p>
<p>By integrating Barnard students with male students, Barnard is only helping to promote this perspective. I find the balance very healthy because I'm not constantly surrounded by women and because I can bring a different perspective into a conversation with a man. Perhaps this is why Barnard women are sometimes different than Columbia women. We are made more aware of issues concerning women and have instilled in us a sense of confidence and quality that lacks in a co-ed university.</p>
<p>By the way, Doris is a treasured figure on campus. :) "Hello, my strong, beautiful Barnard women!" She is just too adorable!</p>
<p>My daughter absolutely LOVES Doris as well.</p>
<p>Thanks for posting, Stillbits. Well said! Beautifully said, actually.</p>
<p>My daughter has actually "mapped out" her four year plan for her major and is so excited about some of her courses (that she will be taking in two or three years!) she can't stand still! We just feel so blessed that she is at Barnard.</p>